18
   

They’re 18 for Gods sake

 
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 02:32 pm
@aidan,
Quote:
Yeah, you may have all SAID it, but alot of your other commentary speaks volumes about the fact that you admire her choices (because she's sexually FREE, lawd, lawd...) and envy the boys their participation, and think that anyone who speaks against what she's done is sexually repressed and/or envious and/or a woman-hater.


I do not care what Spendisus had said or not said I have been stating over and over that she use poor judgment to say the least and her behaviors is more then questionable and if I was in power in that school system she would had been fired.

With all the above stated you can and should not allow the state to use the criminal laws to ban sex between consenting adults.

Do you think that the state of Texas who had done such things as outlaw gay sex and even the selling of women vibrators of all things would stop at adult teachers/students sexual relationships?

The US constitution and past SC rulings should result in this law being declare unconstitutional in the mean time not only the teacher but her husband and her children are being harm under a law that should not exist in the first place.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 03:03 pm
@aidan,
This is the kind of state you seems to be willing to trust to regulated consensus sexual behaviors between adults with the criminal laws.

Another teacher was looking at up to a year in prison for selling a vibrator to two undercover cops pretending to be a married couple.

A woman clerk was looking at being register for life as a sex offender over working in a shop that sell women vibrators.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_obscenity_statute

Texas obscenity statuteFrom Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJump to: navigation, search The Obscene Device Law is a Texas statute dealing with obscenity. In 1973 the Texas Legislature passed Section 43.21 of the Texas Penal Code which, in part, prohibited the sale or promotion of ""Obscene device[s]" mean[ing] a device including a dildo or artificial vagina, designed or marketed as useful primarily for the stimulation of human genital organs."

Prosecution under the statute was rare but had occurred on occasion. In Burleson in 2004, Joanne Webb, a mother of three and a former schoolteacher, faced up to one year in prison for selling a vibrator to two undercover police officers posing as a married couple at a private party.[1] She was later acquitted, and the undercover officers were issued reprimands. In 2007, a lingerie shop in Lubbock was raided, and items "deemed to be illegal by the Texas Penal Code" were confiscated. The clerk on duty at the time was arrested and may have to register as a sex offender.[2] In 2001, attorneys Mary and Ted Roberts used the obscenity statute in a elaborate extortion scheme against a number of men who had engaged in extramarital relations with Mary Roberts.[3]Section 43.23 of the Code dealt with promotion ("A person commits an offense if, knowing its content and character, he... promotes or possesses with intent to promote any obscene material or obscene device... A person who possesses six or more obscene devices or identical or similar obscene articles is presumed to possess them with intent to promote the same.") This legislation was last updated in 2003.[4]

Two companies filed suit, Reliable Consultants, Inc. (d/b/a Dreamer's and Le Rouge Boutique), who operate four retail stores in Texas that carry a stock of sexual devices, and PHE, Inc. (d/b/a Adam & Eve, Inc.), while is s also engaged in the retail distribution of sexual devices through their website and catalogues, filed suit, claiming that the statute is unconstitutional.

In appeal from the United States District Court for the Western District of Texas, a three-judge panel of the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals overturned the statute on February 12, 2008 by a vote of 2-1, holding that "the statute has provisions that violate the Fourteenth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution." (The original case name has been shortened to "Reliable Consultants v. Abbott (5th Cir. 2008) (Texas)" from its original and complete name shown in the filings).

The majority opinion stated that "Because of Lawrence v. Texas, 539 U.S. 558 (2003)],, the issue before us is whether the Texas statute impermissibly burdens the individual's substantive due process right to engage in private intimate conduct of his or her choosing. Contrary to the district court's conclusion, we hold that the Texas law burdens this constitutional right. An individual who wants to legally use a safe sexual device during private intimate moments alone or with another is unable to legally purchase a device in Texas, which heavily burdens a constitutional right."

The State of Texas argued that the state has the right to regulate morality: "The state also argued in a brief that Texas has legitimate “morality based” reasons for the laws, which include “discouraging prurient interests in autonomous sex and the pursuit of sexual gratification unrelated to procreation.”"The State of Texas (through Attorney General Greg Abbott) filed a petition on Feb 22, 2008, for the Circuit Court to rehear the argument "en banc".[5]

On July 3, 2008, the Texas 13th District Court of Appeals in Corpus Christi,[6] in the case of Villareal vs. State,[7] addressed the ruling of the federal 5th Circuit Court of Appeals. The 13th District Court of Appeals ruled that until the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals rules that 43.23 is unconstitutional, the promotion of obscene devices remains illegal.[8] Therefore, despite the actions of the federal courts and the Texas Attorney General described elsewhere in this article, section 43.23 remains in effect in the twenty-county area of Texas covered by the jurisdiction of the 13th District Court of Appeals.[9]

On August 1, 2008, the Fifth Circuit denied Texas's request to re-hear the case en banc.[10]

That refusal by the Fifth Circuit created an issue, a split between federal circuits: the 5th circuit overturned the Texas law and the 11th Circuit upheld a nearly identical Alabama law. That would usually mean that the United States Supreme Court would grant a writ of certiorari and rule in order to clear up the disagreement between the two circuits.[11]

On November 4, 2008, U.S. District Judge Lee Yeakel released a two-page document dated October 29, 2008, in which he stated that the Texas Attorney General's Office notified him that they would not file a writ of certiorari with the Supreme Court (Unable to find a copy of this filing; this is one source of the notification:[12]). With the appeal dropped, Texas sellers of adult devices outside of the jurisdiction of the Texas 13th District Court of Appeals are now safe from prosecution under this law.

[edit] See also
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 03:24 pm
@aidan,
Quote:
Okay, so is there only one sort of female sexuality? Is the only sexually free female the one who would have group sex with four young men?


No. I didn't say that Rebecca. There are many other ways. It is only the sexually free female who may choose any of the ways without the fear of her choice being punished. In Brittini's case it was as you describe.

Very few women would choose to do what she did but if women are not free to choose that way then can they be said to be free? The prosecution, in repressing that type of expression, are approving others and thus controlling female sexuality.

If a student is punished for not doing her homework then she might only do her homework to avoid punishment. If she is free to do or not do her homework then if she does do her homework she is doing it freely and is a good student. By which I mean she is interested and sees the teacher as her servant rather than as a taskmaster.

It is the prosecution itself which needs to be thought about. And I presume it was. Possibly very carefully. The case did not appear in court and on our screens out of nowhere. It wasn't suddenly there.

Go from the first point, a phone call maybe, at which the criminal proceedings began. Maybe a patrolman overhearing some guys at the training ground joshing each other. There's a lot of stuff before it gets to what we saw.
0 Replies
 
aidan
 
  2  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 04:56 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Jesus Christ, Aidan, she is in prison. I think she is feeling far from free also. I doubt any sane, intelligent person thinks otherwise.

Yes Frank - and some prisons don't have walls.

Do you know the definition of addiction?
Read it - and then reinterpret my statement about her feeling far from free, even before she was imprisoned.

Quote:
That is because you (and the community) seem to think there is something wrong with people who have a high urge for sexual activity…especially if it is sexual activity that is outside the missionary position for a married couple.

Oh really? So in essence you're reinforcing what I was saying : in other words you think that if you're a person who doesn't understand how a teacher would forfeit her life for group sex with her students you must be a female who's repressed, has a low sex drive and only gets it once a week in the missionary position.
So those are the only two options for female sexuality? Really?! Could have fooled me.
But I'm only a sexual female , and I guess my experience as a sexual female means nothing next to yours as a man who would assume what my sex life is like even though you've never spoken to me or met me, because I wouldn't sacrifice my life and my job to have group sex with my students.

Alright...whatever.


URL: http://able2know.org/topic/196298-17
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:07 pm
@aidan,
Would you think of selling a vibrator to what you was told was a married couple at a private party as that what gotten a former teacher arrested in the great state of Texas?

The great state of Texas had taken the following position......The state also argued in a brief that Texas has legitimate “morality based” reasons for the laws, which include “discouraging prurient interests in autonomous sex and the pursuit of sexual gratification unrelated to procreation.

The great state of Texas should get out and stay out of adults bedrooms even when the sex is unrelated to procreation.
aidan
 
  2  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:18 pm
@BillRM,
I've already said Bill, five times now, that I don't think this is a crimial action or anything near meriting a custodial sentence.

I'm not talking about the great state of Texas. I'm talking about the frame of mind of a woman who's a mother and a teacher and would risk it all to do something like this for kicks, and the men on this thread who are insinutating that if you don't agree that her choice was a wise or particularly healthy and fortunate one - you must be a nun or something.

That's bullshit.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:26 pm
@aidan,
Most of us do not care why she used such bad judgment and had sex with those young men and had agree that for whatever the reason she did so she should had been fired and even loss her teaching license.

For myself and I think others here the idea this is any kind of a criminal misdeed is wrong not the degree of the punishment but any criminal punishment of any degree even one day sentence or one dollar fine is one day and one dollar too must.

Consenting sex between adults should not fall under any state criminal law period.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:37 pm
@aidan,
PS I did many years ago had a friend who was a teacher dealing with senior high school students and after a few drinks one night she told me that having good looking and fit young men having romantic crushes on her is one hell of a turn on for her.

Stating that she from time to time needed to have long talks with herself to keep behaving in a proper manner.

From this one sample and human nature I assume that with special note of young teachers only a few years older then their students are not all immune to having sexual feelings if they act on them or not.
engineer
 
  3  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:38 pm
@BillRM,
Reading back it seems like everyone is in agreement - no jail time, loss of job. Is there anyone that is not of that opinion?
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 05:42 pm
@engineer,
With the add on for me that there should be no criminal law addressing the matter of consensus sex between consenting adults even students and teachers.

You do not need a criminal law to fired someone or find someone unfit to hold a teacher license.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 06:06 pm
@aidan,
Quote:
Oh really? So in essence you're reinforcing what I was saying : in other words you think that if you're a person who doesn't understand how a teacher would forfeit her life for group sex with her students you must be a female who's repressed, has a low sex drive and only gets it once a week in the missionary position.
So those are the only two options for female sexuality? Really?! Could have fooled me.
But I'm only a sexual female , and I guess my experience as a sexual female means nothing next to yours as a man who would assume what my sex life is like even though you've never spoken to me or met me, because I wouldn't sacrifice my life and my job to have group sex with my students.

Alright...whatever.


First of all...I am not reinforcing anything you are saying. I am saying she has the right to enjoy sex as she sees fit.

I don't really care what your sexual experience is as a female. She has the right to her sexual tendencies...and just because yours are different doesn't mean she should conform to yours.

If you would not do the things you say you would not do...fine for you. She would...and should be able to do so without having the state throw her in prison for doing it.

This has gotten past ridiculous. You are suggesting that the woman's rights have to be limited because you would not do some of the things she would (and did) do...and you want to classify me as less qualified than you to judge that kind of thing. And where you derives some of the other **** you threw at me in this post is from your imagination...not from anything that I wrote.

It is maddening the kind of reasoning you are using here.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 06:44 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Especially interesting getting a lesson in being moral from someone like you.


I couldn't agree more, Frank. This is a guy who actively supported and participated in far far far greater crimes in SE Asia. To this day he makes claims that it was legitimate.

Can't you just smell the hypocrisy?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 06:54 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
Texas will decide on whether its constitutional or not - in Texas. Arizona's decision is irrelevant. States' rights and all that.


That really depends, doesn't it, Beth? State's rights hardly trump the US consteetwoshun.

But I agree that it kinda makes a mockery of the, is it the 14th Amendment?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 07:08 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
Go talk to some young men. I talked to two of them about this yesterday. Their responses did not reflect your guesses.


And they were perfectly honest with you because you were their mother or because you are an ace reporter?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 07:24 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
I hope you realize that you answered msolga's questions with "I do not have to explain that" after saying you would answer her questions.


Beth, you've been showing your ticker side of late. Clearly, those were Frank's opinions, that he had added as his opinions.

He could have explained them any number of ways, but, I think he chose to forgo that to keep a thoroughly confused group more on track.

But at least he exhibited the honesty to let folks know that. Consider your recent "indices" nonsense. Sure you can see that you carried a much greater responsibility to answer and yet none was forthcoming. In fact you attempted to divert away from your self induced embarrassment.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 07:31 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
she's a teacher. she's supposed to be smart.


You've read the language threads and you think American English teachers are smart, Beth?

You've read and heard just how badly US history has been a horrible whitewash and you still hold to such a silly notion.

You're not that dumb.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 07:36 pm
@Rockhead,
Always better to remain the cool silent type than risk talking, right, Rock head?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 08:02 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
You're not that dumb.


I read a few posts after this one of yours I commented on.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 08:13 pm
@Setanta,
Quote:
so you can't provide an argument against the glaring evidence of her lack of character.


Doncha just love the smell of napalm in the morning, Set?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2012 08:37 pm
@Setanta,
Quote:
By the way, she also betrayed her marriage vows and cast serious doubts about her fitness to raise her children.


As we are all acutely, and sadly aware, there are those who have done things that are infinitely worse, indeed, some who have betrayed their very humanity, and still they surround themselves with children and wives.

The stunning hypocrisy is really difficult to comprehend though.
0 Replies
 
 

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