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Cheney to be dumped?

 
 
PDiddie
 
Reply Wed 28 Jan, 2004 11:00 pm
Dick Cheney has become a serious political liability for George W. Bush, and the GOP would be very, very smart to dump him. According to Jeannette Walls at MSNBC,it could happen.

Quote:
A well-placed source says that the president will "most likely" drop Dick Cheney from his re-election ticket and his first choice for a replacement is former New York City mayor Rudy Giuliani.

"The issue of Cheney's health will probably be given as the reason," says the insider. "There's a short list of possible replacements, and Rudy is at the top of the list."

The source adds that the selection of the former New York mayor may be overridden by Bush advisors from the far right. "Giuliani has been pro-choice, pro-gay rights, and is pretty liberal on some other social issues, but the thinking is that he might broaden Bush's appeal."

If, however, Giuliani gets bumped from the ticket, says the source, "expect him to get a prime assignment in Washington as an consolation prize."

Bush's rep didn't return calls, and a spokeswoman for Giuliani said, "Rudy Giuliani has been out in Iowa and New Hampshire talking about the incredible accomplishments of Vice President Dick Cheney with George Bush and working very hard to get them both re-elected."


I would imagine Colin Powell and even Condi Rice might be mentioned in any VP speculation also.

Is this a realistic possibility? I think so, and I would even go so far as to say that Guliani would be a masterstroke of brilliance from Karl Rove.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 2,301 • Replies: 24
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Jan, 2004 11:03 pm
Er...i thought Darth Cheney was actually running the show?
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Jan, 2004 11:12 pm
Oh. Interesting.

My first reaction is, "Ha! Showing a weakness! Good!" But they can somewhat plausibly blame the health thing.

Hmmm.
0 Replies
 
Wy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 02:57 am
Elect a Democrat and it won't matter.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 07:49 am
You mean Cheney has decided to dump himself.

Wow!

Well, if he says so -- the dummy has to do it.
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 10:58 am
This is news to me. I can't imagine Rudy playing second fiddle to anyone as VP. His ego is too large...
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yeahman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 11:21 am
Since 9/11 Giuliani has become Bush's little bitch. It's sad really. Giuliani was a guy who endorsed Mario Cuomo and Clinton. Like most New York politicans he was a Democrat prior to running for mayor. He would gladly accept the VP position.

But seriously, is Cheney going to let someone else take his place? I don't think so. It would be a good move for the party though. If Bush wins a 2nd term, Cheney has no shot at the presidental nomination in 2008. That would require him to talk to the public.

My guess is that Cheney stays on and if Bush wins a 2nd term Giuliani and/or Jeb will be running in 2008 against Hilary.
0 Replies
 
mac11
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 11:26 am
Funny you should bring this up, PDiddie. This morning I saw a Bush/Cheney 2004 bumper sticker. It seemed a little early to be printing those!
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 11:26 am
Who IS behind it? That could be really significant. If it's not Cheney's idea, (and if this "source" knows of what he/ she speaks) there will probably be a mighty internal battle, and that's a good thing. (From my commie pinko liberal bleeding heart etc. perspective.)
0 Replies
 
williamhenry3
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 12:33 pm
Dubya without Cheney would be like Laurel without Hardy. Or, like Halliburton without billions of dollars gleaned from questionable government contracts.
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 12:36 pm
Which may be why he may leave. He could then reap the profits of Halliburton's contracts, and remain the power behind the throne, but not subject to the scrutiny his position as vice-president entails.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 12:37 pm
From another thread, but seems pertinent:

McGentrix wrote:
The Bush conspiracy theory generator.

Want to come up with your own conspiracy theory about Bush? Don't let Al Franken, Michael Moore, and MoveOn.org have all the fun! Use this handy George W. Bush Conspiracy Theory Generator to come up with your own conspiracy theory!*



* This tool may not be used to create Democratic presidential candidate speeches or generate content for MoveOn.org without the express permission of Buttafly.com.
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 01:39 pm
Dick Cheney is only a political liability to those who don't like Cheney in the first place. Among Republicans, Cheney remains popular, so there's no point in dumping him (of course, if it turns out that he is the one who "outed" CIA op Valerie Plame, then he might have get his presidential pardon as a private citizen).

As for the "well-placed source" who divulged this rumor, it's possible that the White House is launching a trial baloon to see if Cheney really is popular with the GOP rank-and-file. Or it could be a disgruntled administration figure, possibly with ties to Colin Powell or someone else in the anti-Cheney camp, trying to start a groundswell of opinion for replacing the vice-president-in-chief. Frankly, I don't put much stock in these kinds of rumors, but I suppose anything is possible.

In any event, Giuliani would never be named as Cheney's replacement. He's too liberal, too ethnic, too urban, too divorced, too Catholic, and too popular to fit on a ticket with Bush, who would want someone who can be a team player and work quietly in the background. And Giuliani would never be acceptable to the Republican right-wingnuts who would crucify him for his social liberalism, his messy personal life, and his Papism.

Anyway, Bush wants Cheney because Cheney won't be gunning for his job in 2008, and Bush doesn't want his vice-president to be his "heir-apparent" in that presidential election. After all, that's when Jeb Bush is supposed to succeed to the presidency (how's that for a conspiracy theory, McG?)
0 Replies
 
Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 01:49 pm
Excellent analysis, joe! Full points in all respects...
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 01:52 pm
Joe rules!
0 Replies
 
Wy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 01:56 pm
What d'art said... I love it when one of y'all express my views so well!
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 02:10 pm
Thanks, D'artagnan.

Frank Apisa wrote:
Joe rules!

Frank, we've got to stop agreeing with each other. This is becoming a disturbing trend.

EDIT: Oh, and thanks also to you, Wy
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 02:14 pm
joefromchicago wrote:
Thanks, D'artagnan.

Frank Apisa wrote:
Joe rules!

Frank, we've got to stop agreeing with each other. This is becoming a disturbing trend.



Don't worry.

We've got lots of space between us.

I'm settin' ya up! :wink: :wink:
0 Replies
 
PDiddie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 04:56 pm
The first article I linked above discounts Guliani as a running mate for the reasons joefromchicago has elaborated; this one focuses more on the possibility that Cheney will be replaced rather than speculate on the possible replacements:

Quote:
The vice president, whose apparent moderation and 35-year Washington experience reassured voters worried about the callowness and inexperience of Bush during the 2000 campaign, is seen more and more by Republican Party politicos as a drag on the president's re-election chances in what is expected to be an extremely close race.

The reasons are simple: instead of the moderate voice of wisdom and caution that voters thought they were getting in the vice president, ongoing disclosures about his role in the drive to war in Iraq and other controversial administration plans depict him as an extremist who constantly pushed for the most radical measures.

He is seen as not just an extremist, but also a kind of eminence grise who exercises undue influence over Bush to further a radical agenda, a notion that was backed by the publication of a recent book about former treasury secretary Paul O'Neill, who described Cheney as creating a "kind of praetorian guard around the president" that blocked out contrary views.

* * *

Reports were already surfacing two months ago that a discreet "dump Cheney" movement had been launched by intimate associates of Bush's father (former president George H W Bush) - his national security adviser Brent Scowcroft and former secretary of state James Baker, who now has a White House appointment as Bush Jr's personal envoy to persuade official creditors to reduce substantially Iraq's US$110 billion foreign debt.

In addition to their perception that Cheney's presence would harm Bush's re-election chances, Scowcroft and Baker, who battled frequently with the vice president when he was defense secretary in the first Bush administration, have privately expressed great concern over Cheney's unparalleled influence over the younger Bush and the damage that has done to US relations with longtime allies, particularly in Europe and the Arab world...

"I think he knows that he's in trouble," one prominent Republican activist who thinks Cheney should be dropped said this week. "I don't think there's any other way to explain why he would sit for a puerile interview for the [Washington Post's] Style section. You know he despises that sort of thing."
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Jan, 2004 06:24 pm
It was tossed around months ago by the supposedly politically savvy that Cheney and Rummy would either be out or in different roles complelely after this term, even if Bush continued.
0 Replies
 
 

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