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WWoman fired for being too attractive. That's OK, court says

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 12:56 pm
@hawkeye10,
i think a owner/employee relationship is voluntary so for the most part the employer should be able to fire at will. however given the amount of time this woman had given him good service this guy was a schmuck for not finding her another job before letting her go. the legal ability to do something does not necessarily mean doing that something is smart, the law does not and should not prevent idiocy.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 12:56 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawk,
Quote:
he also it appeared actively killed his business because he could not deal with the flirting between the bartenders and the customers


What were you trying to say? LOL
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 12:58 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
What were you trying to say? LOL

that for a dentist huge unneeded legal bills and bad press are practice killers.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:12 pm
@hawkeye10,
Can you please rearrange the words into proper English grammar?

Thanks.
Ceili
 
  3  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:24 pm
@chai2,
I can't imagine this case happening here. This case would absolutely be considered wrongful dismissal. Where was the due process. Where was the disciplinary process, documentation - not twitter..? She wasn't given a warning or a chance to change?
She'd worked there for 10 years and only got 1 month severance?
How can they say this isn't about gender? She's a woman, he's not gay and he fired her because, in his and his jealous wife's fevered brains, they imagined an affair that the employee was/is/will-never-be interested in.
At best the Dr. had 'a he said she said' with the bulge comments. I wouldn't have responded to a one off text either. But if this was a continuing banter in the office then it was up to the boss to set the boundaries. Clearly he didn't, it sounds as if he led the charge.
I've been in work situations that you had to buck up, play the game or you weren't considered a team player. Call it peer pressure...
If the boss is a pig, sometimes you have to laugh along, especially when jobs are hard to find. It's called reality. Nothing this woman did would be completely out of place in a lot of places, almost normal. After 10 years of that kind of shite, were nothing went beyond a few out of character comments, I fail to see how this woman was treated fairly.
hawkeye10
 
  3  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:28 pm
@Ceili,
Quote:
I fail to see how this woman was treated fairly.

she was not so customers should think twice about supporting this practice, and many will. however, she was not treated illegally. life is rarely fair, universal fairness is an aspiration.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:29 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Can you please rearrange the words into proper English grammar?

Thanks.

could you please stop being a dick?

thanks
Mame
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:47 pm
@chai2,
Small Business. Wife jealous. Doesn't matter if wifey had grounds or not, this is their business and she wanted Melissa out. He gave her a month's pay which I do consider cheap given the longevity; however, it's his business and he has a right to hire whom he wants. He just has to give proper notice. Just because you hired someone doesn't mean you have to keep them on forever.

She disagreed and went to court and lost. End of story.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:48 pm
@chai2,
I think Chai has gone off the deep end. Her entire fantasy, in which she claims to have insight into the minds of both parties, is based on a few quotes from the lawyers of the losing party.

I, for one, am glad we have an impartial justice system.


0 Replies
 
Chez Mimi
 
  3  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:50 pm
@ehBeth,
And his wife was working there, too. Uuugh. How humiliating. Now if his wife can get their pastor to give him the okay to lust after her instead...I still think it could be about her getting a vested pension because after ten years maybe they wanted her gone and cooked up this whole thing that the judges agree with his "thoughts and feelings" are not discriminatory. WHAT? Like someone who gets fired for being _____(fill in the protected class) doesn't illicit a feeling in the person who is uncomfortable with their appearance. Biggots have feelings and thoughts about other people all the time. If they act on them, hello, lawsuit.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:52 pm
@Mame,
Quote:
She disagreed and went to court and lost. End of story

unlikely. his practice will go into decline I think. she did what she likely wanted to do..she hurt him.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:55 pm
@Ceili,
"Here" being Canada?

The key point in law, which is true in many US states, is the term "employee at will". This means that you can be let go without cause, as long as you are not being discriminated against.

Does "employee at will" exist in Canada?

I will also point out that all of the information we have from this case was given to us by the woman's lawyers Her lawyers apparently see a benefit in providing the press with salacious headlines. I would guess that the defendant sees no benefit to air his side of the story to the outrage-hungry public.

The judges decision (which I linked to above) dealt with the issue of discrimination. He has other female employees that haven't been a problem, and a woman was hired in his place. I would support this decision even if it had been a woman boss firing a male employee or a gay boss firing an employee. The gender wasn't the issue. The behavior and the relationship between them was the issue.


maxdancona
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:59 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
I understand why people thumb me down, not that I care at all, but I know that I can be a combative ass at times..

By why are people thumbing down Mame? She is stating her opinion respectfully.

Thumbing people down just for disagreeing with you defeats the purpose of thumbs and is in poor taste.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 01:59 pm
@hawkeye10,
another such case went the same way

Quote:
Remember Debrahlee Lorenzana? For those with short memories, two years ago, Lorenzana sued Citibank for firing her for allegedly being “too hot,” a claim representatives of the bank denied several times, while also calling her an attention whore. After the initial hoopla, interest in Lorenzana, who once appeared on a TV show discussing her reasons for having her breasts enlarged (she wanted to look like “tits on a stick” in order to attract a “professional, well-educated man”) died down and many likely forgot about the story of T’s on an S versus Citi. In a Daily News article today, though, Debs said that she passed on a settlement wanting instead to “press on.” While it’s not clear that anyone reading the piece took it to mean Lorenzana had in fact received damages for her hotness, Citi was not having it. Lest there be any confusion about whether or not she extracted jack from Vikram et al, the bank needs the world to know the following:
Quote:
“The case is concluded, and Citibank did not enter into any kind of a settlement with Ms. Lorenzana or provide any payment to her.”


http://dealbreaker.com/2012/05/citi-would-like-to-make-it-clear-it-did-not-pay-debrahlee-lorenzana-a-dime/#more-76999

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.bvonmoney.com/media/2010/10/debrahleelorenzana04.jpg
0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:00 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
Does "employee at will" exist in Canada?


no we have this

http://staplessoccer.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/will-work-for-food.jpg

the food being bannock and smoked moose
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  -1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:01 pm
@hawkeye10,
I like being a dick in your case. Mr. Green
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:03 pm
@hawkeye10,
You're assuming he's a bad dentist. What transpires between the dentist and his workers are not the primary reason patients go to him.

Am I being a dick again? LOL
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:05 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
Thumbing people down just for disagreeing with you defeats the purpose of thumbs and is in poor taste

are you the last person at A2K to figure out that Robert screwed up?
djjd62
 
  1  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:17 pm
@hawkeye10,
only if you give a **** about the thumbs



0 Replies
 
Ceili
 
  3  
Sun 23 Dec, 2012 02:32 pm
@maxdancona,
Yes, Canada. No, to the employee at will.
If you're a provincial employee, you would get at minimum 1 week severance for every year worked for unlawful or wrongful termination, a federal employee can expect a two week/annum severance. You can't fire someone without just cause. I can't see a potential affair in the mind one party every being construed as a lawful firing..
In Canada you can't just fire someone. You have to have a paper trail. Most jobs have a three month period at the beginning where you can be fired outright, but past that point you have to go through the steps, warning, day off with-out pay, written documentation, sign by both parties. Unless, you want a potential lawsuit.
Again, from what I've read the evidence was slim pickings. And the issue was gender, but there were other factors, like the wife was jealous of a younger, prettier woman. Were the other employees old, unattractive or male?
Was the employee aware that the wife was jealous? If the wife was jealous, why did the dentist write the employee a week before he fired her? If your boss wrote you, about a personal matter, would you write back? I agree, there were a few inappropriate comments, but the majority were not? How would you as an employee handle the situation any differently?
 

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