Does freedom of speech excuse preaching hate?

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

Foofie wrote:

Foofie wrote:

By proselytizing the end of American free speech, one seems to be promulgating anti-American speech. Well, technically not hate speech, but anti-American speech is quite rampant in the Middle East, and is acted out now and then in terrorism. So, one should not think that sort of speech is so benign, in my opinion.

I like this post so much, I will repeat it.

I know you like the sound of your own voice, doesn't mean it's not a load of old bollocks though. You're incapabable of discussing anything without getting on the defensive. If anyone is proselytising it's you.

Who has said anti-American speech is benign? You're starting to make strawmen arguments again Fluff.

I assume there are better minds than yours in the UK, and it would really add credence to your argument, about free speech in the U.S., if they promoted your views. However, you being one little Izzy, in my opinion, I think you are sort of humorous offering the thought about change to the foundational rights in the U.S. [Foofie says, "Hear! Hear!" in his best imitation of a member of the British Parliament.]

Sort of like the tail wagging the dog.

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@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Since then, your natural rights to defend your LIFE ITSELF,
were violated by your government; than that, there is nothing more FUNDAMENTAL.
Relative to THAT, all else is trivial.

Far more people are killed by guns in America. My best defence is to keep guns out of the hands of lunatics.

Dave wrote:

izzythepush wrote:

Quote:
and were a lot more reluctant to criticise the weak and powerful.
Evidence ??

What's most spoken about is the launch of satirical show That Was The Week That Was, and the way the Profumo affair was reported. Also the way Peter Cook tore into Harold MacMillan when MacMillan tried to show what a good egg he was by turning up to the show. Both are seen as pivotal moments in which the entertainment industry/satirists attacked those in power.

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@Setanta,

O Malvolio, I don't pay much attention to you and your anal utterances. You're incapable of holding any form of debate without resorting to personal insults.

You're quite a sad ineffectual little fascist overall. Why don't you sort out your chalfonts and give the rest of us a break?

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American election looming.

Netanyahu wants to attack Iran*, apparently Netanyahu is a long term pal of Mitt, then we get a release on a Israeli science website saying Obama's birth cert was forged although now the same website is saying the article was a forgery and now this movie.
It's ripe for a conspiracy theory!

*Can you imagine the reaction of these Islamic fanatics if Israel attacked Iran, the craziness that followed the release of the stupid movie would pale into insignificance. The Muslims would go ape ****. IMO It would be a stupid move.

I wonder if say in another 10,000 years we'll have one lot of people believing in the holy book of Potter involved in a bitter hate filled war against those who believe in the divine book of The Rings.

"Praise and glory be to You, O Harry!"

"Our Frodo who art in the Shire!"

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@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

I told u that my grandfather came from England.
How can u possibly know if that is a downright lie? He coud have been Swiss.
I might have tried to deceive u on that point.

Therefore it's not a downright lie, it can't be proven one way or the other. I'm talking about stuff that is known to be false like Holocaust denial.

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@izzythepush,

Izzy the Putz wrote:

You're incapable of holding any form of debate without resorting to personal insults.

You're quite a sad ineffectual little fascist overall.

I guess you don't do irony, huh?

1 Reply

@tsarstepan,

tsarstepan wrote:

Hey Snood, since Set upset you, according to Izzy, you now have his moral permission and acceptance to go on a killing spree. Not that you should, I'm just letting you know your options.

I think you and reason parted company a while ago. I said no such thing. Is your argument so weak that you have to make things up?

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@snood,

snood wrote:

Setanta wrote:

Tough guy, huh? You're the bad-mouth muother ****** who goes around threatening to kick people's asses if you ever meet them in person. You just cannot avoid blatant hypocrisy.

Say that with your real name. Once. Even in a private message. Coward.

You are throwing that term "coward" around with less than sincere feelings, in my opinion. I thought I was the "coward" you had the most contempt for. And, now I am finding out you can call other people "coward"?

I assume you give some credence to Izzy's belief that the U.S. should have some hate speech laws? If that is correct, would you think many African-Americans would be breaking the law, every time they made some contemptuous remark about white folk? You do know that a large majority of the white demographic in the U.S. do not use the "N" word. How much of the African-American demographic use contemptuous references to whites, or for that matter Jews?

Like the moral of the fable, King Midas' Touch, one should be cautious what one wishes for; one might just get it (the king touched his beautiful wife, and she turned to inanimate gold).

1 Reply

@Foofie,

Still a load of old bollocks Fluff.

1 Reply

@eurocelticyankee,

eurocelticyankee wrote:

American election looming.

Netanyahu wants to attack Iran*, apparently Netanyahu is a long term pal of Mitt, then we get a release on a Israeli science website saying Obama's birth cert was forged although now the same website is saying the article was a forgery and now this movie.
It's ripe for a conspiracy theory!

That figures, Obama is the only president who's had the guts to stand up to Israel, albeit in a rather half hearted way.

Now that's the tail wagging the dog.

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@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

I guess you don't do irony, huh?

And you do?

When you don't try you really are funny. You should knock the sammich thing on the head and stick to this.

1 Reply

@eurocelticyankee,

Quote:

*Can you imagine the reaction of these Islamic fanatics if Israel attacked Iran, the craziness that followed the release of the stupid movie would pale into insignificance. The Muslims would go ape ****. IMO It would be a stupid move.

Of course. Many Muslims died when the fanatics went ape **** over the Danish cartoons. Muslims have died and many were wounded when the fanatics went ape **** over the accidental burning of their holy book by our troops. Muslims have died and many were wounded in Yemen (at the hand of their fellow Muslims) when fanatics went ape **** over this latest 'movie'. They seem to pick and choose which events to use as their outlet for rage.

There's no reasoning with extremists or fanatics, and this 'movie' was just an excuse. Please don't tell me you believe that censoring it would have appeased them.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

Still a load of old bollocks Fluff.

Hey, I read somewhere that alpha males often use tactics such as dismissing an opponents argument in a dismissive manner to affect an alpha identity. Are you an alpha male, since you do not counter my position with logic? You seem to just dismiss it, in an alpha dismissive manner.

If I am correct, and you are an alpha male, please tell me what it is like to be an alpha male. I am not an alpha male, nor a beta male (the male that serves the alpha male for the benefit of obtaining a bit of the alpha's panache/power).

Are there many alpha males in the U.K.? Is the competition between them great? Perhaps, in those inns that the Brits tend to inhabit?

1 Reply

@Foofie,

Foofie wrote:

I assume you give some credence to Izzy's belief that the U.S. should have some hate speech laws? If that is correct, would you think many African-Americans would be breaking the law, every time they made some contemptuous remark about white folk? You do know that a large majority of the white demographic in the U.S. do not use the "N" word. How much of the African-American demographic use contemptuous references to whites, or for that matter Jews?

First of all Fluff I never said I thought you should have hate speech laws. I just put the topic up for discussion. There have been quite a few sober comments, but you've not made any of them.

People make contemptuous remarks about other people all the time, but they're not automatically classed as hate speech. It's only if there's a deliberate attempt to cause extreme distress or to stir up violence. You'd rather deal in paranoid imaginings than hard facts. Why not find an actual case where you think our laws have been used maliciously or where there has been gross injustice.

The only example I can think of was of the guy who jokingly tweeted he was going to blow up an airport. There was a huge outcry against his sentence, and he has since been exonerated. I can't think of any other cases.

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@Foofie,

I dunno Fluff, I just says it as I finds it.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

O Malvolio, I don't pay much attention to you and your anal utterances.
You're incapable of holding any form of debate without resorting to personal insults.

That DOES appear to be true.
Its sad; incapable, yes, judging by his posting history,
but in fairness, he used to be worse, more sadistic, as I remember.
Maybe he got a better psychiatrist, or with age, his malevolent energy is waning.

Your comment about his "paraphrasing Wikipedia" appears to be accurate.
Did he post anything about that a few years ago, wherein he admitted
something approximately like that?? Its a little vague in my memory.

David

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

I do it a lot better than you. You still have not responded to the burden of my post. You still have not addressed the issue of freedom of speech and why it is crucially important. You still have not shown that you have any reason to claim you know the truth better than anyone elase. You still have not shown that you know anything all about the law, or any other aspect of American life, in the United States. But you want to whine about pesonal attacks, when that's the only stock in trade you have. You certainly have no substance to your ranting.

1 Reply

@Irishk,

Irishk wrote:

There's no reasoning with extremists or fanatics, and this 'movie' was just an excuse.

So why give them the excuse?

There's plenty of Moslems you can reason with, by far the vast majority in fact, and this alienates them every bit as much as the fanatics.

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@OmSigDAVID,

I'd say that a lot of things are vague in your memory. On many occasions, i have acknowledged that i use Wikipedia--i use it confirms spellings and dates, even though it is obvious that a lot of the information there is unreliable. But you, like your buddy Finn and you new buddy Izzy the Putz here ignore that if i didn't already know well the subjects about which i post, i'd not know what to look for at Wikipedia. But i'm sure you'll enjoy joining your new asshold buddy Izzy in the pile on.

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@izzythepush,

To say "why give them the excuse" misses the whole point about the freedom of speech. You don't control free speech; you control the criminals.

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Does freedom of speech excuse preaching hate?

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