Is there a god?

That is what we are discussing. I believe it to be God. I would like to know what Brent and Steve think it is?

So God was an action? That doesn't make sense. God being created, that's an action, but oh wait, God wasn't created, he was just there.

If there was a God what created God?

If you are going to have God as the trigger he must have a trigger for himself to be created as well.

He simply could not always exist and no one make him lol, I can not believe i am the only one that finds that mildly insane.

I do not know what created the universe. I do think that no "God" had a hand in it.

I do not know what created the universe. I do think that no "God" had a hand in it.

Yes, If i have a stack of chips and i push it slightly to move it and it topple over. My finger was the action and the chips falling over was the reaction. If modern day science says our universe came from a finite source smaller then a head of a needle and avter it was pushed it became our total universe, the force needed to compell every thing in our universe outwards must of been immence. I know of no other force that strong other then a higher being that could trigger such an event.

It is not "If there was a God what created God?" First you must prove there is one and if so then we can try and figure where it came from. Your point of view is jumping the gun. It's like asking if there are aliens who made them? Your assuming he needed to be created.


Then what is your opinion of our origins? I'm not asking for proof, just what you think made it all? Aliens, monsters, what? Like i said early on, I would be getting alot of 'I don't know?' or there is no God but i have no other opinion then that. I find that rather insane that you expect me to believe your hypothesis but offer no opinion of what or why?

I'm still not following. So what about stacking chips to the point where they can't support themselves? They will just fall over, needing no "trigger" other than their own weight and lack of organizational support. THAT is a more accurate representation of the most accepted views of how the world was created. The tiny, incredibly dense ball of matter did not need someone/something to touch it to trigger the explosion. It was just unstable.

I do not have an opinion on our orgins. I do not know.

I do have an opinion about a god creating us. I do not believe this.

You believe in a God not me. Is it not you that said for every reaction there is a trigger?

Well where did your God come from or are you just going to accept the "He was always here" thought?

If that is the thought you wish to accept then there is not point in arguing. I find it simply to far fetched to say he was always here and no one created him lol.

I do not have an opinion on our orgins. I do not know.

I do have an opinion about a god creating us. I do not believe this.

You believe in a God not me. Is it not you that said for every reaction there is a trigger?

Well where did your God come from or are you just going to accept the "He was always here" thought?

If that is the thought you wish to accept then there is not point in arguing. I find it simply to far fetched to say he was always here and no one created him lol.

For them not to support themselves it would be up to us to position them even if slightly off kilter. Given no influence other then a perfect stack nothing whould impead them from going up indefinetly, enter the human equation and things take a turn rather quickly. The trigger needed is positioning then off perfect or a breeze or a vibration. Some thing will always set them off. So a trigger there is. Weight and lack of organisation is a trigger. Instability had to come from somewhere, things are not unstable by themselves. There was a cause for there instability.

A perfectly organized combination of matter is not feasible at all.

I believe in God .
Look at what Rene' Descartes said :

So who here believes there is a "god" that reigns over Humans?

How do you see God if you believe in one?

Do you follow a certain religion and if so which one?

I myself can not bring myself to believe in a God but I also can not believe any other theories put forth for how we got here as well.

Your 3 and 4 don't add up. An imperfect being could never dream up a perfect being. You could think it it was perfect when in fact it's not.

Also not to mention you assume we are perfect.

What are you basing these assumptions on?

I was taught the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit version. I chose the Pentecostal Religion. They play musical instruments, which is a plus for me.
Music and showing praise is part of their belief.

Rex , those are not "my" 3 and 4 , they are Descarte's.
I was trying to inject some semblance of thought from a famous philosopher into the discussion in order to assist us in making up our minds about believing in God , or not believing .
This discussion gets nowhere if none of us is willing to attempt to see the others' positions as plausible , and examine the reasons . Descarte was doing just that when he postulated his "proof" .
You all are missing his point - that an imperfect being ie: man , being imperfect , could not imagine a perfect being simply because he ( man ) IS imperfect , thus incapable of building in his mind a perfect being . Descartes thus claims to "prove" that the perfect being (God) MUST exist to implant the idea in man's mind .

That's why there are so many churches now. Everybody picks what is a plus for them. I was raised Church of Christ, and while I am not religious at all anymore, you can expect me to be the stickler of the group, haha. Nowhere in the New Law of the Bible does it mention music as worship or tell people to play music is worship. It mentions song and making melody with the heart, but it doesn't mention an organ or guitar anywhere.

I get the arguement, and that is why it stinks..

An imperfect man could dream up his "perfect" being. But it would still be imperfect because he is imperfect.

I get the arguement, and that is why it stinks..

An imperfect man could dream up his "perfect" being. But it would still be imperfect because he is imperfect.

Could you quote me a verse that states " making melody of the heart". This comes down to Old Testament verses the New Testament. Do we disregard what was in the Old testament? I think the OT is where this issue of music is addressed.

I'v never seen or heard the phrase you mentioned. I don't believe the issue is addressed much or at all in the New Testament