Everybody Loved Them; I Cringed

Well, I guess I'm in the minority on "The Usual Suspects," but I've become accustomed to occupying that position lately. I'm just glad I didn't offer my opinion on "Pulp Fiction."

No matter what a scriptwriter or the director try to put on the screen, joe, some don't get it. That's what this thread is all about. "The Sixth Sense" was wildly popular and the ending was clever but what a drudgery getting to the ending. "Signs" was even worse for me with Mel Gibson's self-conscious preacher which was as inexplicable as the mistake of having to show the aliens. It was a thinly veiled knock off of alien invasion films meant to have mythological, metaphysical and psychological meanings but I found all three films (including "Unbreakable") to be convoluted mishmash with no redeeming features. Try watching any of them twice. Yawn.

As for "Pulp Fiction," many don't get the cartoon uber-violence exposing the dislocated psychology of the criminal milieu better than any film before it, even the director's own "Reservoir Dogs."

i dont like lord of the rings
hate me

Lightwiz

We've gone over "Unbreakable" in another thread and I bring it up again only to confirm your point that tastes certainly do vary. I think it is the best of M. Night's films, but I doubt that reason will ever convert a person from rancor to rapture, or vice versa.

I usually agree with your film assessments, probably better than 90% of the time. But in some cases I must simply admit that tastes vary.

Not that joefromchicago needs any support from the likes of me, but I was no fan of "Pulp Fiction" either. It was mesmerizing, but immediately forgettable to me, the cinematic equivalent of fast food, which if I recall correctly was a line from The New Yorker's review.

Ultimately, in the case of films like "Pulp Fiction" and "Unbreakable", it comes down to whether or not the underlying themes are of any interest to the viewer. In my case, I don't care anything about the "dislocated psychology of the criminal mileu", but I am interested in the response of the ordinary guy in uncharted waters, which is what "Unbreakable" seemed to be about to me.

One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest
I enjoyed the film for the most part until it approached the end. If I had know it would have had such a devastating conclusion I would never have invested the time to watch it.

I've watched "Unbreakable" more than once and can appreciate the cinematic tour-de-force elements in the film -- I just got nothing from the film other than some playful interpretations of the superhero concept. The supernatural mumbo jumbo didn't add up. On the contrary, "Pulp Fiction" likely added upfor me because I lived the Los Angles area and the characterizations were so close to the truth it was uncanny. Not that I knew many criminals but I had a good direct channel into that world through acquaintances who were lawyers and judges. not to mention one of my closest friends was an LA cop. The drug scene in LA is indivisably entwined in the cross-section of that seedy aspect of our culture, explored in many other films, one of my favorites being "Goodfellas." I just find Shymalan's film rather obtuse and pretentious cinema, something I can't say for "Goodfellas" or "Pulp Fiction."

I am too lazy to read back along the entire thread, but I did check in yesterday to see if there were any recommendations along with the cringing. We ended up renting The Usual Suspects. I correctly guessed who Kaiser Sauve was... my long love-affair with too many mysteries was showing, I suspect. I liked the film, loved Kevin Spacey, but it had too much violence for my tastes.

Anybody seen Door-to-Door? I think viewers probably either love it or hate it.

piffka -- if you read the thread, it gave it away.

I read that you and Roberta liked it and somebody (was it Joe?) didn't. I had read this:

[WARNING: MAJOR SPOILER ALERT! DON'T READ FURTHER IF YOU'VE NEVER SEEN "THE USUAL SUSPECTS"]

so I knew something was up.

You're just too saavy I guess. I am sincere because I thought it was him then I thought it was Gabriel Byrne in the theater when I first saw it. Then I thought the scriptwriters were inserting Red Herrings and an entirely different ending was in store. The final scenes in the police station just before Spacey is leaving completely threw me -- where is this going? When he saunters down the street and the limp dissapears, getting into the car with "Kobayashi," I was floored. I love the way Chas Palminteri's detective finds all the clues that most of the story was fake after the coffee cup shatters on the floor. Of course, it's all a concoction that isn't real but it's fun and not any more violent than most of this kind of film.

Watching it again is entertaining just to analyze how Spacey brought off the performance and trying to find holes in the script. However, it's pretty tightly woven as the viewer is being suckered in with the fiction mixed with fact that Verbal is concocting. He seems genuienly afraid of Sosi.

BTW, I get a kick out of people who point out the "flaws," even thought they can't name them and admit they are tertiary. There can't be any flaws in the storyline because one never knows what really happened and what didn't happen. I've gone through the final shots on the ship that begins to clarify some of what happened and compared it to the opening shots of the actual heist. It's from the viewpoint of the real Sosi and from an imaginary point of view, of course. I've read reviews that conclude the ending negates the picture but they're unable to convincingly show that all the intent of the plot was to show how really sneaky and clever the Kevin Spacey character was.

Yes, that was fantastic when the camera zoomed in on the word --Skokie. It does make the entire movie a strange dream - what did really happen? Anything that was on the bulletin board (or the bottom of the coffee cup) is fabricated. In some ways it reminds me of a movie I saw last year, Lake Boat.

Piffka, I saw The Usual Suspects without knowing that something unexpected or tricky was going to happen. I was completely taken in. Too bad you read that something was coming. The surprise was ruined for you. Not surprised to hear you say that there was too much violence for you. I liked Door-to-Door.

The dreaming is used on the viewer as Palminteri is taking it in as a completely factual story. The film examines the tenuous grip we sometimes find we have on reality. It really doesn't mean that some of the incidences weren't real -- the prompting Verbal is getting from the bulletin board and other places is to steer the facts his way. He figures there has to be some fact mixed in for the story to ring true -- anything that Palminteri can check up on or already is aware of. Verbal was giving him enough information to keep himself clear of prosecution, convincing the cops that he was small potatos.

BTW, what's so mysterious about any of the deceptions -- politicians do it on a daily basis.

It is quite possible to view "Unbreakable" as a film entirely lacking in supernatural mumbo jumbo. One of the elements that makes it work for me is the uncertainty that any superheroes -or supernatural events- are involved at all.

I don't think the film makes a definite commitment one way or the other.

It certainly was sketchy -- okay, I'll try watching it again (I'm not stubborn). It was the ending of the film that seemed abrupt and contrived and it rather spoiled everything that had gone before it (hey, the same complaint we've read here about "The Usual Suspect," but I got that one). I still can't tell if Shamalyan is trying to be intimate and concerned about a human being's everyday problems or if he is just titillating us with supernatural tricks. There are so many movies in search of an ending that just don't succeed and it is interesting that we are picking on those that aspire to be more than they are.

Yes, I was looking for something, but I'd probably never have bothered with the movie if I hadn't seen it mentioned here. It was a very clever piece and that last scene where Kevin Spacey changes from limping to briskly walking is a gorgeous bit. My son, btw, loved it. Apparently it is quite a favorite with his group of friends. He was a little disgusted that Mr.P and I both started pointing out that something was up with "the cripple," but it was fun to see all the clues. I thought it was Kevin Spacey right at the beginning though, I was sure he was the guy who peed on the fire, so I was confused right at the start. (I had a bit of a Disney flashback wondering if he was playing twins.) I think it is harder to mask the identity of someone from behind than it is from the front.

Helen Mirren was devastating in Door-to-Door. What an amazing actress. I was very impressed with that film. According to Amazon, some people thought it was overdone... guess it wasn't perfect, but I liked it a lot. I even went to the BillPorter.com website and think I may buy something.

I just finished watching Notorious. Now THERE's a movie!

I watched "The Usual Suspects" shortly after it came out, when Kevin Spacey hadn't really hit it big yet. (And no, that's NOT where I got my name! ) That's part of it now, is you know that he has to have a juicy role, because he's well Kevin Spacey. He wouldn't have a bit part.

Kind of like that first movie with Edward Norton, what was it called? It was the first time I had seen him, bought him as Mr. Milquetoast, the final transformation was quite startling. Now that he has built up more of a persona, I doubt I would have bought it so thoroughly.

That Edward Norton movie is Primal Fear.

Have we brought up the Austin Powers movies? I can't bear them.