37
   

The politics of hoodie wearing

 
 
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 07:32 am
You can download the pdf from the left box in this article.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/17/2804442/law-officers-set-to-release-evidence.html

The 911 calls and a diagram of the neighborhood can be found here.
http://www.miamiherald.com/trayvon/

I know... I have way too much time on my hands.
FreeDuck
 
  6  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 07:40 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Me thinks that the state is going to end up laughed out of court if Zimmerman is stout enough to resist their efforts to get him to plead out.....


I don't know. I think he'd have to show that he was "attacked" and didn't provoke the fight, or that if he did, he tried to end the conflict and Trayvon continued to hit him. My hunch is that he'll have to show old fashioned self-defense -- that he couldn't get away and he feared for his life. One thing I think that factors into that is the fact that he knew the police were coming and at least one witness had already told him (and Trayvon) that he was calling 911. Indeed the police showed up seconds after he killed him.

If you can start a fight and then shoot the other person when you start losing, if that's legal, woe unto Florida. That leaves those of us who don't carry weapons the option of taking a beating from a gun carrier or getting shot. I can't see how that's acceptable for public safety.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 07:56 am
Better links here, including some recorded interviews, for the obsessively interested.

http://www.baynews9.com/content/news/baynews9/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2012/5/17/zimmerman_discovery_.html
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 07:58 am
@DrewDad,
After a decade, I'm well aware of the traffic here, thanks.

Everyone was quite happy to give opinions when there were no witness accounts - and to jump on the Bad Zimmerman bandwagon. I'm not surprised, but still really disappointed, to see no one even remark about the new information and their evolving views.Makes one think that there was never really interest in the FACTS, but how a sad case fed their political views.

When it ceases to do that, they cover their eyes and walk away.



gungasnake
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:17 am
@Lash,
Quote:
Makes one think that there was never really interest in the FACTS, but how a sad case fed their political views.


Congratulations, you've just discovered how the demoKKKrat/libtard mind works. The lesson sticks a thousand times better when people see it for themselves rather than hearing it from others.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  4  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:37 am
@Lash,
Quote:

After a decade, I'm well aware of the traffic here, thanks.

Everyone was quite happy to give opinions when there were no witness accounts - and to jump on the Bad Zimmerman bandwagon. I'm not surprised, but still really disappointed, to see no one even remark about the new information and their evolving views.Makes one think that there was never really interest in the FACTS, but how a sad case fed their political views.

When it ceases to do that, they cover their eyes and walk away.


Jeez you're self-righteous and selectively perceptive. I commented directly to all your posturing about Zimmerman being "attacked", and about what I think all this new evidence means. But just in case you missed it during your bloaviations about what this is supposed to prove, I'll C&P it just for you. You'll clearly see I'm not reticent to comment in the face of all the "new evidence", unless you're only interested in reading what agrees with you:

...All this proves is that Zimmerman got his ass beaten soundly before he shot Martin. It does NOT mean that Zimmenman is a victim. It does NOT affect the fact that had he simply reported he thought he saw someone suspicious and left it at that, Martin would be alive.

We know that as a result of Zimmerman pursuing Martin a fight happened, and Martin got shot. I guess those of you concluding that Martin "attacked" Zimmerman are doing so because you are predisposed to believe it.

And let me say one more thing. I do not have a son, but if I did, I hope that he would not have allowed himself to be cowed down by this wannabe cop. I hope that he would have told Zimmerman that it was none of his goddam business why he was minding his own business, walking home.

And I hope that if Zimmerman continued to advance on him he would have beat the living dogshit out of him, just like Martin appears to have done. In this imaginary scenario though, I hope the coward would have the decency to just take his ass whupping and leave instead of pulling a gun and ending a life.





FreeDuck
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:45 am
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

Everyone was quite happy to give opinions when there were no witness accounts - and to jump on the Bad Zimmerman bandwagon. I'm not surprised, but still really disappointed, to see no one even remark about the new information and their evolving views.Makes one think that there was never really interest in the FACTS, but how a sad case fed their political views.


I'm not sure that's actually true though I'm sure it IS true for some people, the same way that others had one opinion about this case that quickly changed when the right wing media started covering it, mostly from the angle of painting Trayvon as a gang-banger, drug dealer and amateur burglar. Gungasnake is a prime example but there are others. This case turned very political, which is a shame, because it blew up primarily because there was no arrest. And I still believe an arrest was justified.

Additionally, I think a lot of FACTS were available and some that you consider new are not really new. Some of the witness accounts were already reported (though second hand), including multiple accounts of Trayvon on top of Zimmerman right before he was shot. One of the 911 calls, in fact, describes this. True there was a lot of noise and hyperbole (and there still is) but many facts were available. The initial police report was published on Sanford's website. The 911 calls and Zimmerman's call to dispatch were released months ago. NBC edited that call to dispatch, but it had been available on the web unedited for weeks. (BTW, at least one Zimmerman lie is revealed in that call. He tells the dispatcher that he thinks Trayvon is "in his late teens" but in his bail hearing apology he said he didn't know how young he was and thought he was "a little younger" than himself. ) The information was there for those interested enough to look past the opinion pieces, or those who were interested in the case more than the secondary racial and political aspects of those who were protesting it.

Again, I'm not sure which people you are referring to, but if I'm one of them I would just point out that my views have not evolved and remain basically the same, and from what I can tell are probably pretty close to your own. You can search my posts on the subject, or take a look at my "Florida's Stand Your Ground Law" thread, before David came in and **** all over it. Doesn't mean I'm right, and doesn't mean I might not change my mind if some game changing evidence comes along. So far it just hasn't, IMO. I'm not a big fan of the mob mentality either, but if he had been arrested in the first place none of this would have happened.
gungasnake
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:47 am
@snood,
Quote:
We know that as a result of Zimmerman pursuing Martin a fight happened, and Martin got shot.



Sorry, but we don't know that. The evidence suggests that Zimmerman got out of his car to check an address and was walking back to his car when Martin sucker punched him and then pounced and tried to kill him.

And if you're going to raise children to behave like that, you need to get used to the idea that there are numerous ways that they might not live past teenage years.
FreeDuck
 
  6  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:54 am
@gungasnake,
gungasnake wrote:

Sorry, but we don't know that. The evidence suggests that Zimmerman got out of his car to check an address and was walking back to his car when Martin sucker punched him and then pounced and tried to kill him.


I'm sorry that is contrary to the evidence, unless Trayvon somehow dragged Zimmerman between the houses in the complex, far from where any street sign would ever be placed. Not even Zimmerman is claiming that. He admits to following the kid in the call to dispatch.
Irishk
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 08:56 am
@gungasnake,
Quote:
The evidence suggests
That would be Zimmerman's word?

We already know that Zimmerman had formed an opinion of Trayvon, having never met him, by the way.

Maybe we'll get to hear him explain to a jury how he came by that opinion? I hope so.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 09:36 am
@FreeDuck,
Quote:
I'm sorry that is contrary to the evidence, unless Trayvon somehow dragged Zimmerman between the houses in the complex, far from where any street sign would ever be placed.


So you're saying that those cuts on Zimmerman's head were from having his head pounded into grass??
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 09:38 am
@gungasnake,
gungasnake wrote:

Quote:
I'm sorry that is contrary to the evidence, unless Trayvon somehow dragged Zimmerman between the houses in the complex, far from where any street sign would ever be placed.


So you're saying that those cuts on Zimmerman's head were from having his head pounded into grass??

I'm saying he didn't get out of his truck to look for a street sign. And that Trayvon didn't likely "sucker punch" him.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 09:39 am
@FreeDuck,
FreeDuck wrote:
You can download the pdf from the left box in this article.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/17/2804442/law-officers-set-to-release-evidence.html

The 911 calls and a diagram of the neighborhood can be found here.
http://www.miamiherald.com/trayvon/




I know... I have way too much time on my hands.
Your WINGS ??
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 09:40 am
John Lott on Fox News:

Quote:

...With the case unraveling, it makes the prosecutor’s behavior look even more outrageous. The prosecutor wasn’t required to go to the grand jury for the indictment, but the fact that she didn’t in such a high-profile case is troubling. Everyone knows how easy it is for a prosecutor to get a grand jury to indict, because only the prosecutor presents evidence and the standard of proof is very low.

A grand-jury indictment would have provided political cover; that charges were brought without one means that the prosecutor was worried that even a grand jury would not give her the indictment.

The Obama administration has been fanning the flames, and it isn’t just President Obama’s attempt to personalize the tragedy.

News reports surfaced Tuesday that the US Justice Department was pushing hard to charge Zimmerman, who is part black himself, with a hate crime because Martin was black. Such a charge can carry a life prison term or even the death penalty.
Yet, Zimmerman and his wife mentored two black children for free.
A recent Reuters report that interviewed Zimmerman’s neighbors found that both black and Hispanics viewed Zimmerman as someone who cared deeply about his neighbors and volunteered to head the community watch to help them.

The claim that Zimmerman referred to blacks as “f***ing coons” has long since been dropped.

Using this case for political purposes has already come at a real cost. In Gainesville, Florida; Oak Park, Illinois; Mobile, Alabama; Toledo, Ohio; Grand Rapids, Michigan; and possibly Norfolk, Va., blacks have attacked whites in what they think is revenge for Zimmerman attacking Martin because he was black, and those are just the cases where the perpetrators would make some comment such as “This is for Trayvon.”
The media has been partially responsible for this aftermath with its sensational reporting. Recent coverage has helped to balance things out, but responsible reporting requires still more.

Bottom line: the medical reports about George Zimmerman are revealing a lot more information than the media have so far let on.

John R. Lott, Jr. is a FOXNews.com contributor. He is an economist and co-author of "Debacle: Obama's War on Jobs and Growth and What We Can Do Now to Regain Our Future."


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/05/16/what-zimmerman-martin-medical-reports-tell-us-and-media-didnt/#ixzz1vKYPiN9i


What we have here is another political hack prosecutor soon to join Mike Nifong flipping burgers for a living at the golden arches.

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRixo17GzmQeiMXGwrYYl2RW-aM2JCjhqma1Y54GJg2emIIrUhbcw
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 09:47 am
@FreeDuck,

gungasnake wrote:

Quote:
I'm sorry that is contrary to the evidence, unless Trayvon somehow dragged Zimmerman between the houses in the complex, far from where any street sign would ever be placed.


So you're saying that those cuts on Zimmerman's head were from having his head pounded into grass??
FreeDuck wrote:
I'm saying he didn't get out of his truck to look for a street sign. And that

Trayvon didn't likely "sucker punch" him.
HOW do u know this ????
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 10:58 am
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

http://youtu.be/iuPmu8UUbpQ

I know people will want to use the news outlet (Fox, of course) to discount the report; however, a man gave testimony that led to the initial decision not to arrest Zimmerman.

The man is only known as John - at this point. I've seen more accounts of this story - but so far not on major outlets.

Watching.

I think it is possible that news outlets are loathe to run this - an unpopular angle to the story.


Just getting around to viewing the clip and noting it was published on March 24th. I can't tell the date of broadcast. I've seen it reported in major news outlets and this witness appears to be the most quoted witness since the evidence dump (and probably before). He also, if this is the same witness, reportedly is no longer sure who was calling for help. That doesn't mean it wasn't Zimmerman, it just means it was dark outside and we may never know who it was.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 11:05 am
@gungasnake,
gungasnake wrote:

One other thing I've mentioned on another thread... If this had been a prize fight, real life, the commissioner's drug sniffing dog would have walked into the ring and bitten Trayvon Martin (your "role model" for kids) on the ass, and Martin would have been disqualified and lost his license to box.



I doubt anyone would pay to see a prize fight between 158 lb kid and a 200 lb adult. Especially if the kid was a pot smoker. They wouldn't even be in the same weight class.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 12:05 pm
@FreeDuck,
The news reports say that the witness account of Trayvon on top of Zimmerman, beating him, while Zimmerman was yelling for help - is what strengthened Zimmerman's SYG defense - and caused police not to arrest. I'd scoured the web for any type of witness accounts - and couldn't find any until yesterday. (reliable ones, anyway)

I'd have to agree with Zimmerman's initial freedom from arrest if accounts are accurate. However, if law enforcement made an argument of an "entrapment" of sorts of Trayvon (due to unwarranted following), I'd likely have a different opinion.

_________________________________________

Generally speaking - the hub-bub around here was bustling as long as the crime appeared to be a one-sided affair with an innocent black kid and an evil racist white shooter (probably a Republican... voted for Bush, to be sure...). Now that the story shows shades of gray, dialogue has dried up significantly. Just observing and saying it.



Setanta
 
  5  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 12:43 pm
If dialogue is drying up it is likely a result of fatigue . . . too much hysterical defense of the shooter based on little to no evidence at all . . .
Rockhead
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2012 12:46 pm
@Setanta,
but....

he was approved for concealed carry. he is obviously above reproach and should be taken at his word.

whatever it keeps changing to be...
 

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