6
   

Experience in resume...

 
 
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 10:55 am
Experience in resume... What I mean is that when you apply for a job, there is always a category for experience. Another category is education. How do you separate which is which? This is racy, but why do employers care at all about the former? With education, you tell the employer what you can do, or what you know. With experience, you tell the employer what you do to get pay. If I am a employer, would I not better be served to know what someone can do for me?

The one case I think experience would be nice is for people with bad GPA, or some liberal art major that pretty much can 't do anything. For those people, it is nice to use your work experience to tell what you can do, instead of what you know from your university degree.

Most people with degrees in the us are pretty damn useless. Liberal arts, and some social science are not worth **** when it comes to getting that first job.

I would suppose most people with go into Eng, because of the high salary, but it is only 5% of the majors in the US universities.




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Type: Discussion • Score: 6 • Views: 7,841 • Replies: 89

 
jespah
 
  4  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:11 am
@TuringEquivalent,
First off, plenty of people in college actually have work experience. Real, live experience -- not everyone starts college the minute they graduate High School. Or, they go to school and work at the same time, or during summers. I used to temp, often as a receptionist. While it wasn't the most perfect of experience, it showed that I could get an hold a job, was responsible enough to show up every day and also that I didn't just spend my summers partying.

Second, resumes are not just written for people getting their first jobs. I realize you may not have meant that but your statements imply that you're only talking about first jobs. I have been in industry now for 30+ years if you count working during college, and for 25 if you just want to count after I got out of Law School. My experience counts for a LOT and, frankly, my education is just a couple of lines on my resume these days. As you get older and progress more through your career, unless you're in education itself as an industry, or you are continually updating your education, that part of your resume tends to get shorter and smaller as your work experience begins to dominate your resume.

And finally, who's to say that any degree is useless? Even standard Liberal Arts stuff is actually, often, more vital than you might think. My brother's degree is in English; my undergrad degree is in Philosophy. Yet our skills are used, and some of those skills came from as far back as college. We both do a lot of writing. And in data analysis jobs I've had to work out logic in much the same way I had to do it in school, determining where certain classes of items intersected, or didn't.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:15 am
@TuringEquivalent,
Quote:

Most people with degrees in the us are pretty damn useless. Liberal arts, and some social science are not worth **** when it comes to getting that first job.


A foolish statement.

Cycloptichorn
TuringEquivalent
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:42 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:

Most people with degrees in the us are pretty damn useless. Liberal arts, and some social science are not worth **** when it comes to getting that first job.


A foolish statement.

Cycloptichorn


Where are you from? The planet of "media studies"? No, it is not foolish, and I am pissed off by you dumb **** statement.
Cycloptichorn
 
  4  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:46 am
@TuringEquivalent,
TuringEquivalent wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:

Most people with degrees in the us are pretty damn useless. Liberal arts, and some social science are not worth **** when it comes to getting that first job.


A foolish statement.

Cycloptichorn


Where are you from? The planet of "media studies"? No, it is not foolish, and I am pissed off by you dumb **** statement.


My Liberal Arts degree has allowed me to earn a great deal of money in a job I enjoy. I had zero problem getting my first job. And most people who work with me also have degrees in Liberal Arts. So yes, your statement was foolish.

You simply have no clue what you are speaking of. I don't know what has caused you to lash out at those who have education, but you aren't displaying a great deal of it yourself when you make statements like that.

Perhaps if you had paid more attention in your Liberal Arts classes, or taken any at all, you would be able to express yourself with a degree of grace as well, instead of this rudimentary rambling.

Cycloptichorn
TuringEquivalent
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:49 am
@jespah,
jespah wrote:

First off, plenty of people in college actually have work experience. Real, live experience -- not everyone starts college the minute they graduate High School. Or, they go to school and work at the same time, or during summers. I used to temp, often as a receptionist. While it wasn't the most perfect of experience, it showed that I could get an hold a job, was responsible enough to show up every day and also that I didn't just spend my summers partying.

Second, resumes are not just written for people getting their first jobs. I realize you may not have meant that but your statements imply that you're only talking about first jobs. I have been in industry now for 30+ years if you count working during college, and for 25 if you just want to count after I got out of Law School. My experience counts for a LOT and, frankly, my education is just a couple of lines on my resume these days. As you get older and progress more through your career, unless you're in education itself as an industry, or you are continually updating your education, that part of your resume tends to get shorter and smaller as your work experience begins to dominate your resume.

And finally, who's to say that any degree is useless? Even standard Liberal Arts stuff is actually, often, more vital than you might think. My brother's degree is in English; my undergrad degree is in Philosophy. Yet our skills are used, and some of those skills came from as far back as college. We both do a lot of writing. And in data analysis jobs I've had to work out logic in much the same way I had to do it in school, determining where certain classes of items intersected, or didn't.


You made some good points about how your experience dominate your education as you get older. As you get older, you get more education, and for me, it ought to be placed in the education section. Ultimately, whatever you know, it ought to be in the education section. The "responsibility" is good point. I think there might be other ways to indicate responsibility other than a large experience section.

0 Replies
 
mars90000000
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:49 am
the reason why both categories are required in a resume is because, if two people have the same experiences, than the one with more education would probably prevail. similarly, if two people have the same education, the experience would probably play an important role
TuringEquivalent
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:55 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

TuringEquivalent wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:

Most people with degrees in the us are pretty damn useless. Liberal arts, and some social science are not worth **** when it comes to getting that first job.


A foolish statement.

Cycloptichorn


Where are you from? The planet of "media studies"? No, it is not foolish, and I am pissed off by you dumb **** statement.


My Liberal Arts degree has allowed me to earn a great deal of money in a job I enjoy. I had zero problem getting my first job. And most people who work with me also have degrees in Liberal Arts. So yes, your statement was foolish.

You simply have no clue what you are speaking of. I don't know what has caused you to lash out at those who have education, but you aren't displaying a great deal of it yourself when you make statements like that.

Perhaps if you had paid more attention in your Liberal Arts classes, or taken any at all, you would be able to express yourself with a degree of grace as well, instead of this rudimentary rambling.

Cycloptichorn


I still say NO. Liberal art majors are useless. That is the value of those majors in the market place. What I mean are majors that don 't give you any practical skills at all.
TuringEquivalent
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 11:59 am
@mars90000000,
mars90000000 wrote:

the reason why both categories are required in a resume is because, if two people have the same experiences, than the one with more education would probably prevail. similarly, if two people have the same education, the experience would probably play an important role


A good point...

What happens when two people go to the same college, gpa=4, and similar work experience. Here is the catch, one of them take more tougher classes, and the other don 't. This is hard to discriminate further.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 12:00 pm
@TuringEquivalent,
Quote:

I still say NO. Liberal art majors are useless. That is the value of those majors in the market place. What I mean are majors that don 't give you any practical skills at all.


And you're still talking out your ass. Do you have any actual experience with this, or are you just projecting your beliefs?

If you believe that LA degrees give you 'no practical skills at all,' you are once again displaying extreme foolishness. I use the skills I learned there every single day, and in fact, repetitive practicing of certain of those skills has given me a leg up over my colleagues who didn't practice those skills.

Cycloptichorn
TuringEquivalent
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 01:06 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:

I still say NO. Liberal art majors are useless. That is the value of those majors in the market place. What I mean are majors that don 't give you any practical skills at all.


And you're still talking out your ass. Do you have any actual experience with this, or are you just projecting your beliefs?

If you believe that LA degrees give you 'no practical skills at all,' you are once again displaying extreme foolishness. I use the skills I learned there every single day, and in fact, repetitive practicing of certain of those skills has given me a leg up over my colleagues who didn't practice those skills.

Cycloptichorn


What I say is true, and your belief is delusional. The value of college major derive from it 's market value. What does it mean? It means in the factor of production market where businesses are buyers, and LA majors are sellers, their demand is to the left of the those with physical science, and Eng majors.
This can be, and "proved" with looking at the raw numbers of recent grads with different college degrees.

What you say is in fact not relevant. The increase in utility value for your degree is not relevant for recent grads. Also, even if the utility value of your shitty LA degree increase with time is in contradiction to the law of diminishing utility. One can reason that as you get more work experience, "your education" matter less, and less. Now, inferior intellect such as yourself will not get it, and I don 't expect you to. What you minimum need to know is that value of a degree is determined by the market place, and it is simply that.
Talking more makes more of a ******* moron. That moron-ness just increase with each marginal increase in the words you spout.
Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 01:10 pm
@TuringEquivalent,
I don't believe you have a degree yourself or any experience working in a situation where they are required - at all. You're simply spouting off bullshit.

Tell us - what is your personal experience in this area? Where did you earn your degree and how has it helped you be more valuable than others who have what you consider to be 'lesser' degrees? Be specific.

I knew I shouldn't have even bothered responding to the first post, as those who can't take the time to write properly certainly have no credibility when it comes to criticizing those who are trained to do so.

Cycloptichorn
Fil Albuquerque
 
  3  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 01:23 pm
@TuringEquivalent,
You mean the "market" demands less queens and more pawn´s, is it that ?
Meaning, there will be always far less generals then soldiers...so what ?
What does that says about usefulness ? You mean making money ?
"Real players" in Liberal Arts, are not those who flood the market after the major´s degree, but that small minority who actually is capable of management...no lack of opportunities for those...so your comparison is not only flawed but linear in scope...

...now I think what you meant is that most people with LA degrees should n´t even be there, which I agree...it is not a majority´s profession.
chai2
 
  3  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 01:38 pm
I am totally confused as to why anyone would disregard experience. In many, many situations I would say it counts for more than formal education.

Is anyone thinking that experience is NOT education?

Take someone with no experience, just education. I have no idea if that person has a good work ethic, or will be gone in a few months.
I know little or nothing about the persons attitude, and ability to work with others.
I certainly wouldn't be looking to hire them for a leadership position, as they have not shown, through their work experience, that they have leadership qualities.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 01:49 pm
@chai2,
Leadership potential that is...does n´t mean you will start from the top...and of course experience is important...
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 02:05 pm
@Fil Albuquerque,
Fil Albuquerque wrote:

...and of course experience is important...


That doesn't seem to be what the OP is saying
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 02:54 pm
@chai2,
I get what he meant in simple terms...and he is partially right regarding some degrees which are a joke, a foll´s paradise...moral corruption is undermining University´s bottom to top these day´s...and it is true that social sciences are the worst of them all...they sell crap to kids and fancy talk under the guise of relativism...most of them know nothing when they get out...these days yoghurt valid PHD´s are a re collection of opinions and hardly propose to defend anything...hard sciences don´t seam to have such difficulties...
jespah
 
  6  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 04:59 pm
@Fil Albuquerque,
I think the idea of throwing experience into some education section is, well, kinda silly. Education, in a resume = college, classes or the like. Experience = work, including volunteer work. A resume is a formal, stylized document. Putting education into the experience section or vice verse doesn't do much except to not get the jobseeker a job. It's a formal document, like a legal brief. It has to be put together in a fairly specific manner (although there is room for variations). But the bottom line is, talking about any of this in the context of a resume is not exactly valid but that's because of the actual requirements of that particular species of document.

Now for the dissing of Liberal Arts majors.

There are people who graduate from college unprepared for the world. I dated a guy who got his degree in mechanical engineering, an eminently practical degree. He sells insurance now (we graduated college in '83 -- we are far from right outta school).

Another went to Law School with me. He works in a dairy (in all fairness to the people in the dairy industry, the dude never passed the Bar).

I did pass the Bar. I work in IT.

One of my former bosses has her PhD in Linguistics. Interesting but impractical, you might say. Yet she has been a manager for over a decade and no, she doesn't have an MBA. Yet she has weathered recessions -- including this one -- without batting an eye.

What is practical? What is useful under the standards?

Computer Science? Languages and programs change by the week. Engineering? In the 70s, engineers with great and wonderful educations in tubes were suddenly made obsolete when transistors came on the scene. Unless they adapted, they died out.

How 'bout degrees in things like English? In most of the jobs I've had (and yes, I mean the IT ones and, actually, I mean those even more), the ability to express oneself coherently on paper is extremely important. More so, often, than any computer class that one may have taken, for a lot of people learn coding. It's not every day that there is a coder who can actually write a coherent and compelling memorandum or other document without it being overly technical or written in marketspeak. I can do that. Most of my computer science colleagues could not.

Who's got the practical major now?
Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 05:25 pm
@jespah,
Fuckin' A right. +5

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Jan, 2011 06:12 pm
@jespah,
Well English or Spanish are the exception right there and Law may well prove interesting as well, but that´s pretty much it...what else would you learn for instance in psychology or sociology and such like, eh ? I speak for myself since I was a student in Educational Sciences...I won´t even start to tell you what I make of it...what a soap opera !
0 Replies
 
 

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