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Mel Gibson, Racist, Sexist, and Violent--Has He Gone Too Far?

 
 
Thomas
 
  2  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:21 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Have your feelings about Gibson changed as a result of these revelations? Would you still want to see or support his movies?

As a person living in the US, I'm glad that domestically violent bullies get locked up here, whether they are movie stars or not.

As a consumer of movies, I don't care whether their actors are good or bad people in their private lives. I pay them for entertainment, not moral guidance.
Green Witch
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:23 pm
@Thomas,
True. I rather like Errol Flynn movies and he was a total perv.
0 Replies
 
aidan
 
  2  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:25 pm
@Thomas,
I don't pay entertainers for moral guidance, but I also don't want to contribute to their ability to pay their legal fees so that they can get themselves off charges other people would rot in jail on.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:34 pm
@aidan,
See, that's where we disagree. As I said, I'm happy that Gibson will soon be a defendant in a domestic violence case, and on the losing side of a custody case. But I have no problem with defendants having good lawyers. I do have a problem with poor people being unable to get good lawyers in America's legal system, but not with rich people being able to.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:39 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:

See, that's where we disagree. As I said, I'm happy that Gibson will soon be a defendant in a domestic violence case, and on the losing side of a custody case. But I have no problem with defendants having good lawyers. I do have a problem with poor people being unable to get good lawyers in America's legal system, but not with rich people being able to.
WHAT 's the problem ?
chai2
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:41 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

Quote:
From what I can recall, you really like Bruce Springsteen. What if Springsteen, despite his public persona, actually has an aspect to his personality that you find repulsive and disgusting?



I would want to know.



See, you can stop right there aidan. No one asked if you would want to know or not.

You might want to know with all your might, but just because you want to know doesn't mean you ever will.

You seem to think that "want to know" and "right to know" are the same thing.

I want to know a lot of things, but most of those things are none of my business.

Right, you don't care what is making him act a certain way, as long as he acts all nice and clean and tidy.
The human mind is a much more private and messy thing.

What if this happened to my sister? How do you know something like this hasn't?

In case you "want" to know, something like this has happened to my sister....not this extreme, but bad enough.
Sure I thought of this guy negatively, and wanted to go over and punch him out. But I also acknowledged and knew that this was not how he always had been, if there's something wrong with him that could be fixed, that would be a good thing.

Turned out there was something wrong with him, and it eventually killed him.

You know what?
I ******* hate it when someone pulls that "what if that happened to your sister crap"

**** happens to all of us.
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:41 pm
@Thomas,
You do what you have to do to be true to your conscience Thomas and I'll do what I have to do to be true to mine.

I don't want to put another dime in Mel Gibson's pocket. And I won't.
aidan
 
  2  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:43 pm
@chai2,
Jesus Christ - I don't feel that I have the right to know - I didn't ask to know - all I did was read the newspaper.
Now I'm commenting on what I read. So what?
Give me a break.
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:44 pm
@aidan,
Sorry that happened to your sister. I wrote that because I was thinking about how I'd feel if it happened to my sister.
I apologize if I struck a nerve.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 03:46 pm
@aidan,
Quote:
I don't want to put another dime in Mel Gibson's pocket. And I won't
He is aging out of acting, was planning to do more directing and producing...it will be interesting to see if he can do the deals now. So far as I can see Charley Sheen has gotten a pass from Hollywood, it appears that all that counts is the ability to bring in money, and known domestic problems does not impact much.
Thomas
 
  3  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 04:01 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

Thomas wrote:

See, that's where we disagree. As I said, I'm happy that Gibson will soon be a defendant in a domestic violence case, and on the losing side of a custody case. But I have no problem with defendants having good lawyers. I do have a problem with poor people being unable to get good lawyers in America's legal system, but not with rich people being able to.
WHAT 's the problem ?

My problem is that I believe in the Sixth Amendment of the US constitution. It instructs that "In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall [...] have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense." This right is nugatory when poor people's public defenders can't counsel them effectively. Reports abound where counsels are overworked with other cases, or incompetent because the State won't pay for competent lawyers, or falling asleep in the middle of capital trials, or just generally "bad lawyers". Each of these stories is a scandal, and I'm outraged enough about them to pay for reforms. By contrast, I'm indifferent to Mel Gibson's ability to afford good layers rather than average ones, so I'm uninterested in changing my behavior to stifle it.

Just out of curiosity: Did your law school cover the Sixth Amendment, or did they stop after the Second?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 04:03 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:
You do what you have to do to be true to your conscience Thomas and I'll do what I have to do to be true to mine.

Sounds fair. Deal.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 04:22 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
So far as I can see Charley Sheen has gotten a pass from Hollywood, it appears that all that counts is the ability to bring in money, and known domestic problems


Hollywood support it own even when it come to a pedophile on the run from the law.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 04:46 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

Sorry that happened to your sister. I wrote that because I was thinking about how I'd feel if it happened to my sister.
I apologize if I struck a nerve.



You didn't strike any nerve, and there's no reason for you to feel sorry. It didn't have a thing to do with you.

That's exactly what I'm saying aidan. You don't have to know things certain things about anyone you know.
You don't have any business projecting what you would feel about anything onto another person.

It's none of my business how you would feel if anything, good or bad happened to you or your sister.

It's like you don't get it that you're not involved in 99.9999999999999+% of what is going on with anybody.

I really don't think you know what you want, or rather, you don't know what you're asking to take on. You want people not to be racist, because it offends you. You actually want to know what's going on inside them, so you can decide whether you are offended or not. That's not going to happen.

Well, the sun shines on both the just and unjust, and that's just the way it is. The world will keep turning regardless of what you would want to know.

0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 04:51 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

Jesus Christ - I don't feel that I have the right to know - I didn't ask to know - all I did was read the newspaper.
Now I'm commenting on what I read. So what?
Give me a break.


You were directly responding to my statement about what if the Boss had some dark perversion.

You directly answered "I would want to know"

You don't even read what you respond to, do you?

That offends me.
snood
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 05:00 pm
@chai2,
chai2:

Quote:
If Richard Roundtree had not played the part of Shaft, but instead was played by (I don't know, I'm just randomly reaching in a bag), Red Foxx, would you have felt the same about Roundtree, or Foxx?


Missing the point... it's not what their performances in the story made me think about the actors (Redd Foxx or whoever), its what it made me feel about myself and my life - you know, inspiration?...

A relevant question would have been "How would your feelings been different about seeing Shaft if the actor had recently been exposed as a woman-beater?"

And I still think it's sad that you think it would be sad for you to be influenced by anything a performing artist did. But that's just my opinion, and that's neither here nor there.

plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 05:10 pm
@Thomas,
I could not get a lawyer when I did my reverse mortgage. Two used the excuse that I would have to drive too far to reach their offices.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 05:14 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

chai2:

A relevant question would have been "How would your feelings been different about seeing Shaft if the actor had recently been exposed as a woman-beater?"



Would have made no difference.

simple as that.


What did people use for inspiration in all the years prior to motion pictures/professional plays snood?

I just find reality more inspirational than made up stories.

I enjoy reading novels, and sometimes get a strong message. But I'm not inspired to act like a person in a fictional tale.

I understand that the part played by an actor, and the person who works as an actor, are 2 separate things, not to be confused with each other.
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 05:14 pm
What if the tape is played before a judge, and Gibson's defense is that he was doing an improvisational acting exercise for a remake of "Raging Bull" which his production company is working on?

(I am sorry if this sounds callous. Domestic violence is a serious crime. I am just wondering if such a legal strategy would be used.)
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Jul, 2010 05:15 pm
but.....don't you think Fred Sanford would have made a terrific Shaft?
0 Replies
 
 

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