10
   

Is Tea Party Taking Over the Republican Party?

 
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2010 03:15 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:
Yes I have, and I like the idea of getting rid of the RINOs. Much like the Dems want to rid themselves of the Blue Dogs.
I must AGREE with u, Baldimo. We are only giving the voters a clear choice.





David
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2010 03:19 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:
What is wrong with someone funding the Tea Party? We are a grass roots movement.

What's wrong with the funding is that it's done quietly by two very rich men who have previously run for president under a quasi-libertarian banner. But the whole point, supposedly, is that it's 'grass roots', when clearly it is well organised and funded. I don't doubt the sincerity of the bottom of the pyramid, I do doubt how honest the top of the pyramid is being with the bottom. And how someone at the bottom would be 'elected' to the top.

Quote:
A vast majority of the people who support the Tea Party have not done any type of activism before. I know that I had not till I attended my first Tax Day protest. 2 years later and I'm still involved and help in little ways. I don't attend all protests, but I do attend some meetings, and if you have ever attended one, then you would know that there are no professional activists involved. In fact I almost stopped attending meets because of the lack of preperation and clearness of purpose. In the last year things have gotten better and seem more focused.


Nothing you've said there makes me feel confident that the 'vast majority' aren't being manipulated, in fact it seems you've almost mapped a timeline for when funders started getting involved.

Call it my natural instinct to distrust authority. And I stand by my claim that it is not a grass roots movement, even if it started that way, it's just been sold well to a certain cohort of frustrated Americans.

I say 'bigger cages, longer chains' is more than you can hope for.




revelette
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Sep, 2010 06:25 am
@OmSigDAVID,
I quibble with the term "personal liberty" being one of the republican conservative/tea party goals.

However, the goals of the tea party are no different that the regular republican party, just having a new name does not mean anything if the agenda and ideology remains more of the same.

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Sep, 2010 11:14 am
@revelette,
Isn't also interesting that they rarely talk about illegal immigration any more? They know they need the Hispanic vote to win in heavily populated states with Hispanics.
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Sep, 2010 01:57 pm
@cicerone imposter,
That depends on where you are. Here in CO the Tea Party is still talking about illegal immigration. I think the primary push for the Tea Parties has been jobs, the economy and the Health Care scam. Now that the Dems have tried to slip the "Dream Act" Defense Spending bill, it is only a matter of time for the Tea Party and the Republicans touch on Immigration again before the election.

The least Harry Reid could have done was present the policy change as its own bill. There was no reason to put the Dream Act in the defense spending bill unless the only purpose was hoping the Repubs would vote for it so as not to deny money to the military. In fact that was first thing I heard when it was voted down. "Republicians have voted against the military and don't care that our men and women get the funding they need."
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Thu 23 Sep, 2010 02:21 pm
@revelette,
revelette wrote:
I quibble with the term "personal liberty" being one of the republican conservative/tea party goals.
THAT is the innermost essence of it; the sine qua non.
The reason for its existence is to be very stingy
in granting domestic jurisdiction to government,
in contemplation of the fact that personal freedom
and domestic jurisdiction are INVERSELY PROPORTIONAL.





David
failures art
 
  3  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 03:08 am
Quote:
Downhill With the G.O.P.
By PAUL KRUGMAN


Once upon a time, a Latin American political party promised to help motorists save money on gasoline. How? By building highways that ran only downhill.

I’ve always liked that story, but the truth is that the party received hardly any votes. And that means that the joke is really on us. For these days one of America’s two great political parties routinely makes equally nonsensical promises. Never mind the war on terror, the party’s main concern seems to be the war on arithmetic. And this party has a better than even chance of retaking at least one house of Congress this November.

Banana republic, here we come.

On Thursday, House Republicans released their “Pledge to America,” supposedly outlining their policy agenda. In essence, what they say is, “Deficits are a terrible thing. Let’s make them much bigger.” The document repeatedly condemns federal debt — 16 times, by my count. But the main substantive policy proposal is to make the Bush tax cuts permanent, which independent estimates say would add about $3.7 trillion to the debt over the next decade — about $700 billion more than the Obama administration’s tax proposals.

True, the document talks about the need to cut spending. But as far as I can see, there’s only one specific cut proposed — canceling the rest of the Troubled Asset Relief Program, which Republicans claim (implausibly) would save $16 billion. That’s less than half of 1 percent of the budget cost of those tax cuts. As for the rest, everything must be cut, in ways not specified — “except for common-sense exceptions for seniors, veterans, and our troops.” In other words, Social Security, Medicare and the defense budget are off-limits.

So what’s left? Howard Gleckman of the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center has done the math. As he points out, the only way to balance the budget by 2020, while simultaneously (a) making the Bush tax cuts permanent and (b) protecting all the programs Republicans say they won’t cut, is to completely abolish the rest of the federal government: “No more national parks, no more Small Business Administration loans, no more export subsidies, no more N.I.H. No more Medicaid (one-third of its budget pays for long-term care for our parents and others with disabilities). No more child health or child nutrition programs. No more highway construction. No more homeland security. Oh, and no more Congress.”

The “pledge,” then, is nonsense. But isn’t that true of all political platforms? The answer is, not to anything like the same extent. Many independent analysts believe that the Obama administration’s long-run budget projections are somewhat too optimistic — but, if so, it’s a matter of technical details. Neither President Obama nor any other leading Democrat, as far as I can recall, has ever claimed that up is down, that you can sharply reduce revenue, protect all the programs voters like, and still balance the budget.

And the G.O.P. itself used to make more sense than it does now. Ronald Reagan’s claim that cutting taxes would actually increase revenue was wishful thinking, but at least he had some kind of theory behind his proposals. When former President George W. Bush campaigned for big tax cuts in 2000, he claimed that these cuts were affordable given (unrealistic) projections of future budget surpluses. Now, however, Republicans aren’t even pretending that their numbers add up.

So how did we get to the point where one of our two major political parties isn’t even trying to make sense?

The answer isn’t a secret. The late Irving Kristol, one of the intellectual godfathers of modern conservatism, once wrote frankly about why he threw his support behind tax cuts that would worsen the budget deficit: his task, as he saw it, was to create a Republican majority, “so political effectiveness was the priority, not the accounting deficiencies of government.” In short, say whatever it takes to gain power. That’s a philosophy that now, more than ever, holds sway in the movement Kristol helped shape.

And what happens once the movement achieves the power it seeks? The answer, presumably, is that it turns to its real, not-so-secret agenda, which mainly involves privatizing and dismantling Medicare and Social Security.

Realistically, though, Republicans aren’t going to have the power to enact their true agenda any time soon — if ever. Remember, the Bush administration’s attack on Social Security was a fiasco, despite its large majority in Congress — and it actually increased Medicare spending.

So the clear and present danger isn’t that the G.O.P. will be able to achieve its long-run goals. It is, rather, that Republicans will gain just enough power to make the country ungovernable, unable to address its fiscal problems or anything else in a serious way. As I said, banana republic, here we come.

source: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/24/opinion/24krugman.html?_r=2&hp

A
R
T
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 06:22 am
@OmSigDAVID,
personal liberty usually is thought of as personal moral choices and/or personal sexual orientation and it is that to which I was referring to in my earlier post.
0 Replies
 
revelette
 
  2  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 06:28 am
@failures art,
Quote:
During the roll-out of the House GOP’s “Pledge to America” gimmick, House Minority Leader John Boehner (R-OH) was asked for specifics on how his colleagues would balance the budget and cut the deficit, but he wasn’t able to hide the fact that document falls short on details. “I don’t have all of the solutions,” Boehner said, adding that the American people “will help us get the answers.”




source
failures art
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 06:32 am
@revelette,
oh brother...

A
R
T
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 06:50 am
@failures art,
Quote:
During the roll-out of the House GOP’s “Pledge to America” gimmick, House Minority Leader John Boehner (R-OH) was asked for specifics on how his colleagues would balance the budget and cut the deficit, but he wasn’t able to hide the fact that document falls short on details. “I don’t have all of the solutions,” Boehner said, adding that the American people “will help us get the answers.”


are these the same people okie calls the dumbasses, or are only card carrying TP'ers and republicans going to help out
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 10:57 am
@djjd62,
the more things change...

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-september-23-2010/postcards-from-the-pledge?xrs=eml_tds
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  2  
Reply Fri 24 Sep, 2010 11:06 am
@hingehead,
Richer than George Soros?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Sep, 2010 11:32 pm
@failures art,
oh brother is spot on! They've lacked details for everything they tried to defeat Obama on. The problem is many democrats want a republicans congress take-over by not understanding that republicans don't have any solutions for our current problems. Stupid Americans.
failures art
 
  2  
Reply Sun 26 Sep, 2010 03:00 am
@cicerone imposter,
Vantage point discussion.

If the GOP retakes one or both of the houses, this puts them in a role to provide solutions and not simply criticize. So if a GOP congress makes proposals that resemble older policies, doesn't this hurt them in 2012? The criticism of the GOP is that they are the party of "no." What happens when they suddenly assume control? It seems like they will need to appear more productive than the democrat congress. What kinds of things will they let through, what kinds of things will they stop? Or will they try to push lots of things through just to make Obama look like an obstructionist?

A
R
Theories?
failures art
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Sep, 2010 06:13 am
@failures art,
I posted this before reading the GOP "pledge to America." I'm thinking that GOP victories in 2010 almost guarantee Obama a win in 2012 if this "pledge" represents their national strategy.

Then again, they could just through the Tea Party candidate under the bus in 2012 if things start looking sour and they want to appear more centrist.

Factcheck on GOP Pledge.

Factcheck.org wrote:
The Republican “Pledge to America,” released Sept. 23, contains some dubious factual claims:

-It declares that “the only parts of the economy expanding are government and our national debt.” Not true. So far this year government employment has declined slightly, while private sector employment has increased by 763,000 jobs.

-It says that “jobless claims continue to soar,” when in fact they are down eight percent from their worst levels.

-It repeats a bogus assertion that the Internal Revenue Service may need to expand by 16,500 positions, an inflated estimate based on false assumptions and guesswork.

-It claims the stimulus bill is costing $1 trillion, considerably more than the $814 billion, 10-year price tag currently estimated by nonpartisan congressional budget experts.

-It says Obama’s tax proposals would raise taxes on “roughly half the small business income in America,” an exaggeration. Much of the income the GOP is counting actually comes from big businesses making over $50 million a year.


A
R
T
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Sep, 2010 07:03 am
@roger,
roger wrote:

Richer than George Soros?

Yes.
The 2 of them together have almost 3 times the wealth of Soros.

http://www.forbes.com/wealth/forbes-400#p_1_s_arank_-1_
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.04 seconds on 04/29/2025 at 11:08:36