Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

@oralloy,

The Federal government requires registration of every automatic weapon. You have to be able to produce that registration if asked. That is the same thing as a license. You carry the paperwork. The government keeps a record of it.

Unless of course you are OK with registering guns. I doubt that however based on your out of this reality rants.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

But there is no need to obtain the ATF's permission or anything like that.

So let me get this straight. All NFA weapons must be registered with the owners name but the owners don't need to get any permission to own said weapon? Your logic is now beyond pretzel.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Sorry but it did stated that the ATF need to approve you owning such weapons and that imply that they can disapproved you owning such weapons.

I also assume they send you a letter or some such that they had approved your ownership.

The statement was misleading.

The ATF does give an applicant a fingerprint and background check, and someone who doesn't pass muster there can be denied.

But the ATF has no ability to deny someone on a whim if they pass their background checks.

The CLEO sign-off allows people to deny on a whim, but the CLEO signoff has nothing to do with ATF agents. And it is ultimately more a game of persistence than outright denial, as people can keep trying different CLEOs until they get a signature.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Question in such cable TV shows as gunsmoke they had shown them manufacturing new auto weapons and selling them to private individuals and it is my understanding that no such weapon manufacture after 1986 or so can be transfer to a private person.

If memory serve me correctly one show in fact build a brand new BAR type weapon and sold it to the idiot motorcycle guy Jesse James who cheated on his wife Sandra Bullock.

Seem odds given the current laws.

If someone is a licensed dealer in NFA weapons, they can own post-1986 guns.

I don't know if that is what happened in this case.

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@parados,

parados wrote:

The Federal government requires registration of every automatic weapon. You have to be able to produce that registration if asked. That is the same thing as a license.

That is not even close to the same thing as a license.

You have to have your car registration with you when you drive. Try telling a police officer that your car registration is the same thing as a drivers license.

Try owning a full auto in a state where you are required to have a license for it, and telling them your NFA registration counts as a license.

parados wrote:

You carry the paperwork. The government keeps a record of it.

That does not change the reality that registration is not a license.

parados wrote:

Unless of course you are OK with registering guns. I doubt that however

I'd prefer it if there were no registration. But my preference does not alter the reality that registration is not a license.

parados wrote:

based on your out of this reality rants.

Big words for someone who cannot show a single fact I've ever gotten wrong.

1 Reply

@parados,

parados wrote:

Oralloy wrote:
But there is no need to obtain the ATF's permission or anything like that.

So let me get this straight. All NFA weapons must be registered with the owners name but the owners don't need to get any permission to own said weapon?

Not from the ATF. They do the fingerprint and background checks, but they have no power to deny anyone who passes their checks.

parados wrote:

Your logic is now beyond pretzel.

You're smart enough to follow it. Ultimately it is based on just sticking to the facts no matter what.

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@oralloy,

Quote:

You have to have your car registration with you when you drive. Try telling a police officer that your car registration is the same thing as a drivers license.

GOOD GOD.. Are you really that stupid? Try telling a police officer that your driver's license is your car's license. They are completely different things. Licensing your car means you get a license to put on the car and a registration to put in the car. You can't drive your car without that license on it even if you have your driver's license.

When a state has MORE requirements it makes no difference to the Federal requirements. The state government is different from the Federal government. Did you bother to take civics when you were in HS?

1 Reply

@parados,

parados wrote:

Oralloy wrote:
You have to have your car registration with you when you drive. Try telling a police officer that your car registration is the same thing as a drivers license.

GOOD GOD.. Are you really that stupid?

I remind you that my IQ is four time higher than yours is.

parados wrote:

Try telling a police officer that your driver's license is your car's license. They are completely different things. Licensing your car means you get a license to put on the car and a registration to put in the car. You can't drive your car without that license on it even if you have your driver's license.

Yes. Just as licensing is different from registration, registration is different from licensing.

parados wrote:

When a state has MORE requirements it makes no difference to the Federal requirements.

True. But that does not exempt you from needing to follow state law as well as federal law.

Go ahead and try having a full auto in a state that requires licensing for it, with just your federal NFA registration to serve as your "license".

The government will provide you a number of years to fully ponder the difference between licensing and registration.

parados wrote:

The state government is different from the Federal government.

True. But that does not exempt you from needing to follow state law as well as federal law.

Go ahead and try having a full auto in a state that requires licensing for it, with just your federal NFA registration to serve as your "license".

The government will provide you a number of years to fully ponder the difference between licensing and registration.

parados wrote:

Did you bother to take civics when you were in HS?

Yes. Notice the way I am continuously correcting you on point after point after point?

I don't even have to look anything up. It's all coming from memory.

3 Replies

@oralloy,

oralloy wrote:

I remind you that my IQ is four time higher than yours is.

Don't be ridiculous, you're clearly mentally subnormal.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

The government will provide you a number of years to fully ponder the difference between licensing and registration.

And there will be plenty of time to ponder how free you are as well.

James Madison pointed out that the Government formed by the Constitutional Convention----

Quote:

... being a novelty & a compound, had no technical terms or phrases appropriate to it; and that old terms were to be used in new senses, explained by the context or the facts of the case.

The population of the 13 states along the north east Atlantic coast, in size, composition, education and economic activity in 1787 can only be considered a similar context to now by somebody emotionally driven by a personal psychology (the mug) or involved in the business of providing the mugs with firearms and an obviously false sense of security.

It's a great business idea. The more guns there are in circulation the more guns are required.

2 Replies

@spendius,

If personal protection is the main factor then guns should be available on welfare. People who can't afford guns and ammo are more at risk than those who can and thus are being discriminated against.

Compare the fuss about a NYC hotel cleaning woman's self-serving and false allegations about the IMF chief with the fuss made about the black kid killed in Chicago a couple of weeks back by gun owners when she was unarmed.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

oralloy wrote:
I remind you that my IQ is four time higher than yours is.

Don't be ridiculous, you're clearly mentally subnormal.

You trash shouldn't run around falsely accusing your betters of your own stupidity.

0 Replies

@spendius,

spendius wrote:

James Madison pointed out that the Government formed by the Constitutional Convention----

Quote:
... being a novelty & a compound, had no technical terms or phrases appropriate to it; and that old terms were to be used in new senses, explained by the context or the facts of the case.

The population of the 13 states along the north east Atlantic coast, in size, composition, education and economic activity in 1787 can only be considered a similar context to now by somebody emotionally driven by a personal psychology

Nope. Freedom was not a fleeting concept, to be enjoyed only by our ancestors.

Americans will remain free forever, and there is nothing you can do about it.

spendius wrote:

The more guns there are in circulation the more guns are required.

Nonsense.

1 Reply

@spendius,

spendius wrote:

If personal protection is the main factor then guns should be available on welfare. People who can't afford guns and ammo are more at risk than those who can and thus are being discriminated against.

Compare the fuss about a NYC hotel cleaning woman's self-serving and false allegations about the IMF chief with the fuss made about the black kid killed in Chicago a couple of weeks back by gun owners when she was unarmed.

Fine with me. By all means arm the poor at taxpayer expense.

First time I've seen you post a good idea about guns.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

Fine with me. By all means arm the poor at taxpayer expense.

First time I've seen you post a good idea about guns.

First time I've seen you follow your logic to its proper conclusion that everybody should be openly armed.

I don't consider you to be even remotely free.

According to Stendhal politicians carried weapons in Congress. Do they now?

How do you shake hands with someone who is carrying concealed. The whole point of the handshake was to offer unarmed hands. Concealed weapons are devious.

You ought to have them on show or not have them at all. Houses with weapons inside could have a notice saying "These premises are protected by the NRA."

Security at Manchester Airport have their machine guns on show.

As things stand you have an unfair advantage over those who don't or can't carry guns. They will respect your arguments when heated, or even warmed over in the case of those on a short fuse, more than your arguments deserve.

Get everybody opened and unashamedly tooled up like the 2nd says. Then we all know where we stand. It's you who are wimping it old boy and shifting sophistries around in the syrup with a silver spoon to try to disguise it.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

Freedom was not a fleeting concept, to be enjoyed only by our ancestors.

That's right. Rider Haggard put some flesh on the bones of the abstraction in his African tales. There's a glimpse in them of lived freedom and not of a fantasised yearning to be rid of the overwhelming encroachments of officialdom.

See what a man packs when every ounce he has to carry is a greater concern than it is, or was, to NASA. In a world where freedom doesn't even know its own name and never enters anybody's head.

1 Reply

@spendius,

What about Tiger Woods? Is he packing when he's walking past thousands of people on every working day.

Even I, and a tolerant man I am, felt the urge to throw a bucket of whitewash over him when he made his public confession and contrite apologies before an audience of smirking women. So a serious misogynist might think of trying it sometime.

It was only when I realised that ladling it out that thick and creamy was obviously taking the piss and gloating over his misdeeds that I began tittering which soon escalated into actually ROTFLMAO. Goodstyle.

Which a psychologist might say was a defence mechanism for avoiding the trouble of getting arrested or even of getting off the couch. But I would reply by asking him what he did for laughs. And did he have to go to the gym to compensate.

You should read Rider Haggard's African tales oralloy so that you get an idea what the word means before you start basing all your arguments upon it.

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@oralloy,

Quote:

Yes. Just as licensing is different from registration, registration is different from licensing.

Now you are just niggling.
Registering your car with the government is the same thing as licensing your car with the government. It is a distinction without a real difference as Roger already noted earlier.

Quote:

True. But that does not exempt you from needing to follow state law as well as federal law.

State law is your red herring. Now you are turning it into your strawman. I never stated one could ignore state law since I have only been discussing Federal law.

1 Reply

@parados,

parados wrote:

Oralloy wrote:
Yes. Just as licensing is different from registration, registration is different from licensing.

Now you are just niggling.
Registering your car with the government is the same thing as licensing your car with the government. It is a distinction without a real difference as Roger already noted earlier.

No, it is a very important distinction. With cars you might merely be using sloppy inaccurate language. But guns don't have license plates on them. Such sloppy inaccurate language does not work when it comes to guns.

parados wrote:

Oralloy wrote:
True. But that does not exempt you from needing to follow state law as well as federal law.

State law is your red herring. Now you are turning it into your strawman. I never stated one could ignore state law since I have only been discussing Federal law.

It is neither a red herring nor a straw man that some states only allow people to have full autos if they have a federal license.

It is neither a red herring nor a straw man that neither the state governments nor the federal government consider NFA registration to be such a "license".

If anyone is foolish enough to believe what you've been posting here, they will end up spending 10 years in federal prison for their folly.

(It'll be federal prison too, because even though the requirement for the federal license is from state law, if someone violates that requirement it makes their machinegun illegal, and the prohibition against illegal machineguns is in federal law.)

2 Replies

@oralloy,

Quote:

But guns don't have license plates on them.

I understood from another poster that they did. They have ballistic fingerprints as well.

1 Reply

Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

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