Evolution in the bible, says Vatican

We have been debating that a murderer can enter the Kingdom of Heaven, elsewhere on these forums. How come they can not now?

i know history quite well, enlarging Israel is not the same as taking israel!

also you will notice the ancient land of cana'an(promise land) is not the same as israel in land area!:headbang:

Lets not play word games. This is some of the Biblical passages speaking of God returning the Jews back to Israel.

Ezekiel chapter 36 starting at verse 19. I scattered them among the nations, dispersing them over foreign lands; according to their conduct and deeds I judged them. 20. But when they came among the nations (wherever they came), they served to profane my holy name, because it was said of them: "These are the people of the Lord, yet they had to leave their land." 21. So I have relented because of my holy name which the house of Israel profaned among the nations where they came. 22. There fore say to the house of Israel: Thus says the Lord GOD: Not for your sakes do I act, house of Israel, but for the sake of my holy name, which you profaned among the nations to which you came. 24.

This part above isn't important!

For I will take you away from among the nations, gather you from all the foreign lands, and bring you back to your own land.

"Own land" is very ambiguous, it could mean anywhere that the jews had previously lived...




Ezekiel 38:8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword,

the bolded part above is also very vague...

and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them.

So according to this all jewish people should be living in mountains!!!


notice that the word "Israel" is only mentioned once and it is used in past tense, all other references are very ambiguous or vague....still yet to se any satisfying prophecies!

Adam, if there are two things that fundamentalist are good at it is deciet and slander. They even slander each other. One day over 50 years ago, I went with my aunt to get something out of her barn loft. She never threw anything away, and I found a copy of an religious publication called the "Ventilator" printed on cheap paper. It told a story about a paleological find of our earlest ancestors. And quess what?, right by the side of them was a button off a World War 1 Uniform. Learning,Speech,&Attention Defects | Man with learning disabilities, communication disorders, ADHD, becomes author

My comments are marked with red above ^

My comments are marked with red above ^

It is all wrongly translated anyway...not to mention that the bible was compiled ages ago by a few men with nothing better to do but feel superior. Many, many parts were taken out, and several questionable parts such as Revelations were allowed in...

I can;t believe you are arguing over the words that are a poor tranlsation anyway, it is a senseless argument that is as senseless as Islamics killing Christians in the name of God and Christians killing Islamics in the name of God?
Think l am talking about the current war?
You know, human stupidity repeats itself, it is God's gift to keep trying to wake up mankind, and we stupidly repeat the cycles over and over again. This cycle l referred to is the same today and just as stupid as when it occured in the Crusades.

for example, this is a bunch of goobly-goop from some person who snift too much camel dung
"God will destroy Gog and his armies.
Ezekiel 38:22 to 23 I will execute judgement upon him with plague and bloodshed; I will pour down torrents of rain, hailstones and burning sulfur on him and on his troops and on the many nations with him. 23. And so I will show my greatness and my holiness, and I will make myself known in the sight of many nations. Then they will know that I am the LORD."
what a bunch of horseradish! geesh, get real...this is a totally screwed up translation that has NOTHING to do with the relationship that is possible between God and everyone.

The Bibe is very clear most people are going to hell. Most people do not care about God or His Words of truth. What is screwed up, are the people of this world who mock God and His Word. God is getting ready to return to this world. He tells us what to watch for, these events are happening, and the world still mocks God. Please show us the evidence that the Biblical translation is screwed up. I have never seen any such evidence. I hear people like you all the time make claims like this. Yet when one ask for such evidence, all I get is silence. So please, show us this evidence.

here is one right here: mistranslation of Jesus' name!


About Yeshua of Nazareth: He is commonly referred to as Jesus Christ, although Joshua would be a more accurate translation of his first name. "Christ" is not his last name; it is simply the Greek word for "Messiah," or "anointed one."

Anyone with even a most basic understanding of the New Testament Scriptures and how the original Greek language was translated into English knows the fallacy of the above statement. The English translation of the New Testament did NOT come from the (Hebrew). It seems that like Paul who said I too was convinced that I ought to do all that was possible to oppose the name of Jesus of Nazareth (Acts 26:9). We still see people out there trying to oppose His name. The New Testament was not written in Hebrew but rather in Greek and translated directly into English for our English speaking society to read. If God wanted the Jewish writers of the New Testament to use Yeshua they would have, but they didn't. To say Yeshua means "salvation" is not a clear connection to the Savior from Nazareth. It doesn't identify the one who shed his blood on the cross of Calvary, rose from the dead and is coming back again, as the NT identifies Jesus of Nazareth.

The difference is, a murderer who continues in his sin and remains unrepentant will not be allowed into God's Kingdom. Yet if a former murderer has confessed his sin before God, an realized what he has done, and asked God to forgive Him, then that person will receive forgivness. Now remember, God can see deep into a persons heart, so just mouthing the words will not be enought. That's why Jesus tells us, "many will worship me with their lips yet their hearts are far from me". God is not impressed with empty words, He is impressed with changed hearts. And only God can see that.

So he is not imperessed with people who sacrifice themselves to help others? A perosn gives there life in the most selfless of acts and dies aving someone, yet because they don't believe thsy go to hell correct?

What if they are christian but don't get a chance to repent a sin before they die,..same?

Your first statement would be correct, and if someone is a Christian and yet dies without repenting they still would go to heaven. I can say that because God alone knows who's a real Christian. The difference is that Christians have taken the time to give their life to Christ, good deeds are great, yet good deeds void of God will not buy you much spiritual mileage. Thats why the Bible tells us, your best works before the Throne of God are but filthy rags.
And also that is why God states now is the day of Salvation, now is the appointed time. Another words, if you want to be close to God don't put off till tommorow, what you can do today. And then Jesus asks the question, how shall they neglect so great a salvation? Christ knows that their will be people who could of been saved, but because of the cares of this life they did not take the time to seek Him or consider Him, and lived their life pretty much for themselves. And when death came, they had no relationship with God to call on. And thats why Christ tells us many will come before Him in that day, and will start to tell God about all the great things they have done. And Christ will look at them and say, depart from me, I never knew you. If one wants to go to heaven, one needs to develope a relationship with Jesus.
Everyone in heaven will already have a personal relationship with Christ before they get there. When you stand before Gods Throne and you are a Christian, you will be no stranger to Jesus.

"The bible in its entirety is God's written word to man. Free of error in its original autographs, wholly reliable in history and doctrine. Its divine inspiration has rendered the book 'infallible' (incapable of teaching deception) and 'inerrant' (not liable to find false or untrue). Its inspiration is 'plenary' (extending to all parts alike), 'verbal' (including the actual language form), and 'confluent' ( a product of the two free agents, human and divine). Inspiration involves infallibility as essential property, and infallibility in turn implies inerrancy." (Clark H. Pinnock, A Denfese of Biblical infallibility, page 1)

We as Christians believe that it is free of errors in its original manuscripts. Many claim that due to the fact a few minor copy errors of translations have occurred that this gives them the right to lay claim to the original being untrue. But a few copying errors do not take away from the truth made in the context of the scripts. We may not have any complete originals but the "cannonization" process has validated the "authenticity" and time period to the New Testament Scripts as being accurately dated from 45AD to 150AD, some 200 years before the first council of Nieasa in 325AD (a common claim made by educated fools to claim the fallibility of the NT writtings). New Testament - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And the Old Testament books that have been found in the Dead Sea Scrolls validate the truth and the accuracy of the New Testament in fulfilling future prophecy. Two complete copies of the book of "Isaiah" were found and accurately dated to a time period of some 200 years before the birth of Christ. Dead Sea scrolls - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This particular book of the Old Testament has been carbon dated and confirmed a original. The writings found therein mirror the actual happenings of the NT scripts exactly in their prophecies. Chapter 53 contains an incredibly accurate description of Jesus Christ and tells of just how his trial and death would come about. He was not physically beautiful...vs2, He was rejected by men...vs3, He was wounded, bruised, scrouged....vs 5, He had a mock trial...vs7-8, He died at a young age before his time and without children...vs8, He was killed and hung along the wicked and buried among the rich.

"THE BIBLE IN ITS ENTIRETY IS GODS WRITTEN WORD TO MAN"......if not, why not, prove it wrong. RD

Very fascinating, I'm glad you can sleep at night knowing that good people go to hell just because people don't 'believe'.

Bearing in mind that the 'Americas' were not discovered until 1400-1500 years after the death off christ and have no knowledge of christianity until it was 'forced' upon them. Did all the people that were born and did not believe go to hell? Same to about the Aborigines (Australia), Eskimo's, African's. Did all these people go to hell because they did not believe?

Those who don't believe are often accused of not being able to understand the scale of which God works at. I would level at religous folk that you can't understand cultures outside your religion that lived merrily for millenia until they were destroyed by your monotheism.

Open your mind to a wider range of cultures, you might learn something different and inspiring that isn't written in you two books.