I feel better now....sniffle....
hmm, that's right BPB is well loved here (from what I've seen).
Noah - you AT LEAST could have said "hi" first. Damn. You're speaking like you're soo over the heads and you sound like a term paper. I hate reading term papers and I think your supposositions and your generalizations of 'most white people' are ridiculous. Perhaps you're coming out of the box based on some as BPG says "whitey's on my neck" philosophy garnered by your own experiences. I, personally, have never felt the hot breath of racism breathing down my neck, but I haven't started a thread that says "most while people love black people", by the same token, I'm refuse to buy into your 'most while people' banter.
I fully intend to start a thread on the nature of intra-race racism: that which exists between black people of different skin tones...I am sure you're familiar with that. let me know when you want to talk about that.
Rational racism. that's a new one for me, How does it work and how is it distinguished from irrational racism?
Noah The African wrote:Well, polling companies and actuaries use statistical sampling all to time, to extrapolate from the few, what is true for the whole. However, what is true for the whole cannot be assumed to be true of its parts and what is true of a part cannot be assumed true for the whole. The nations unemployment rate is simply a SURVEY of 50,000 households; yet, they (the government) extrapolate the general unemployment figure of the nation. Sampling is done all the time and accepted as being accurate given an acceptable standard deviation, thus, your attempts to invalidate my proposition, simply because I have not observed or polled all or the majority of whites, is disingenuous and ignorant at the very least.
The labor stats and other polls are conducted based on a relative profile of the general population and they are compared to other exact data to determine the reliability and accuracy of the sampling methods. It isn't "simply a survey". It's a stastically valid survey within the parameters of the survey itself and it is a comparison of changes in sets of data over time. When you provide us with your survey methodology and raw data demonstrating that you've conduced an equeally proven survey I'll accept your data as accurate. In the mean time it seems to be pure bunk.
You have an interesting premise here but you are insisting that things are true without being able to prove them true. You should expect people to be skeptical when you take several thoughts of questionable accuracy and try to tie them together and come to a single conclusion.
Thanks for the oversight Sugar, you are correct in that I did use the term feel. In revision and striving for accuracy of communication and understanding I will thus revise that to read, “How white rationalize” in place of “How whites feel”.
Thanks for the proofing.
Onyxelle, how can you talk about intra-black racism, when you do not know all black people? How can you talk about any subject matter or even have an opinion on subject matter, when you do not have the ability to personally observe the totality of the phenomenon? Yet, in blatant hypocrisy, you attempt to invalidate me, because I don’t know most white people. Hey, none of you know most democrats or republicans, but that does not keep you from having an opinion about either party. None of you have been to Iraq, but it does not keep you from having an opinion on it. None of you have been in on intelligence briefing from the CIA, yet, you have an opinion on what it taking place in other nations and places.
It sounds like we need to take a poll. That should answer this controversy.
Are there any white people here? Please tell us how you feel about blacks.
Then we can extrapolate...
This post is deteriorating fast....IMHO it never had a chance.....
Moderate, lets just say that my only relevant sample set is this forum. Thus, whites on this forum can easily discredit my proposition by honestly answering the question concerning why blacks on this planet live so much worse than whites. My conclusion was based upon my sampling of white responses and rationalizations of social issues. It think that it is fair to say that if one rationalizes that black circumstance and the gap between blacks and whites in this nation and world are due to the nature of blacks themselves, then it is fair to see such a person as being racist. Care to take the challenge or test? I did not think so. You would rather obfuscate the issue.
ebrown_p wrote:It sounds like we need to take a poll. That should answer this controversy.
Are there any white people here? Please tell us how you feel about blacks.
Then we can extrapolate...
Yup, I spoke my peace :-)
Noah The African wrote:Moderate, lets just say that my only relevant sample set is this forum. Thus, whites on this forum can easily discredit my proposition by honestly answering the question concerning why blacks on this planet live so much worse than whites. My conclusion was based upon my sampling of white responses and rationalizations of social issues. It think that it is fair to say that if one rationalizes that black circumstance and the gap between blacks and whites in this nation and world are due to the nature of blacks themselves, then it is fair to see such a person as being racist.
And what happens when people answer "I don't know."? Off hand I'd guess that there are probably several reasons for the current condition of blacks around the world but I also realize that I don't have enough information to make any judgement as to why things are the way they are.
You can rationalize all you want but that doesn't make your conclusions correct.
Quote:Care to take the challenge or test? I did not think so. You would rather obfuscate the issue.
And that just makes you wrong along with looking silly.
I would like to take this opportunity to say that native americans live much worse (lower standard of living) than anyone else in america.
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:I feel better now....sniffle....
Big hug bear. I thought you knew that we all love you ;-)
Noah,
First of all, your proposition is ridiculous and narrow. I would point out that many ethnic groups are "impovrished". Look at South Asia, Latin America and indiginous Australians for example. Social issues such as poverty are not exclusively a Black issue.
Secondly, I believe strongly that we live as individuals and that our ethnicity does not affect our character. If you disagree with this statement then you are rationalizing racism. If you agree with this statement than your thesis falls apart.
I agree with you that "if one rationalizes that black circumstance and the gap between blacks and whites in this nation and world are due to the nature of blacks themselves, then it is fair to see such a person as being racist."
Most people would not say this, and if they did I would disagree strongly.
But you are rationalizing the disparity as due to the nature of whites themsleve. And it is equally fair to see that your thesis is racist.
I am not obfuscating anything. My thesis is that people are equal and should not be judged by their race.
Judging someone's character based on their race is, by definition, racism.
I hate them bears, man, I see a bear coming down the street I cross to the other side immediately, never look them in the eye, they only want one thing and it's usually perverted in nature and brutish. I don't even like teddy bears. I cut their little button eyes off them the first chance I get.
Ebrown, I never stated that poverty was exclusive to black people. Indeed, the cause of poverty for blacks is likely the same culprit of the cause of poverty of the other people you mentioned. Care to take a guess at the most common denominator between blacks and these other groups, ignoring being humans?
Well stated Noah. You've outlined the arguements in favor of white supremacy theory. I sincerely don't believe you are a racist as most of the people here seem to. No one as obviously intelligent as you, no one has put so much thought into this topic could be.
But I disagree with you on the grounds that it violates fundamental logic. It is not possible for one race to be inferior to another because inferiority itself is an arbitrary term based on what you particularly value and what individuals you pick out as examples. Among the wisest, most brilliant men in history, I don't doubt for a second that a significant proportion of them are black. This in and of itself nullies the idea of race supremecy.
I think what you have effectively done is ignore the multitudes of explanations as to why the condition of blacks both in america and in the world is worse than for whites. consider for a fact that up to a few decades ago, racism was legal. Blacks were openly limited ot lower paying jobs. Blacks wereopenly kept out of the best schools. Consider the fact that up until a few decades ago, much of Africa was subjicated to the rule of europe. The resources of the continent were stripped barren. And the continent as a whole missed out on key stepping stones such as the indurstrial revolution that later led to economic boom worldwide.
Blacks both here and in Africa have to catch up with centuries of oppresion
Noah The African wrote:Ebrown, I never stated that poverty was exclusive to black people. Indeed, the cause of poverty for blacks is likely the same culprit of the cause of poverty of the other people you mentioned. Care to take a guess at the most common denominator between blacks and these other groups, ignoring being humans?
Does it have something to do with the blue-eyed devil?
First off I don't want to use the term Blacks as I believe this is not the current term.....and I don't want to lower Noahs opinion of me
....so....
People of African descent no matter where they live......I like some of them....I dislike some of them.....most of them I can't say because I don't know them.
Same goes for every race of people I can think of including my own which is Caucasian.
That's right dyslexia, no matter how much I pander to you remember I have a hidden agenda.....I'm after your picnic basket........
