Lordie
 
  2  
Reply Sun 12 Dec, 2010 11:55 am
@existential potential,
I agree.Fear not Death for it motivates us to live fuller and better lives.
Non existence is definitely better than an futile love,emotionless life with no direction.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Dec, 2010 03:23 am
@The Pentacle Queen,
"Death" is a fraud.
Its as fony as a $7 bill
(tho there IS molting).

Human bodies r deciduous.





David
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Dec, 2010 01:22 pm
@Lordie,
Lordie wrote:

Fear not Death for it motivates us to live fuller and better lives.


Baloney

People are not motivated by Death except during acute moments of real or perceived mortal danger.

No one lives every day as if it were their last, and thank goodness for that.

Dasein
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Dec, 2010 02:46 pm
@Lordie,
Quote:
Fear not Death for it motivates us to live fuller and better lives.

Who are you quoting or did the Cardinals get together and make you the Pope?

Coming face-to-face with mortality forces you to re-examine who you are Be-ing. 'You' uncover what you call a "fuller and better" life and you do something or you don't do something about it. There is no such thing as 'motivation'.

BTW - I don't think anybody on the planet is qualified to call something "fuller and better". Maybe if you had lived a 1000 years you might be just a little more qualified than others.
Quote:
Non existence is definitely better than an futile love,emotionless life with no direction.

Not even for an nano-second do you notice that you're 'pigeon-holing' people into your judgments. I didn't realize that you are the standard for living on this planet.

What qualifies you to decree that "Non existence is definitely better than an futile love, emotionless life with no direction."?

Are you 'non-existent"? How did you do that?

Maybe a "futile love, emotionless life with no direction" is a hell of a lot better than "non-existence".

Tell you what. Put together a focus group. Invite non-existent people to make up half of the group and invite people who are in a "futile love, and living an emotionless life with no direction" to make up the other half. Have a discussion with them. Maybe then you'll be qualified to make such a statement. (I think you'll find that the people who are in a "futile love, and living an emotionless life with no direction" are better off than the ones who are non-existent) (LMFAO).

They might even be better off than you. They probably don't know anything about what a "futile love, and living an emotionless life with no direction" is. They just might be Be-ing.

Are you questioning what you posted? Or are you going to muster up a defense?

If you aren't questioning what you posted, why not?
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Dec, 2010 08:16 pm
The eternal now is so perfect
0 Replies
 
Lordie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Dec, 2010 12:16 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
The fear of death is a real motivation in the sense that you percieve life more clearly when you are in mortal danger.Religiously speaking living everyday as the last day causes one to move away from "sin"
And Death is not to be feared at all becasue death leads us to better state if there is a different state after existence
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Dec, 2010 03:08 pm

Lordie wrote:
The fear of death is a real motivation in the sense that you percieve life more clearly when you are in mortal danger.
Religiously speaking living everyday as the last day causes one to move away from "sin"
And Death is not to be feared at all becasue death leads us to better state if there is a different state after existence
A SIGNIFICANT proportion of people who have been brought back from death (of the human body)
have been angry because thay felt better when thay were out of those human bodies.

I wish my out-of-body-experiences had lasted longer.





David
[/quote]
George
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Dec, 2010 03:13 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDavid wrote:
I wish my out-of-body-experiences had lasted longer.

Now there's a straight line . . .
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Dec, 2010 03:16 pm
@George,
OmSigDavid wrote:
I wish my out-of-body-experiences had lasted longer.
George wrote:
Now there's a straight line . . .
Yeah; I see what u mean.

However, I was wide awake each time that it happened.

(Except once when I was about to eat) I was involved in active conversation
on-the-job in court, taking testimony.





David
0 Replies
 
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Dec, 2010 07:28 pm
You're ALWAYS out of your body, your body is not you. Notice the 'your' in 'your body'. You are that 'your' - NOT your body. You can't have an "out of body experience" when you were never in it to begin with. What you're referring to is Be-ing.
0 Replies
 
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Dec, 2010 10:21 am
@Dasein,
"They might just be Be-ing"

Yes, because 'they' know it's already over with.......Wink
0 Replies
 
Dasein
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Dec, 2010 06:03 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
A SIGNIFICANT proportion of people who have been brought back from death (of the human body) have been angry because thay felt better when thay were out of those human bodies.

Dying is easy. Living is hard.
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Dec, 2010 08:15 pm
@Dasein,
We're already dead. It's when you 'think' you're alive that things get hard.
0 Replies
 
north
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Dec, 2010 10:15 pm

death is a paranormal biological energy
JPLosman0711
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Dec, 2010 08:24 am
@north,
No, what you call 'death' is an udulation in conscioussness. How would you know you were alive if you weren't once dead?

You see we are infinite, but we needed a finite vessel(human body) to know that we were infinite by contrast. Infinite isn't infinite without finite, just as finite isn't finite without infinite.
Dasein
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Dec, 2010 09:38 am
@JPLosman0711,
The 'death' (demise) you are speaking about is a concept of the world you live in. It is what comes at the end of the life or the 'demise' of your body.

Go back and read the beginning of this discussion and become clear on the difference between 'death' (demise) and 'death' (Be-ing).

I understand what it is you're attempting to point at with the dialog about finite and infinite, however extrapolating your conclusions from the concepts 'finite' and 'infinite' turns 'you' into a 'combination of characteristics' (concept) with opposing sides that hold each other up and create 'mass' (believability) for the opposing concept.

I am not going to attempt to tell you that I know what I am talking about when it comes to 'finite' and 'infinite'. I can point out with certainty what it isn't and stumble along through the discovery process. That may be the only starting point we have.

infinite -adjective is defined as:
1) immeasurably great:
2) indefinitely or exceedingly great:
3) unlimited or unmeasurable in extent of space, duration of time, etc.:
4) unbounded or unlimited; boundless; endless:

What is your experience of reading the definition of 'infinite'? The first thing I notice is that I have this experience I call 'freedom'. How about you? “Immeasurably great”, “ indefinitely or exceedingly great”, “unlimited or unmeasurable in extent of space, duration of time”, “ unbounded or unlimited; boundless; endless”. Doesn't just reading of the definition of 'infinite' breathe possibility into you?

finite -adjective is defined as:
1) having bounds or limits; not infinite; measurable
2) subject to limitations or conditions, as of space, time, circumstances, or the laws of nature:

When you read the definition of finite don't you experience Be-ing constrained or limited? It's as if somebody (you don't know who) is placing restrictions on you. It's as if this somebody has a pre-existing definition of who you are and are that you need to 'shoehorn your 'self' into that definition.

Doesn't the reading of the definition of 'finite' close down the possibilities that the reading of the definition of 'infinite' opened up?

So, if I may be so bold, who you are is not 'finite' or 'infinite'. Who you are is the opening and closing down of possibility, right? More accurately said, since the “opening and closing down of possibility” are both possibilities, who you are is possibility and you get to choose what you do with it, right. You can open it up and keep opening it up or you can close it down, right?

I say that when you read the definition of 'infinite' you are reminded of who you are. Reading the definition of 'infinity' inspires (breathes life into) who you are. You re-cognize that who you are is possibility and that 'finite' and 'infinite' show up as possibilities, not as definitions in some dictionary.

Let's take that one step further.

Ask your 'self' this question. Who are 'you' in all of this? Where are 'you' located when 'you' read the definitions and re-cognize that who 'you' are is possibility?

Aren't 'you' where all of this is taking place? Aren't you what the word 'infinity' points to?
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Dec, 2010 09:54 am
@Dasein,
Yes I understand what you're pointing out when it comes to me "extapolating my conclusions from concepts" but is there no other way to express myself through text on this computer? It could be said however that due to the history of my ontologically distinguished 'self' I am limited in my 'self' from still having 'ties to my history' so to speak. Just can't imagine another way of typing. I understand the difference between demise and death, when you experience 'death' you 'reconsider your own possibilities' so to speak, who you've been be-ing dies so that you can be who you are by dis-covering another way to 'be'. Yes, even in reading a definition of 'freedom' or that which we call 'infinite' one may get a good feeling but that's because we experience that of another way to 'be' - I can't possibly imagine another way of communicating my 'self' outside of definition(which is still the worlds', I know I'm off here but stay with me) I understand 'what you're getting at' with the contrast of infinite and finite, it takes me Be-ing first and foremost to even consider the 'possibility' of the two, therefor I 'take priority' over the two. You certaintly are correct about the mind being an unresolvable trap, it is like a fire of burning questions that need to be put out with answers, answers I already had.
Dasein
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Dec, 2010 12:11 pm
@JPLosman0711,
Read this entire post and don't jump back on the keyboard until you have read it completely and thought it through.

If you really understood what I am saying you wouldn't fall back on “what you already know” or “how you express 'self'”. You need to struggle with and invent a new way of communicating. Otherwise you have condemned your 'self' to more of the same. If that's what you want to do then we have nothing more to talk about.

What I'm talking about has nothing to do with the definition of 'freedom' or whether you understand the difference between 'death' (demise) and 'death' (Be-ing).

What I am talking about is who you are Be-ing. Your compulsion to express everything in terms of "concepts you understand", defend those concepts, and not for a nanosecond, notice that's what you are doing is the 'prison' you have created for your 'self'. You blindly react by understanding and defending without questioning who 'you' are Be-ing. Where you are looking from is the problem, not what you are looking at (saying). Until you recognize that you have no idea of what you are talking about your existence will be defined by the 'dizzying circle' you've chosen to reside in. BTW – the only 'way out' is not to go in there in the first place. You have to put it down and never pick it up again. That's the only way it works.

Notice that you are in confusion because you finally don't have an answer to hold on to. Your strategy for living is to know the right answer, acquire the right answer, or demand the 'right' answer so you can find comfort in it or look good in knowing it. Answers are your salvation and they close down possibility.

You also need to see that your profuse eloquence gets you no closer to Be-ing. Regardless of how good you are at standing your ground and arguing.

Why do you look outside of you for 'answers' when you already 'know' what you're asking. Instead of looking outside of your 'self' for answers, why don't you look inside of your 'self' for what you already know and stand on your own two feet in your knowing? Is this your strategy for getting along with(selling out to) others? If you already knew that you already know, then the 'game' of asking for and arguing about answers you receive would be over. Get on with your life.

In other words, you need to finally admit to your 'self' that what you are doing doesn't work and that you have to do something differently. Not only that, but you need to see that 'differently' doesn't even show up as a possibility for you. Nobody can tell you what 'differently' will look like, they can only tell you when it shows up in you.

Until you can question your own responses and not expect others to answer your questions for you, you will be a victim of the answers you receive and never question them. You just officially gave up the right to invent who you are.

Don't take what I'm saying as harsh and defend your 'self' to your 'self'. Stay in the 'quandary' of it all.

You've been asking for a 'wake up' call for some time.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Dec, 2010 12:44 pm
Death is a natural cycle of living. How long and how well we live is different for all life. I tend to view my life in quantitative and qualitative terms in relationship to my perception of how most humans live. From that perspective, I feel very lucky that my grandparents immigrated from Japan to the US in the late 1800's, and that my father and two uncles moved to California while in their teens.

What followed were a life full of challenges, opportunities, friendships, accomplishments, and relative success at living.

Some decades ago while driving north on highway 101 from Mountain View to San Francisco, the traffic in front of me slowed down, so I did the same, but the car behind me did not, and ran into my car at high speed. My car ran into the car in front, and that car ran into the car in front of it. It started a chain reaction with more than 25 cars that was damaged. While this was happening, the traffic on the other side of the freeway started their own accidents by rubbernecking our accident. My car was totalled, and the police took me to the local station where I was able to call for a ride.

When I saw that car coming towards my car, I didn't fear death, but thought "this is it."

Much happened since that time, and the quality of my life improved tremendously.

I still don't fear death, and am pretty sure I'll welcome it when the time comes. At 75, I've done much more than I've ever dreamt as a youngster.
0 Replies
 
JPLosman0711
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Dec, 2010 08:06 pm
@Dasein,
Everytime you talk to me you kill me, and I love it.
0 Replies
 
 

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