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Is Bush a War Criminal?

 
 
Lasombra
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Apr, 2006 11:45 am
@ndjs,
ndjs wrote:
His date was wrong then.

That looks an awful lot like the Geneva Convention, and it was in Geneva, but IS it THE Geneva Convention?



My date referrs only to the first Geneva Convention - for the Amelioration of the Condition of the Wounded and Sick in Armed Forces in the Field. The second Geneva Convention handles the same thing but for the sea. The third Geneva Convention deals with the treatment of Prisoners, and is what was quoted above. The 1929 date seems correct.

For future reference, there are total of four Conventions and three protocols.
0 Replies
 
Lasombra
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Apr, 2006 11:56 am
@ndjs,
ndjs wrote:
^ Thanks. Know why we haven't become party to Article I or II?



If you mean Protocol I and II,

The reason we didn't sign Protocol I&II is because we thought it could be used by unlawful combatants (read: terrorists) as a way to give themselves Geneva protections.

The Reagan Library has a copy of a message from the President to Congress stating why we shouldn't adopt the Protocol, stating that it...
Quote:
... is fundamentally and irreconcilably flawed. It contains provisions that would undermine humanitarian law and endanger civilians in war. One of its provisions, for example, would automatically treat as an international conflict any so-called "war of national liberation.'' Whether such wars are international or non-international should turn exclusively on objective reality, not on one's view of the moral qualities of each conflict. To rest on such subjective distinctions based on a war's alleged purposes would politicize humanitarian law and eliminate the distinction between international and non-international conflicts. It would give special status to "wars of national liberation,'' an ill-defined concept expressed in vague, subjective, politicized terminology. Another provision would grant combatant status to irregular forces even if they do not satisfy the traditional requirements to distinguish themselves from the civilian population and otherwise comply with the laws of war. This would endanger civilians among whom terrorists and other irregulars attempt to conceal themselves.
0 Replies
 
ndjs
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Apr, 2006 03:41 pm
@Brent cv,
Yeah, I definitely meant Protocol, sorry. I was in a rush to get somewhere. :redface:

Thanks. Smile
Curmudgeon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Apr, 2006 09:22 pm
@ndjs,
"The reason we didn't sign Protocol I&II is because we thought it could be used by unlawful combatants (read: terrorists) as a way to give themselves Geneva protections."

This backs up my statements -"On the Geneva Convention as relates to detainees in Gitmo , I wonder how many of them qualify as members of an army of a nation that is a signatory to the Convention ?

If you read the whole paper referenced above , you will find many provisions very difficult to live up to due to the the detainees non-alliance with a defined nation or government ."
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Apr, 2006 09:25 pm
@Brent cv,
Pretty much what some of the dems want to do anyway. McCain wanted to do too? OMG terrorists being torchured, how could we!
0 Replies
 
Lasombra
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 Apr, 2006 11:12 am
@Curmudgeon,
Curmudgeon wrote:
"The reason we didn't sign Protocol I&II is because we thought it could be used by unlawful combatants (read: terrorists) as a way to give themselves Geneva protections."

This backs up my statements -"On the Geneva Convention as relates to detainees in Gitmo , I wonder how many of them qualify as members of an army of a nation that is a signatory to the Convention ?

If you read the whole paper referenced above , you will find many provisions very difficult to live up to due to the the detainees non-alliance with a defined nation or government ."


That is why I believe the current policy in dealing with the people at Gitmo is sound. We don't "need" to give them Geneva type protections, but it is the "right thing to do" to treat them with atleast a modicom of humanity - which is what we're doing.
Curmudgeon
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Apr, 2006 01:11 am
@Lasombra,
Lasombra wrote:
That is why I believe the current policy in dealing with the people at Gitmo is sound. We don't "need" to give them Geneva type protections, but it is the "right thing to do" to treat them with atleast a modicom of humanity - which is what we're doing.


I agree with you there , my friend .
0 Replies
 
Brent cv
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 May, 2006 03:30 pm
@Brent cv,
What do you think about these comments.

Webmaster Forum - View Single Post - Poll: Should Bush be tried for war crimes?
0 Replies
 
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 May, 2006 06:53 pm
@Brent cv,
Quote:
Bombing civilian targets is a war crime according to the Geneva Convention
First off i'd need a little more proof then heresay? Then it would have to pass authenticity, it goes down from there. Just ask Dan Rather? I mean an order or something in print saying to bomb a civi target. Weren't the twin towers a civilian target?
Quote:
and the use of depleted uranium is also a war crime
We use depleted rounds, they use outdated weaponry. I think they also would claim we don't fight fair. But since when is war Fair? I don't think human triggering devices on chest bombs and road side bombs killing way more Iraqi's then we could dream of, fall under Geneva rules either. Didn't work for the Japs, it ain't gonna work for them.
Quote:
not to mention hyjacking people to be tortured in secred concentration camps for years without any form of trial

So would beheading them be a more just form of torture? What is we broadcast it on national TV? Terrorist's deserve
then same thing they accord others which is nothing.
Quote:
and the list of war crimes and crimes against humanity goes on and on...

With such grim unlawfull activity you would think him convicted already, oh wait, they need something else. Like PROOF? You would also think they would allow the president the same accord they allow illegal aliens, Amnesty anyone?
tumbleweed cv
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 May, 2006 07:14 pm
@Drnaline,
Bush is being tried in the court of public opinion.

That's enough for me. :cool:

As far as the Geneva Convention is concerned, when did we start following those guidelines? Those rules went out the same window as the logic behind invading Iraq.
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 May, 2006 07:48 pm
@tumbleweed cv,
tumbleweed wrote:
Bush is being tried in the court of public opinion.

That's enough for me. :cool:

As far as the Geneva Convention is concerned, when did we start following those guidelines? Those rules went out the same window as the logic behind invading Iraq.

Quote:
Bush is being tried in the court of public opinion.

That's about as much as you guys are gonna get! Unlike some other recently impeached X president?
Quote:
That's enough for me.

Glad your easily satisfied.
Quote:
As far as the Geneva Convention is concerned, when did we start following those guidelines?

When the terrorists start adhearing to the same rules. Untill then, alls fair in love and war.
Quote:
Those rules went out the same window as the logic behind invading Iraq.

For no logic, every rep in the house less one and every Senator in Congress voted for it? He'll you were probably even for it at the time?
0 Replies
 
cranston36 cv
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 May, 2006 07:35 pm
@Brent cv,
Bush is not a war criminal.
He is a bad president.
We are all responsible, however, for allowing large American companies to peddle weapons around the world that are used to kill innocent men, women and children. They even get tax breaks while we break our backs and they break hearts.
Those who manufacture and sell weapons are war criminals.
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 May, 2006 08:26 pm
@Brent cv,
Any one in this country is free to pedal weapons. Including corps.
0 Replies
 
Brent cv
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 May, 2006 08:52 pm
@cranston36 cv,
cranston36 wrote:
Bush is not a war criminal.
He is a bad president.
We are all responsible, however, for allowing large American companies to peddle weapons around the world that are used to kill innocent men, women and children. They even get tax breaks while we break our backs and they break hearts.
Those who manufacture and sell weapons are war criminals.

Well you gained a tad bit of respect from me.
0 Replies
 
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 May, 2006 10:19 pm
@Brent cv,
Quote:
Those who manufacture and sell weapons are war criminals.

So what of the manufactures of automobiles, are they criminals? What about alcohol?
Bigbird cv
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Jun, 2006 09:51 pm
@Drnaline,
Is Bush a war criminal? I suppose he is. He broke international law to promote war. Will he ever be tried? no.

Prior to the war, Bush forced an agreement from most countries whereby they agreed not to charge any American with war crimes. He insisted that the USA would charge its own.
The list of actions comitted by the US military which are against international law is long. The use of Incindary weapons or "Daisy Cutters" is against international law. Holding people without charge for years on end is against international law, torture is of course against international law.

I believe that Mr. Bush ignores international law, the same way Putin ignores it in Chechnya because he knows he will never be held accountable.
Bigbird cv
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Jun, 2006 09:57 pm
@Bigbird cv,
I forgot to add this;
Has there been any evidence of Iraq having anything to do with the tragic events of Sept 11?

The "world" outside America pretty disgusted with this "search" for WMD.
Most people believe that if a Dictator built Weapons of mass destruction to defend his "Dictatorship" and was facing a military which would surely defeat him, he would use those WMD during the war. What did Saddam have to lose by firing gas at the invading forces?
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Jun, 2006 06:13 am
@Brent cv,
One thing you fail to realize is we are a sovereign country with our own system of governing. By your account maybe this country should obey all the international laws and just through out the Constitution? They would love it i suppose.
So they way i take it is you want us to follow there rule of law but it's ok for terrorists to behead people? Or are you saying the terrorists follow international law? In any case i'd like a little more proof of your accusation? Got links, i'd like to know what law he broke to promote WAR?
0 Replies
 
Drnaline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Jun, 2006 06:18 am
@Bigbird cv,
Bigbird wrote:
I forgot to add this;
Has there been any evidence of Iraq having anything to do with the tragic events of Sept 11?

The "world" outside America pretty disgusted with this "search" for WMD.
Most people believe that if a Dictator built Weapons of mass destruction to defend his "Dictatorship" and was facing a military which would surely defeat him, he would use those WMD during the war. What did Saddam have to lose by firing gas at the invading forces?
What do you mean if? Five thousand dead kurds isn't proof enough for you? There is no question "if" he did, the question is what did he do with them? Remember all the stuff buried in the nuke scientists front yard? Why hide something you supposedly don't have? Here is a link for the misterious weapons, how did we move what was not there? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3872201.stm
0 Replies
 
ndjs
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Jun, 2006 04:58 pm
@Bigbird cv,
Bigbird wrote:
The "world" outside America pretty disgusted with this "search" for WMD.

There's a "world" outside of America? crap.
 

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