How can something come from nothing?

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To continue with the theme of the entire universe and everything in it not being worth a spit compared to a single human being, here's a story I heard once-

MOUNTAIN to human passing by- "Ha ha ha, you puny insignificant little mortal! Look at me, I weigh a billion tons, I can carry huge forests on my back and my head brushes the clouds!"

HUMAN (smiling)- "Yes, but I can MOVE!"..

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@Romeo Fabulini,

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

To continue with the theme of the entire universe and everything in it not being worth a spit compared to a single human being, here's a story I heard once-

MOUNTAIN to human passing by- "Ha ha ha, you puny insignificant little mortal! Look at me, I weigh a billion tons, I can carry huge forests on my back and my head brushes the clouds!"

HUMAN (smiling)- "Yes, but I can MOVE!"..

That Jesus guy you talk about so often apparently does not agree:

So Jesus said to them, “Because of your unbelief;[a] for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you.

Matthew 17:20New King James Version (NKJV)

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Quote:

Romeo said:
MOUNTAIN to human passing by- "Ha ha ha, you puny insignificant little mortal! Look at me, I weigh a billion tons, I can carry huge forests on my back and my head brushes the clouds!"
HUMAN (smiling)- "Yes, but I can MOVE!"..

Frank Apisa said: That Jesus guy you talk about so often apparently does not agree:
So Jesus said to them, “Because of your unbelief;[a] for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you.
Matthew 17:20New King James Version (NKJV)

Congrats mate, that was almost funny.. Smile

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I think we are thinking about it wrong. It doesn't make sense to think about it from a causal point of view where material expands and that equates to everything. Instead thinking about imatter.

Immater is the place to start.

A Universe expanding doesn't account for it; a universe at all. That's where I began when I started thinking about these theories, at last.

Primarily I've never heard of matter having thoughts and feelings. My mind went at once to immater, immater being the place to contemplate.

Otherwise matter starts and stops, too, and it accounts for everything just simply by forming-seems too cold as a theory for All.

To try to understand then, immatter, where I begin.

Otherwise

"something that existed always was" and I am unable to account for this, otherwise flaw in logic, very disabling to most practical theories.

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@kiuku,

Imatter

first concept

Does anything operate by its form, no Plato says it also has an idea but does the idea of a spider exist, only in the god who weaved though, well the woman who was turned to a spider by a goddess.

So it may be with creation, it follows the actual creator. How? How do, and do they, though, turtles pray to the moon?

Where was idea of spider before Arachne?

"in His Likeness"

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@kiuku,

Is that supposed to be some kind of logic lesson? LOL

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@cicerone imposter,

definitely not. I'm starting to make a competing hypothesis for creation that suits standards, and how "nothing" might fit into it for later.

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@kiuku,

You responded,

Quote:

a competing hypothesis for creation that suits standards

Your statement is an oxymoron. By "standards," it can't meet many.

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@cicerone imposter,

a duck is a duck. Yes it can.

Immatter, talk about it though. No one does. No one can. No one yet can. No one did. It's new!!
It's me.

so...to say it can't meet standards is just based on current understanding of immater as something that doesn't exist in fact, in body, in logic which is Universe, or current.

Immater could compete as a theory itself, against Universe. I don't know how to spell immater actually, if it should be from mater or not.

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@kiuku,

Current standards requires more than mumbo jumbo. It requires the ability of others to test its validity. If it can't be explained, it can't be tested.

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@cicerone imposter,

you mean like evidence? Well I'm not at that part yet. No one is though. No one explain nothing thanks, either so...competing hypothesis is really necessary. It was necessary in mind.

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@kiuku,

Evidence like in science. They're called 'empirical evidence.'

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@cicerone imposter,

ah. Yea. When does "Big Bang" meet standards? Immater needs to be thought of, as it could account for matter without beginning and end or total matter, which requires these things.

Something that can produce matter that does not require the properties of matter, which is form.

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@kiuku,

It's not for me to determine whether the big bang meets any standard.
The big bang is a theory. Theories can be disproven.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

It's not for me to determine whether the big bang meets any standard.
The big bang is a theory. Theories can be disproven.

What part of scientific knowledge is there which cannot be disproven?

Just askin'

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@neologist,

'Scientific knowledge' and 'scientific theory' can change. It's quite different than scientific fact which can be verified and repeatedly confirmed.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

'Scientific knowledge' and 'scientific theory' can change. It's quite different than scientific fact which can be verified and repeatedly confirmed.

'Facts' subject to verification are also subject to falsification. I know there are 'facts', such as properties of the elements, etc.; but even these 'facts' may be subject to revision upon further investigation.

I dare say that our reasoning on the scriptures is also subject to new light as the years progress. Ten commandments and golden rule seem self evident; but why God has allowed milleniums of human suffering requires study with an open mind. I have always claimed the answers are there for those willing to search.

I do not include the orthodox religions amongst the searchers, for they have become slaves to their dogma. That's why you have so many who are offended by the idea that Genesis allows billions of years for creation, for example.

Ite. Missa est

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@neologist,

That's true, but at least most facts must live the test of time. There's nothing more reliable about objective truths.

Will the sun come up tomorrow morning? No, the sun always shines; it's always up.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quite true, sir. It's instructive to note that many 'facts' have not endured the passage of time. The lesson to us should be one of humility.

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