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Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

 
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Sun 12 Aug, 2012 10:53 pm
@oralloy,
http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/609/93833255-nra.jpg

snood
 
  2  
Reply Sun 12 Aug, 2012 11:35 pm
@firefly,
perfect
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  3  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 12:56 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
The NRA is a strong supporter of those GOP candidates. Like Romney's pick for V.P.--Paul Ryan.
Quote:
Paul Ryan on Gun Control
Voted YES on decreasing gun waiting period from 3 days to 1. (Jun 1999)
Rated A by the NRA, indicating a pro-gun rights voting record. (Dec 2003)

http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Paul_Ryan.htm/


I have no use for either the GOP or the NRA--I've never supported either.
In your posts, u have shown a broad n general tendency
toward anti-Individualism, pro-repressionism.

Personal freedom seems to annoy u.





David
hawkeye10
 
  3  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 12:59 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
Personal freedom seems to annoy u.


Ya think!

She is a full on police state advocate. She seems to never have met a law used on us citizens which to her is overly harsh or unjustified altogether.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 01:03 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/609/93833255-nra.jpg


Factually inaccurate. The NRA supports background checks at gun shows. They just want the check to be instant, and not be used as an excuse to hassle gun buyers by making them needlessly wait.

The provision to extend background checks to all sales at gun shows was defeated by the gun control movement, which objected to the notion of making the checks instant instead of imposing a needless delay.

(You see, people who favor gun control do not actually care about keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. They just object to the idea of civil rights.)



Given the fact that the Constitution protects our right to have assault weapons, the NRA will be on the ball on that one though.

And also the so-called "terrorism watch list". You can't violate someone's Constitutional rights just because their name is on a list.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 01:09 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/609/93833255-nra.jpg
It is nonsense to suggest that any man 's Constitutional rights have been impeded, revoked,
merely by his name having been put on a list.
That is NOT what Article 5 says about amending the Supreme Law of the Land.
Firefly's posted cartoon scorns the concept of "equal protection of the laws"
in favor of discrimination perpetrated by government.
( It was humorously interesting that Ted Kennedy
was prevented from flying by HIS name being on that no-fly list ! )





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 01:11 am
@oralloy,
McTag wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The reason they made the militia as strong as possible was because they did not want a standing army.


I think the most likely reason is the cost of a standing army.
Most countries have one if they can afford it.
The new nation could not.
oralloy wrote:
No. The reason was fear of tyranny.
A standing army would enforce the orders of a tyrannical government,
but the militia was composed of the general populace,
and people will not impose tyranny upon themselves.

It's actually not too different from the reasoning behind
the original version in the 1689 English Bill of Rights.
The English Bill of Rights of 1689 included preservation of the right to bear arms
applied against the King, after King James II Stuart fled to France in 1688.





David
McTag
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 01:37 am
@OmSigDAVID,

It is strange that gun nuts persistently quote historical precedent, when all circumstances nowadays are entirely different from Stuart England or Revolutionary America.

I am informed the USA has now got a standing army, quite a large one. Shouldn't it now turn its attention to the well-armed local "militia" and the harm they cause the nation?

Those who want to play at being Davy Crockett could still keep a musket at home.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 01:47 am
@spendius,
DAVID wrote:
She was anorexic, under psychological care.
Somewhat questionable about her feeding.
spendius wrote:
Trust you to find an exceptional case under treatment.
You could have used somebody who sleeps on a bed of nails
to prove soft beds are not instinctive although I will admit it being
an unsuitable case for telling us you once dated a hottie. Haven't we all?
Aren't all our dates shockingly beautiful?
Yes, thay r not;
NOT like Ivy; I used to flinch at her beauty,
if I had not seen her for a while. I remember telling her,
in the fullest of candor: "I remembered that u were beautiful,
but I forgot that u were THAT beautiful."



spendius wrote:
You have even been manipulated on beauty.
U post as if u KNEW me; presumptuous.




spendius wrote:
Trophy dolls engineered by the advertising industry.
U r too naive; chicks' beauty long antedated that industry.


spendius wrote:
Load of bollocks. Pickpocketing.
I have no idea what a bollock is.
I am not a pickpocket (tho, in childhood, I was fairly skilled at it).





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 02:00 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:
It is strange that gun nuts persistently quote historical precedent, when all circumstances nowadays are entirely different from Stuart England or Revolutionary America.
Political & jurisprudential principles continue to apply,
like the principles of math.

Thay remain timeless.




McTag wrote:
I am informed the USA has now got a standing army, quite a large one.
The one that we used to save u from Hitler,
or the one that we used to rescue u from the Kaiser ?


McTag wrote:
Shouldn't it now turn its attention to the well-armed local
"militia" and the harm they cause the nation?
Yes, it shoud NOT.



McTag wrote:
Those who want to play at being Davy Crockett could still keep a musket at home.
Each of us will decide, as a matter of personal taste,
regarding what arms we shall bear. A few of us prefer musketry.
Most of us have more progressive desire for better ordnance.

We need no advice from the un-free about that.
Long ago, the English took pride in "English Liberty".
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 03:04 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
In a nation armed with more than a quarter of a billion privately owned firearms, the NRA is correct to assert that determined outlaws will often find a way to get their hands on guns. The problem is that the NRA is the foremost enabler of many of those outlaws.

We can’t link the NRA directly to the hideous acts of alleged Aurora gunman James Holmes, 24, or to any one of the nation’s 9,000 to 10,000 annual gun murders and 338,000 rapes, robberies and other non-fatal assaults, or to the actions of the “deranged madmen” whom the NRA loves to demonize. What we can say with absolute certainty is that where there are loopholes in gun laws, laws that make it more difficult to get thugs off the streets and laws that endanger the lives of police and ordinary citizens alike, you will invariably find the fingerprints of the NRA. Wayne LaPierre, the NRA’s CEO and public face, may call his group “one of the largest law enforcement organizations in the country,” but under his leadership the NRA – with a 2010 budget of more than $240 million — has become the nation’s de facto lobby for street criminals, criminal gun dealers and an industry that reaps a sizable percentage of its income from criminal gun use. The NRA, says Pittsburgh police detective Joseph Bielevicz, “takes every chance it gets to stymie even reasonable efforts to combat gun violence.”

No one honestly doubts that the NRA is the reason there is no serious debate about guns in Congress. So today we live under a series of laws written or advanced by the NRA. Today a state can impose a death sentence or life in prison on someone who commits murder with a firearm. But the “What, me worry?” gun dealer, who supplies multiple murderers with guns he claims were “stolen” from his inventory, guns he never recorded on his books, or guns he sold to straw buyers with a wink and a nod, can operate with virtual impunity, thanks to laws written by the NRA.

One of these, passed in 1986, drastically reduced penalties for dealers who violate record-keeping laws, making violations misdemeanors rather than felonies. Another established an absurdly high standard of proof to convict dealers who sell to criminals. In 2003, Congress, at the NRA’s urging, barred the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, the much-maligned agency responsible for enforcing federal gun laws, from forcing dealers to conduct inventory inspections that would detect lost and stolen guns. Car dealers like to know when inventory goes missing. Gun dealers? Not so curious.

Most astonishingly, the same NRA-inspired law forces the FBI to destroy Brady background checks for gun purchases within 24 hours, which makes it harder for law enforcement to identify dealers who falsify their records and makes it impossible to cross-check purchases made by gun traffickers from multiple dealers. Although federal law requires a dealer who sells more than one handgun to a single individual in a five-day period to file a special report with the BATF, the agency is unable to cross-check purchases from multiple dealers, so gun traffickers can simply hop from one gun store to the next, buying a single handgun at each until they accumulate the arsenals they want. Put another way, the NRA and its backers in Congress created a law that forces the FBI to destroy evidence of crimes, evidence of illegal multiple gun purchases.

The FBI warned Congress that passage of this 24-hour law would allow 97 percent of criminal buyers to escape apprehension, and the Justice Department’s inspector general said the law’s principal beneficiaries would be criminal gun dealers. But this doesn’t bother the NRA. It even opposes common-sense local ordinances requiring that gun dealers and private citizens report lost or stolen firearms within 24 to 48 hours. Police support these laws because they want to move quickly when a gun is lost or stolen (a half-million are stolen each year), before someone gets shot. They’re also supported by 78 percent of NRA members, who apparently recognize their value for public safety. They’re just not supported by the NRA leadership, which says they don’t work.
http://www.salon.com/2012/07/23/nra_a_lobby_for_criminals/
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 03:18 am
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 04:28 am
@firefly,
So I support guns rights that does not state that I support the GOP or anything other then gun rights.

Once more your thinking if one can even call it thinking is strange to say the least.

0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 04:30 am
@firefly,
In fact Firefly as you are a strong supporter of a police state you do belong yourself to the GOP far more then I do.

0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 04:46 am
@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:
The one that we used to save u from Hitler,
or the one that we used to rescue u from the Kaiser ?


Yes, that's the one. It could quite adequately supersede local "militia", unless you have other information?

I see you avoided the point with your stupid cheap shot. But I don't think the USA joined WWII (late, btw, but nonetheless welcome) for that purpose.
McTag
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 04:48 am
@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:
Political & jurisprudential principles continue to apply,
like the principles of math.

Thay remain timeless.


Which avoids another point. Every modern state repeals out-dated laws, or rewrites them.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 04:56 am
@firefly,

That's marvellous.

"A cruel and deadly hoax"- Bill Moyers, talking about Second Amendment rights.
Some telling statistics there...but what does truth matter, when prejudices are being aired?
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 05:21 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:
It is strange that gun nuts persistently quote historical precedent,


I know you're frustrated that you'll never stamp out freedom in the US, but that is no cause for name-calling.

And no, not strange at all. Historical precedent shows what the Second Amendment actually means.

Since we are defending the actual meaning of the Second Amendment, pointing out historical reality comes quite naturally to us.



McTag wrote:
when all circumstances nowadays are entirely different from Stuart England or Revolutionary America.


Freedom is not some fleeting phenomenon, once enjoyed by our ancestors, but that we in the present are now unable to enjoy.

Americans are not going to be giving up our freedom. Ever. We don't care how much you like not being free. We don't like not being free, and we aren't ever going to do it.



McTag wrote:
I am informed the USA has now got a standing army, quite a large one. Shouldn't it now turn its attention to the well-armed local "militia" and the harm they cause the nation?


That is wrong in so many ways it is hard to know where to start.

First, the militia was NEVER about filling in because we couldn't manage a standing army. Rather, the militia was preferred over a standing army.

The fact that we do have a standing army today, means that it is even MORE urgent that we also have a militia on hand. The Constitution demands it.


Second, there is no militia currently for any attention to be turned to. Because even though it is Constitutionally urgent that we have such a militia, the government is ignoring the Constitution and refusing to have such a militia.

What you are wrongly referring to as a militia are actually ordinary civilians exercising their right to carry guns for self defense.


And third, there is no harm being done to the nation by ordinary Americans exercising their right to carry guns for self defense.

But if there actually were such harm being done, that would just be too bad, because our Constitutional rights take precedent.



McTag wrote:
Those who want to play at being Davy Crockett could still keep a musket at home.


Note that modern militiamen have the right to keep automatic rifles, grenades/grenade launchers, and bazookas in their homes.

Muskets are obsolete weapons.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 05:36 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:
Yes, that's the one. It could quite adequately supersede local "militia", unless you have other information?


It is AGAINST THE LAW for the standing army to supersede the militia.

The Constitution demands that we always have a militia. Period.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2012 05:38 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:
Which avoids another point. Every modern state repeals out-dated laws, or rewrites them.


Americans do not regard freedom as an outdated concept. We intend to remain free until the end of time.
0 Replies
 
 

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