37
   

Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

 
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:35 pm
@dlowan,
Access it easily. But what I get is an Australian realtor's site. Laughing
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:39 pm
@firefly,
Sorry we are still talking about a very very very tiny subset of humans who are mass killers the vast majority of people who are bully and depressed and have serous mental problems for that matter that never harm anyone let along do mass murders.

Saying someone was bully or depressed or bipolar is no more getting at the root cause then saying someone had red hair as a lot of people have those characters.

firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:40 pm
@dlowan,
A real estate listing, dlowan?
dlowan
 
  3  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:40 pm
@dlowan,
It's interesting in terms of the sociology of this having been a fairly recent means of young men showing disaffection. It's a bit like how florid expressions of hysteria were for a time a common means for young women in a few societies to express distress. Or like the epidemics of men believing that their balls are being retracted back up into their bodies in some Asian cultures.....or the amok thing he talks about.

I'm also interested that he is saying that certain patterns of Internet usage are predictive...as, of course, the purchase of multiple guns and lots of ammunition.
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:41 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:

A real estate listing, dlowan?


Good grief!
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:45 pm
@dlowan,
dlowan wrote:

I think this discussion of the phenomenon is interesting:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-07-22/forensic-psych-on-violent-minds/4146324


Can you access that, ff?

Edit


Tried again with proper URL!


Blush...there you go!
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:47 pm
@dlowan,
Quote:
certain patterns of Internet usage are predictive...as, of course, the purchase of multiple guns and lots of ammunition.


Junk science 101 as buying a lot of guns and ammunition say nothing I been in homes that had more guns and ammunition then most gun shops and the proud owners had never even gone over the speed limit.

Where you go on the web is predicted of becoming a mass murderer?

Love to see the list of those sites............
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:48 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Lustig Andrei wrote:

Access it easily. But what I get is an Australian realtor's site. Laughing


Yes...but what did you think of the place?
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 03:55 pm
@BillRM,
You seem to think that mass shootings and killings are rare. They are not. And the people responsible are not all nuts.

This incident happened only 3 days before the movie theater shooting.
Quote:
Accused Ala. bar gunman charged in 2nd shooting
By JAY REEVES and JEFF MARTIN
Jul. 17, 2012

TUSCALOOSA, Ala. (AP) — A gunman stood outside of a crowded downtown bar and opened fire from two different positions early Tuesday, sending patrons running or crawling for cover in a chaotic and bloody scene. At least 17 people were hurt as bullets ricocheted and glass shards and brick chunks fell around the nightclub.

Nathan Van Wilkins, 44, surrendered about 10 hours after the 12:30 a.m. shooting near the University of Alabama campus, police said. The rampage started a couple of miles away about 45 minutes earlier, police said, when Wilkins knocked on the door to a home and waited for a person to answer it. He then started firing, wounding the person.

Wilkins was also suspected of setting three fires to equipment or property owned by his former employer, an oil and gas company.
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/multiple-people-hurt-tuscaloosa-bar-shooting
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 04:06 pm
@dlowan,
I love listening to this man and found that he was talking about someones like Churchill in his younger days focusing on military and glory and weapons and so on.

Note Churchill for all his life had periods of depressions that he name his black dogs and was careful not to go too near the edge of train platforms in fear a wave of depression would result in him jumping.

Next in any case the good professor wish governments to keep track of everyone use of the internet and if the government do not care for the sites you are visiting they are going to come and placed you under an examination to see if you might be the next mass murderer.

Not sure who is more insane but the good professor is not all there to say the least.



0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 04:09 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
You seem to think that mass shootings and killings are rare. They are not. And the people responsible are not all nuts.


Yes they are rare given that we are a country of 311 millions and a world population of 7 billions or so.

Footnote non-rare events are not cover in the details and depth that the news is covering this shottings.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 04:15 pm
@dlowan,
Hmmm....just read some research saying that this sort of mass murder became more common in the twenties and thirties....but has increased in number since the sixties.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 04:21 pm
@dlowan,
Quote:
Hmmm....just read some research saying that this sort of mass murder became more common in the twenties and thirties....but has increased in number since the sixties.


Low freguency events are hard to draw conclusions from as the noise tend to be high compare to any possible trends.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 04:57 pm
@dlowan,
http://www.salon.com/2011/01/12/jared_loughner_mass_murderers_diagnose/singleton/

Why psychiatrists can’t predict mass murderers
Violent events like Tucson make us hunt for warning signs in the mentally ill, but tragedy is impossible to foresee
By Richard J. McNally


Seung-Hui Cho, Nidal Hasan and Jared Lee Loughner

The massacre in Tucson, Ariz., has unleashed a barrage of speculation about the sanity and motives of Jared Loughner, charged with mass murder. Some commentators cite the virulent rhetoric of our polarized political climate as an important cause of the violence, whereas others speculate about the role of mental illness. Driving the debate is the hope that we can identify predictors of mass murder, thereby enabling us to intervene early and prevent similar tragedies in the future.

Shocking, unexpected events motivate a search for explanations that would impose order on an otherwise harrowingly capricious world. The British psychologist Frederic Bartlett noted how people exert an “effort after meaning” to make sense of their experience, and this is especially true for seemingly unpredictable and uncontrollable horrors, which are far more traumatic than ones we can foresee and possibly prevent. The search to make sense of the seemingly senseless is entirely reasonable. Yet several cognitive biases of the human mind make the task of predicting mass violence appear easier than it actually is.

Consider the phenomenon of hindsight bias. As law enforcement investigators uncover more facts about a mass murder, a narrative of how it unfolded emerges. The pieces of the puzzle begin to fall into place, making it easy for us to fall prey to an illusion of inevitability. Once we have a plausible account of what led up to a massacre, it seems obvious that we should have seen it coming. At this point, people begin to ask, “Why didn’t anyone notice that the killer was a walking time bomb, ready to explode?” And if people did notice, why didn’t they do something about it? By making unexpected events seem inevitable in retrospect, hindsight bias can result in finger pointing about who should be held responsible for failing to prevent the catastrophe. Predicting what has already occurred is easy; predicting the future is much tougher.

Clinical researchers have amassed data on people who have committed violence in an effort to formulate psychological profiles associated with mass murder, serial killing and terrorism. By noting the typical characteristics of these people, clinicians hope to identify predictors that might aid prevention efforts.

Let’s assume that we’ve identified a set of characteristics often exhibited by mass murderers. What does that buy us? It enables us to answer the question, “Given that someone is a mass murderer, what characteristics is he likely to exhibit?” That’s an interesting question, but it’s not the one we want to answer. Rather, the question we really want to answer is, “Given that someone exhibits this profile of characteristics, how likely is he to commit mass murder?” Answering this question is extremely difficult because the predictors are invariably far more common than the event we hope to predict, and mass murder is very rare. Although mass murderers often do exhibit bizarre behavior, most people who exhibit bizarre behavior do not commit mass murder.

Media reports about Jared Loughner, the alleged Tucson killer, illustrate this difficulty. His abnormal behavior, however unusual, is still far more common than the crimes of which he is accused. His former classmates mentioned that he had many friends in high school, a girlfriend, and played in a band. Yet after dropping out of high school, he began to change in ominous ways noted by those at Pima Community College. Comments by Loughner’s college classmates and teachers paint a picture of a seriously troubled young man: a weird smile, staring fixedly at others, social isolation, odd speech, and preoccupation with “conscious dreaming.” Loughner’s behavior prompted calls to the campus police on five occasions. As psychiatrist Dr. Fuller Torrey observed in Salon, Loughner was a “textbook” paranoid schizophrenic.

Especially in the wake of the Virginia Tech atrocity, strange behavior in the classroom is bound to awaken concerns about another campus massacre. Yet if we assume that most students exhibiting bizarre behavior are about to commit mass murder, we will be wrong nearly all the time. Almost all cases will be false alarms. Even if most mass murderers turn out to have paranoid schizophrenia, the vast majority of people with this mental illness never commit violence, let alone multiple homicides.

However, not all cases will be false alarms. The consequences of missing a future mass murderer in our midst are appalling, and the enormity of such a mistake fuels the hope that someday science will overcome the daunting challenge of distinguishing the truly
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 05:34 pm
And today, two days after that massacre, just another example of why we should all heed oralloy and David and stockpile guns for s
elf-defense against awful people out to hurt us:

Quote:
Cop shoots and kills son after reportedly mistaking him for an intruderBy NBC News staff

An off-duty police officer shot and killed his son after mistaking him for an intruder, New York State Police said.

Michael Leach, 59, an officer with the Parry Police Department in Wyoming County in western New York state, was staying at a motel in Old Forge. He called 911 early Saturday to say he just shot someone he thought was an intruder, troopers said, according to The Syracuse Post-Standard.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The victim turned out to be his son, Matthew S. Leach, 37, of Rochester.

Troopers said that the elder Leach used his department-issued .45-caliber Glock handgun in the shooting. He was hospitalized after the shooting for what for what troopers described as a "medical issue."

oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 05:53 pm
@MontereyJack,
MontereyJack wrote:
just another example of why we should all heed oralloy and David and stockpile guns for self-defense against awful people out to hurt us:


No one is telling you to stockpile guns. You are being told to stop trying to violate people's civil rights.



Quote:
An off-duty police officer shot and killed his son after mistaking him for an intruder, New York State Police said.


Was his son violently attacking him? If so, how did he fail to recognize it was his son? If not, why did he feel the need to shoot?

Sounds like a curious event.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 05:58 pm
@MontereyJack,
Strange that I had own firearms for four decades and somehow had not shot a family member or a friend or anyone else including animals.

The nearest I had ever come to an accidentally shooting someone was when a gentleman yelled to hold fire and then walked into my line of fire, the only problem was that he yelled hold fired in Spanish and not in English.

The man did not get shot but he did learn some new English words you can not normally use and I learn the words for hold fired in Spanish [ mantenga disparado]



McGentrix
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 06:00 pm
@MontereyJack,
Yes. Yes we should...

Charges unlikely against man who shot robbers

Quote:
OCALA - The Internet cafe patron who shot and injured two men as they tried to rob the business will likely not face any criminal charges.

“Based on what I have seen and what I know at this time, I don't anticipate filing any charges,” said Bill Gladson of the State Attorney's Office for 5th Judicial Circuit.

Gladson said he has reviewed the security surveillance video from the cafe. While he still awaits final reports from the Marion County Sheriff's Office, he said the shooting appeared justified.
Ticomaya
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 06:10 pm
@McGentrix,
Link to the story/video in McG's post.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2012 06:11 pm
He shot because he thought the guy was an intruder. Isn't that why you guys say you need guns, so you can kill intruders. David has above maintained that no one with a gun would ever shoot without being sure of his target, when I suggested mass carnage would ensue in a theater with everyone armed and no one sure who the shooter was. Clearly David might be just a teensy bit starry-eyed about people actually identifying the shooter and firing only at that person. Hey, David, isn't your stock answer in these situations that the person shot should have had a gun? Should the son have had a gun and killed his dad before his dad mis-identified him? You guys simply don't live in the real world.
 

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