53
   

New York New York!

 
 
failures art
 
  4  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 01:49 pm
@Brandon9000,
You're welcome to present a constitutional argument why same sex marriage must be banned at any time.

You're blushing.

A
R
T
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 02:09 pm
Very interesting and Good For Them!

Quote:
In the 35th-floor conference room of a Manhattan high-rise, two of Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo’s most trusted advisers held a secret meeting a few weeks ago with a group of super-rich Republican donors.

Over tuna and turkey sandwiches, the advisers explained that New York’s Democratic governor was determined to legalize same-sex marriage and would deliver every possible Senate vote from his own party.

Would the donors win over the deciding Senate Republicans? It sounded improbable: top Republican moneymen helping a Democratic rival with one of his biggest legislative goals.

But the donors in the room — the billionaire Paul Singer, whose son is gay, joined by the hedge fund managers Cliff Asness and Dan Loeb — had the influence and the money to insulate nervous senators from conservative backlash if they supported the marriage measure. And they were inclined to see the issue as one of personal freedom, consistent with their more libertarian views.

Within days, the wealthy Republicans sent back word: They were on board. Each of them cut six-figure checks to the lobbying campaign that eventually totaled more than $1 million.

Steve Cohen, the No. 2 in Mr. Cuomo’s office and a participant in the meeting, began to see a path to victory, telling a colleague, “This might actually happen.” More
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 02:45 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:
Very interesting and Good For Them!

Quote:
In the 35th-floor conference room of a Manhattan high-rise, two of Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo’s most trusted advisers held a secret meeting a few weeks ago with a group of super-rich Republican donors.

Over tuna and turkey sandwiches, the advisers explained that New York’s Democratic governor was determined to legalize same-sex marriage and would deliver every possible Senate vote from his own party.

Would the donors win over the deciding Senate Republicans? It sounded improbable: top Republican moneymen helping a Democratic rival with one of his biggest legislative goals.

But the donors in the room — the billionaire Paul Singer, whose son is gay, joined by the hedge fund managers Cliff Asness and Dan Loeb — had the influence and the money to insulate nervous senators from conservative backlash if they supported the marriage measure. And they were inclined to see the issue as one of personal freedom, consistent with their more libertarian views.

Within days, the wealthy Republicans sent back word: They were on board. Each of them cut six-figure checks to the lobbying campaign that eventually totaled more than $1 million.

Steve Cohen, the No. 2 in Mr. Cuomo’s office and a participant in the meeting, began to see a path to victory, telling a colleague, “This might actually happen.” More
Is that in any way different than BRIBERY ?

Was Cuomo complicit in a conspiracy
to commit bribery ?
NY Penal Law
Article 200 Section 3
" Bribery in the second degree.
A person is guilty of bribery in the second degree when he confers, or
offers or agrees to confer, any benefit valued in excess of ten thousand
dollars upon a public servant upon an agreement or understanding that
such public servant`s vote, opinion, judgment, action, decision or
exercise of discretion as a public servant will thereby be influenced.
Bribery in the second degree is a class C felony."





David
thack45
 
  2  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 02:50 pm
@jcboy,
You think that's great? Just wait 'til the divorce. Shocked I kid, I kid. It's refreshing to see humans have moved a bit closer to being viewed as equal to one another.
jcboy
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 02:57 pm
@thack45,
That's okay because I don't plan on getting married anytime soon but I would like to be able to someday Wink
realjohnboy
 
  2  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 03:01 pm
@JPB,
Interesting, JPB, on how the political intrigue transpired in the Repub controlled NY Senate worked out.
Gov Cuomo, after setbacks on other issues, decided that he was going to fight for this hard one. The pro-gay movement, as the article you cite noted, was united and didn't tolerate straying from the message. Those opposed never came up with a common theme.
It seems to me that the 1st vote, allowing religious groups to be immune from lawsuits, was big.
That, along with support from some big and vocal Repub donors, helped to convince some Senators (like Saland and Grisanti) to risk the wrath of the social conservatives. My understanding is that a poll of people in NY showed a majority in favor or this.
Finally, I think Obama played it right. I think it is clear that he favors this, but has never said so in as many words. He took some grief at a speech in NYC for that in front of a gay rights crowd. It was, in my mind a correct decision. There are (gasp) some people who want him to fail and he risked becoming a lightening rod.
0 Replies
 
thack45
 
  2  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 03:08 pm
@jcboy,
Still, I'd imagine that in New York there are a few gay people who are in relationships tugging their collars a bit.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 03:40 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:
Very interesting and Good For Them!

Quote:
In the 35th-floor conference room of a Manhattan high-rise, two of Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo’s most trusted advisers held a secret meeting a few weeks ago with a group of super-rich Republican donors.

Over tuna and turkey sandwiches, [DO THAY MIX THE TUNA & THE TURKEY ????] the advisers explained that New York’s Democratic governor was determined to legalize same-sex marriage and would deliver every possible Senate vote from his own party.

Would the donors win over the deciding Senate Republicans? It sounded improbable: top Republican moneymen helping a Democratic rival with one of his biggest legislative goals.

But the donors in the room — the billionaire Paul Singer, whose son is gay, joined by the hedge fund managers Cliff Asness and Dan Loeb — had the influence and the money to insulate nervous senators from conservative backlash if they supported the marriage measure. And they were inclined to see the issue as one of personal freedom, consistent with their more libertarian views.

Within days, the wealthy Republicans sent back word: They were on board. Each of them cut six-figure checks to the lobbying campaign that eventually totaled more than $1 million.

Steve Cohen, the No. 2 in Mr. Cuomo’s office and a participant in the meeting, began to see a path to victory, telling a colleague, “This might actually happen.” More
I don 't care whether the homosexuals get married or thay don 't,
but this raises an interesting issue:
if the new statute was enacted by bribery of the critical votes,
then does that affect the validity of the resulting statute ???

I 'm not sure of whether that has ever been adjudicated.





David
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 03:43 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Why do you assume that bribery was involved? Lobbying is not a synonym for bribery.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 03:55 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
Why do you assume that bribery was involved?
Y do u ASSUME that I "assume" ???
I said: " if . . . ". I 'll stand by that.


Setanta wrote:
Lobbying is not a synonym for bribery.
The factual elements r not yet entirely clear.
A conscientious, scrupulous n dispassionate criminal prosecutor 'd
be interested in WHERE the "more than $1 million dollars" ended up.

This coud be a federal case.
Maybe obama will distribute pardons to get the homosexual vote. U think ?





David
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 07:42 pm
The biggest beneficiaries from this law's passing, in my opinion, are the children that gays are raising. The children can now say their parents are married.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 07:50 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
The biggest beneficiaries from this law's passing, in my opinion, are the children that gays are raising.
The children can now say their parents are married.
If any misbegotten malefactor calls them "bastards" thay can show a marriage certificate.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 08:55 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Sounds like politics as usual to me.
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 09:12 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

farmerman wrote:
anybody ever tell you that you make no sense?
Fido can correct me, if I 'm mistaken,
but in one of his posts, he said that he is mentally disturbed
and he mentioned a particular mental disorder.

I am sort of eclectic when it comes to mental illness... I am even in love... But I also follow the maxim that it is insane to be sane in an insane society, and even down right dangerous...

If you do not have a touch of madness you can never understand a part of what most people do... Only with the presumption that everyone but me and thee are nuts -and I don't know about you, does any of the madness we take for granted in our society make any sense... Look at Weiner for example... Look at all the Gays that want to stand up in public and say YA!; I take it in the butt to have three squares and a roof over my head... What's the choice??? Go to jail???

Sure they're nuts; but are they any nuttier than all the fools who deny themselves love, and being able to say I love you to the gay of their choice just because of holy scripture 2 to 4K years old??? What ever is your excuse for love it has got to be better than any excuse for hatred... I don't want to defend their love; and I don't want to have to defend my own love... It is enough for me that I can still love, that I can care, and promise my caring to the end of my days... Sure it's insane... It is as crazy as a pledge of honor in a dishonorable world... It is as crazy as a moral man in a demoralized world...

What weakness is it to cling to a beautiful person and put all trust in her??? I tell you that weakness is my only strength... I would rather follow her, and have her be my Goddess than General every army in the world... So; crazy I am, and let me wag not my fingers at the love of others... None of us have enough, and too much of all we have only gives us dis-ease....
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 09:24 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

Why do you assume that bribery was involved? Lobbying is not a synonym for bribery.
Since when??? When you see the rich buy their side of every debate with cold hard cash that you don't have, and see your rights eroded simply because you do not have the money to protect them, which is of necessity the money to outbid the rich who want your rights on a platter, then you know that lobbying is an injustice, and the fact that it has the protection of law does not mean it is legal, but only expedient to those who make the laws...

What is not just cannot be law... A smarter man than you, though shorn of his junk, but not of his intellect, said: Jus is the Genus, and Lex is a species of IT... If it is not just, it is not law... Lobbying is bribery... .

If you were a philosopher you would know it is your job to write dictionaries rather than follow them slavishly... Our lives depend upon truth and the true meaning of the words we use... If those spinners want to call their bribery Godbot, what is that to us???... If we cannot see through their double talk we are doomed...
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 09:27 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:
Sounds like politics as usual to me.
Yea, but its not unusual for politicians to get incarcerated for bribery.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 09:57 pm
@Fido,
farmerman wrote:
anybody ever tell you that you make no sense?
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Fido can correct me, if I 'm mistaken,
but in one of his posts, he said that he is mentally disturbed
and he mentioned a particular mental disorder.

Fido wrote:
I am sort of eclectic when it comes to mental illness... I am even in love... But I also follow the maxim
that it is insane to be sane in an insane society, and even down right dangerous...
According to your reasoning, Fido,
the medical personnel in mental hospitals are both INSANE and in DANGER.

I do not agree with that.




Fido wrote:
If you do not have a touch of madness you can never understand a part of what most people do...
I desire that the calculator between my ears function ACCURATELY.




Fido wrote:
Only with the presumption that everyone but me and thee are nuts -and I don't know about you, does any of the madness we take for granted in our society make any sense... Look at Weiner for example... Look at all the Gays that want to stand up in public and say YA!; I take it in the butt to have three squares and a roof over my head... What's the choice??? Go to jail???

Sure they're nuts; but are they any nuttier than all the fools who deny themselves love, and being able to say I love you to the gay of their choice just because of holy scripture 2 to 4K years old??? What ever is your excuse for love it has got to be better than any excuse for hatred... I don't want to defend their love; and I don't want to have to defend my own love... It is enough for me that I can still love, that I can care, and promise my caring to the end of my days... Sure it's insane... It is as crazy as a pledge of honor in a dishonorable world... It is as crazy as a moral man in a demoralized world...

What weakness is it to cling to a beautiful person and put all trust in her??? I tell you that weakness is my only strength... I would rather follow her, and have her be my Goddess than General every army in the world... So; crazy I am, and let me wag not my fingers at the love of others... None of us have enough, and too much of all we have only gives us dis-ease....
Your writing suggests that u like to have FUN with words,
but if u offer them for a response
from your fellows in this forum,
we can only evaluate exactly what u said;
i.e., the ostensible logic of your words.

We can 't DO that, if u have used those words as toys,
altering their meaning (for instance: "It is as crazy as
a moral man in a demoralized world..."; we are not doing POETRY here).

Please note that, in the fullness of sincerity,
I wish u the best Good Fortune and success
in being restored to good mental health.

Fido, with all respect,
I ask that if u can and if u are able to remember:
please write to us in a LOGICAL way,
that figures accurately, like when u add numbers together.





David
ossobuco
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 10:36 pm
Piping up to say this is very satisfying.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 11:04 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:
Piping up to say this is very satisfying.
Well, Osso, I just have a gut-feeling intuition
in the back of my mind
that u r 1OO% INNOCENT of having contributed to the bribe.

It is my earnest belief that u shoud NOT
be prosecuted for involvement in this conspiracy.





David
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 11:21 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Wasn't any bribe involved.
read this - http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2011/06/gay-marriage-waffling.html
 

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