Wanted: Mars Colonists to Land there in 2023

The presence of hydrates in "C type" asteroids already tells us a good deal about the compounds we will find there. There are about 15 distinct types of asteroid which have been classified based on their spectroscopic signatures. I think you need to read up on that, because although we may know a good deal more about Mars, there is no good reason to assume that we don't know enough about the so-called asteroids for people to make intelligent decisions about where they will go and what they will seek.

Once again, asteroids don't present the problems which one would have with getting anything out of a.38 G gravity well. I think the initial capitalist exploitation of extraterrestrial bodies will be based almost entirely on cost/benefit analysis. They have to get some cash flow going before they take on anything as ambitious as attempting to mine Mars.

In either case, there will be the diplomatic brouhaha of who owns what, if anything, and who is entitled to exploit any extraterrestrial body.

I had to go visit a site that listed the upcoming and "needed" research on space bodies.

1 What we know about major BULK compositions for ALL classes of Asteroids is pretty much what weve gotten mostly from meteorite analyses. We know, for example that ALL classes of asteroids are made of large bodies of plagioclases, pyroxenes, olivine, forsterite,fayalite, and iron/nickel/Titanium. Weve known that for almost a half of a century.

2 The NASA/John Hopkins(Annual) Pub of needed research (done in 2013) clearly asked for detailed spectral analyses of these bodies to provide "assay level" analyses.

3"Hydrates" don't tell us much especially when derived from spectroscopy done through a water atmosphere and gathered by reflected light rich in H spectral lines.(Most hyprspectral information weve gotten on asteroids has been collected via a mathematical decrease in albedo).

4Im more jaded than you since my career has been always one step away from some "Zowy new method" that will allow us to do remote sensing and get a full grocery list of **** we see in space. IT AINT THAT EASY-no matter what wikepedia says.

Pallasitic asteroids yield up more information ("Many pallasites are class C) because these have a nice bed of silica in which are distributed the main cations. However, we have NO detailed assay information re the target and approximate extent of such things as reduzate Lithium or rare earths. (not to mention stuff like H3) A spectral analysis yielding "Hydrate" information tells us nothing of the assayable cations nor the isotopic signature of the H.

Whereas, on Mars, weve hd, for about 10 years getting laser sourced reflection spectra alost as a earth based map of whether the hydrates are Sodium /Lithium or the Sulfate salts are metallic or alkali.
The people that do the data reduction spend long times in honing their targets and going over and over their returns.

Dadooronronron
Dadooronron

I've visited quite a few sites about asteroids, and i see no reason from what you're posting to consider you expert on the subject. Your comment about being jaded and what Wikipedia has to say is just evidence of how much it pisses you off that anyone would contradict you. You've been the king of your little acadmic hill for far too long. I offered no "zowy" new methods.

The glaring absence in your response is your failure to address the practical matter of who is going to pay for such efforts and what they will be willing to pay for. Mining Mars would require an "up-front" investment orders of magnitude larger than efforts to exploit the asteroid belt.

As we are unlikely to agree on this, why don't you just keep your nasty mouth off me, and i won't comment on the drivel you post.

I said Im no espert on asteroids. I AM a daily user of hyperspectral imaging, various modes of spectroscopy and am pretty savvy of its limitations (from Raman to Mossbauer spectroscopy, emission, reflectance, source or absorptant--there are literally hundreds of types) and remote sensing.
My point was that we really don't yet know enough about the "assay" makeup of the vast majority of asteroids from which to develop missions to go and extract resources. WE DO know much about Mars nd its conditions and specific mineralization zones from years of orbital scanning.

It would be most stupid to plan a mission to bunch of asteroids for resource mining when, if we didn't know what wed find in bulk, WHAT TOOLS WOULD YOU EXPECT TO PACK?

You are the one who has a long track-record herein who regularly gets all defensive and insulting when someone seems to question your posts I see you are one step away from calling me an asshole when its really not that important to me whether you belive it or not. It aint really career advancing whether I argue about an obvious point over the internet. Youre in my court with your comments of "what we know" , I have a number of years training and experience in ore body chemistry to understand the literature about remote sensing of elements .
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Who will pay for these missions? Im hoping it becomes an obvious attractive "crowd sourcing" event for very entrepreneurs who, perhaps can puddle their overall needs for , say, lithium (be it in hydrate, reduzate, or primary deposits). (A vast series of deposits which have been confirmed to lie in dykes, along cones where cosmic rays have fissioned Carbon into lithium deposist, or in dry depressions where Li hydrats will form layers -"on MArs" and these possibilities are STILL not of assay level but are identified as to qhere and relative concentration per unit area). Assay space craft will have to be deployed to assess the volumetric and physical conditions involved so whenever a mission gets going, they have the correct tools (or else a big 3D printer so they can manufacture tools on the planet)

We know quite well that the moon will sooner rather than later, be revisited as the world begins to realize that H3 is a limited resource and the moon is a source of non nuke plant H3. The US is the Saudi Arabia of H3, but we may see China developing fusion poqer more quickly than we do so they will
1start a war with us to get our H3 via Mexico or

2Get it from the moon or the moons of Jupiter
I hope its number 2.
Who pays for that? I see a seris of moon missions happening in our lifetimes where the methods of intra solar system mining get ironed out as well as the means for crowd sourcing.

I close with a fact.MOST all of what we know about the geochemistry of asteroids has come from meteorite analyses. Wed do Raman and Rayleigh spectral analyses, using Transmission spec-- and Reflectance spec using Xray fluorescence for the metals. All this has given us a very thick literature of what a number of asteroids are probably made of in bulk (but not in detail). Plagioclases that define Pallasites can be Sodic through Calcic(each one defines a different temp and pressure gradient for emplacement and therefore a totally different mineral makeup)(and each plagioclase group will glom and hold different metals or ions that we are interested in).

I would NEVER advise a client to spend huge amounts of money on a mission to an asteroid without detailed levels of assay reports. The client would be playing craps. (He could luck out, true, bit Ill bet that the odds strongly favor a bust).

I found this blog post from CBC's science program, Quirks and Quarks from last year to be interesting. What appalled me about this conference is tta people seem to actually contemplate sending people to Mars without heavy shielding and without attempting to compensate for the microgravity. They should recruit terminally ill astronauts. What idiots--A major solar flare could hit the space craft with lethal dosages of radiation. The vessel might get there, but the crew would have died a horrible, painful death. EMP from a huge solar flare event could also easily wipe their electronics, leaving them without computers. What kind of idiots plan these things?

Any foundation collecting funds for a traveling to Mars is a fraud and is taking money from stupid people.

First things first: no human can survive in outer space for a long period of time.

At this moment, the limit is six months, and astronauts returned back to earth in such a miserable health condition that this limit of six months is gladly respected.

Until this problem of making a spaceship with a simulated earth's gravity to help astronauts to live "normally" while traveling, the whole idea of traveling to Mars is just a fantasy... not so a goal.

Foundations must concentrate in finding how to make astronauts to survive long travels in outer space, and only after this problem is solved, then it is time to select and give training to the candidates for such a traveling to Mars.

Right now, and again, these foundations are just a fraud. Beware!

As usual, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. With adequate shield from solar and cosmic radiation, and the mechanical mitigation of the effects of micro-gravity, humans could live indefinitely in "outer space." You shoot your mouth off all the time when you clearly don't have a clue. The means to shield humans and other biota, and to compensate for micro-gravity are actually simple. The problem is getting someone to pay for them. You're an idiot, and a big-mouthed, arrogant idiot at that.

So we may conclude from this assertion that your first hand knowledge is derived from your migration from Cepheus 2-RR?

[Img=http://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTpyjzM8G5lEoYAGh0IbW0OTm0K3J-fR13Rl1L56ibMvXuXNekls]CARLOS's MUTHA SHIP[/Img}
[Img=

Carlos mutha ship

"adequate shield from solar and cosmic radiation, and the mechanical mitigation of the effects of micro-gravity...

So simple, eh?

I'm from Missouri, you'll have to show me.

Your knowledge in science -real science, serious science- is "evolving" into the idiocy found in Albert Einstein with his superfluous time dilatation.

You just reminded me to... what was the name of this idiot?... ah... I have his name in the tip of my tongue... ah... oh, yes!... Kip Thorne.

Your words remind me the words of Kip Thorne about "building" a wormhole.

Yes, he also "showed with words" how simple is to build a wormhole in order to make true the wish of time traveling. According to him, we just need two Casimir plates located in space, and a spaceship traveling between them, and so and so.

He said that for building such a wormhole, we are going to need the mass found in hundreds of stars the size of our Sun.

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.....

Yup. So simple.

He even said that this is not a project for us but for future generations.

Your words are exactly the same as idiot Kip Thorne, talking imaginations without any physical progress leading to their manufacturing.

And again, first things first.

First, it is essential to find out how to imitate the gravity of earth in the spaceship. This is the first step to be overcome.

Or, to find drugs making humans capable to survive long periods of time, at least enough to survive a traveling to Mars.

The shield against radiation is the second priority.

But, without finding the way to survive long periods of time in outer space, every foundation selecting people to travel to Mars is a FRAUD.

Beware of these foundations, they are just making profit from the ignorant.

Setanta, if you have contributed in any of these foundations, you don't need to collect your money back, actually these kind of foundations are your main and only social club...

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha

Use the magnifier in your computer Pictures file.

Sadly, the picture shows the front of the spaceship, otherwise we should see its rear tag plate to find out whom that ship belongs to. (No front tag plates are mandatory in the Milky Way)

However, start to count the top windows from the right side of the ship of the picture of yours.

Compare the face of the person looking thru the window in that ship with the icon found in your box. Actually, you are there!

That ship is not mine... it's yours!

Mine is in the shop... 30,000 light years maintenance schedule... you know...

I think it would look more like this.

You're a goddamned liar, your English is way too fucked up, even for Missouri. I don't have to show you anything--unless, of course, you're headed for Mars. If so, i hope you'll sent out as they describe in the blog post i linked. You won't be missed.

It sounds almost like a late ’90s sci-fi flick: NASA sends a spacecraft to an asteroid, plucks a boulder off its surface with a robotic claw, and brings it back in orbit around the moon. Then, brave astronaut heroes go and study the space rock up close—and bring samples back to Earth.

Except it’s not a movie: That’s the real-life idea for the Asteroid Redirect Mission, which NASA announced today. Other than simply being an awesome space version of the claw arcade game (you know you really wanted that stuffed Pikachu), the mission will let NASA test technology and practice techniques needed for going to Mars.

The mission, which will cost up to $1.25 billion, is slated to launch in December 2020. It will take about two years to reach the asteroid (the most likely candidate is a quarter-mile-wide rock called 2008 EV5). The spacecraft will spend up to 400 days there, looking for a good boulder. After picking one—maybe around 13 feet in diameter—it will bring the rock over to the moon. In 2025, astronauts will fly NASA’s still-to-be-built Orion to dock with the asteroid-carrying spacecraft and study the rock up close.

Although the mission would certainly give scientists an up-close opportunity to look at an asteroid, its main purpose is as a testing ground for a Mars mission. The spacecraft will test a solar electronic propulsion system, which uses the power from solar panels to pump out charged particles to provide thrust. It’s slower than conventional rockets, but a lot more efficient. You can’t lug a lot of rocket fuel to Mars.
http://www.wired.com/2015/03/nasas-plan-give-moon-moon/

The following story made our print/broadcast media in recent days. This online version was the first search result when I googled 'joseph roche criticism'.
http://www.siliconrepublic.com/innovation/item/41210-mars-one-boots-joseph-roche

I'm from Missouri, you'll have to show me.

Show me first that you can really go to the Moon and come back.

Then, after that, I may believe you when you say that you will travel to Mars.

So far, you can't even go to the Moon, so whatever foundation training people for going to Mars is just plain FRAUD.

They went to the moon and came back already, genius.

Oh, yeah? Show me.

Prove that you can do it again... today.

Finally we will have the opportunity to check how a long staying in outer space will affect the human body when an astronaut will be there for more than six months.

Currently, the silly theory of Relativity has been debunked one more time when astronauts traveling "faster" than humans on earth return with health symptoms that belong to older people. As an example, a healthy 40 years old astronaut returns back after six months with osteoporosis of a 70 years old person.

This test will open the door for many studies that will lead to a better understanding of what is to live in such a complete different environment with such a low gravity.

Still, it won't give any green light for a travel to Mars because besides gravity there are other problems that astronauts might have to confront, like radiation from the Sun.

The good side of this test, is as well to compare the health of this astronaut staying one year in outer space with the health of his twin brother who will stay on earth.

So far, instead of a Twin Paradox, we might be witness of a greater evidence of relativistic Twin Unorthodox, when the traveler will be older instead of younger than the twin brother standing on earth.

We will see, the results will come a year from now.

My only hope is for the astronaut who is going to stay a year in outer space to return in good average shape as minimum. Perhaps the human body will have a limit of degradation and after six months the negative health symptoms might diminish and will adapt to the new environment.

As I said before, we are lucky that a volunteer is taking the risk of staying a year in outer space, this is indeed a small step for him but a great step for humanity.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/15/us/nasa-one-year-mission/index.html