Why Islam? Fastest Growing Religion in America

@MURDOCK212,

MURDOCK212 wrote:

Kinda like rooting and cheering for the fastest growing balloon at a boardwalk water shooting game, wouldn't you say?

You know what happens to that balloon!

"Subhan'Allah"= Glorious is God

Yeah what isn't there to cheer about? I love my religion and I'm more than amazed that it's the fastest growing religion in the World.

And nice example about the balloon and water shooting game

But we're not here to discuss about petty games that little infants play, were talking about a religion that's expanded throughout the years and is constantly doing so day by day.

And there's nothing that can stop Islam from spreading.

Thanks for your reply

Thank you for yours, Murdock.

I was not talking about "petty games little infants play." I was talking about the possible danger of "expansion”…and the folly of being too sure of one’s self.

You might think about the Persian Empire; the Egyptian Kingdom; the Roman Empire; the British Empire...and a whole bunch of other entities that thought they could never be stopped from expanding and spreading.

Humanity itself is not immune from annihilation, Murdock. The entire of the human race could be ended in one, easily presumed, cosmic catastrophe. Bubonic plague, polio, the Hun Hoard, Aztecs, Nazism, the Soviet Union all were expanding…and came to an abrupt halt. Anything…any entity or organization can be stopped…even annihilated or eradicated. And the faster the expansion…and the more danger perceived from that expansion…the more likely it is to face roadblocks. Right now Islam is presenting a very dangerous and damning picture of itself to the world…and the world is not prepared to greet it with the open arms you seem to think exist.

If you feel good thinking nothing can stop Islam from spreading…fine. Feel good. But if you are going to argue that assertion in an Internet forum, you really have got to provide some basis.

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A good deal of the claims of Muslims about how many adherents they have are based on the entire populations of nations in which apostasy is punishable by death. It's highly unlikely that anyone will profess a different religion, or no religion at all, when to do so could mean one would be executed. Imposing a religion with death threats--oh yeah, there's a religion worth loving.

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@MURDOCK212,

Quote:

Subhan'Allah, it's good to know Islam is the fastest growing religion across the world.

It would be nice to hear your reasoning as to why this is a good thing?

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@firdaus,

Well,if you read the Quarn once(transliteration one),you will find that the religion Islam actually spreads peace and tells how we should live our lives. After all,you judge a car by its features,not by judging its driver.
For example, there are two girls who equally look very pretty. One of them is a Muslim and the other one is a non-Muslim. One is wearing a burkha and the one a pair of shorts. Suppose that they are going on the pavement of an isolated road. Near them is a gang of criminals. So the Muslim girl has a greater chance of being safe rather than the non-Muslim, whom the gang will tease,.........

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@snj,

Not necessarily, the burkha can provoke intense hostility in some people. The reverse may actually be true.

Quote:

A man has been jailed for 15 months for spitting at a Muslim woman on a train after a 7 July bombings commemoration.
Charles Adams, 23, admitted religiously aggravated assault and affray with his brother Mark Adams, 26, and father Mark Raymond Adams, 50, from London.

Michelle Idrees, from Luton, was wearing a burkha when she was targeted by the father and his two sons.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6177076.stm

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@firdaus,

I've got strong Christian leanings and always will have, but I have to say I admire Islams hardline stance against criminals and perverts etc.
For example here in England many of our cities have got large muslim communities, and sometimes they put notices up saying "Sharia Zone, no drink, drugs, gays or prostitutes allowed", and there are youtube vids of "Muslim Patrols" going around the streets telling such people to move along.
(Are pictures allowed in A2K? I could post a photo of a Sharia Zone notice seen on a lamppost in London)

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@Romeo Fabulini,

Those people get arrested.

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Vigilantes make such charming neighbors.

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Here ya go, it's one of a number of posters stuck up around a muslim area of London.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/sharia-sticker.jpg

Incidentally the previous Archbishop of Canterbury Dr Williams got in hot water by hinting that- "adopting parts of Islamic Sharia law would help maintain social cohesion"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7232661.stm

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@Romeo Fabulini,

So what happens to people who don't fit in to Sharia zones? Say gays for instance who aren't breaking the law. Are they excluded from the area? I would presume they would rather not be there. Still it doesn't seem right that this bullying should be allowed. Certainly seems like a threat to the freedoms of the nonmuslim English people.

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@auroreII,

Anyone can put a sign up, and anyone who tries to enforce their own laws will be arrested.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

Anyone can put a sign up, and anyone who tries to enforce their own laws will be arrested.

Throw a rock through a window 3:00am in the morning, and it's very likely no one will see you, or (if they did see you) identify you...and then even if they do ID you - can they ID you in the dark of night enough to reach ID 'beyond reasonable doubt'?

Knife some tyres as you walk past, and the same.

Etc.

And if enough people are doing such, with little chance of getting caught, it becomes very intimidating...many people start 'toeing the line'.

If this form of intimidation extends as far as anyone speaking out against such...it becomes even more of a problem.

Of course this sort of example is just a possibility of what can happen...an it should also be noted that variations of this sort of intimidation does happen in various countries.

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@vikorr,

There's no evidence to support that is happening.

Why are you so keen to associate anti-social behaviour with Moslems, and not other groups?

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@izzythepush,

There sure is evidence. Muslim no go zones are mapped in Paris. And Sharia Patrols walk the Tower Hamlets in England.

As for the second part of your post the behavior is not anti social, it is anti infidel. And deadly, and growing. Cool

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Aurorell wrote:

Quote:

So what happens to people who don't fit in to Sharia zones? Say gays for instance who aren't breaking the law. Are they excluded from the area?

Muslims regard them as breaking Sharia law simply by being gay, so they hassle them even though being gay is not against British law.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

There's no evidence to support that is happening.

Why are you so keen to associate anti-social behaviour with Moslems, and not other groups?

I was pointing out the flaw in your argument of

Quote:

Anyone can put a sign up, and anyone who tries to enforce their own laws will be arrested.

This is not the case...we try to make it the case, and in a perfect world it would be the case...but it's not.

As for no evidence of such happening...there is evidence such intimdatory tactics it in any number of places...have you not been following the sectarian war in Iraq, the actions of the Taliban, the civil wars in africa, Thailand and China, the church bombings in Indonesia, etc?

It's not a matter of 'keenness' with just Moslems - it's a matter of reality (as a side note, our papers here don't report well on international news) with any major group (or if significant enough, minor groups) who have an unacceptably high percentage of violent followers.

Islam in my view has that (an unacceptably high percentage of violent followers). The percentage to me is dangerously high. It then has an even higher percentage of sympathisers...which latter combines only to create an even more difficult situation.

But as I said - it's not about 'just moslems' - any group that had the same near & current record (and percentages) I would also find problem with. What amazes me is that people most people aren't aware of the breadth of violence within the religion., nor the percentage of radicalised members & sympathisers.

If it helps - I find that the western world govt's & companies decades long history (and current behaviours) of incredibly predatory practices in third world countries to be ugly, enslaving (semantically : impoverishing), and something that should be criminalised.

I find the patriotism that allows people to be so easily manipulated into supporting a war (and in enough cases - triggers them into intimidating those who don't support the war) to be an incredibly ugly downside to what should have been a good thing.

I find peoples wilful ignorance about govt actions in the lead up to war (ie demonisation of the enemy, creation of fear, passable justification never before raised etc) to be not just sad, but complicit to unjust wars.

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@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

Islam in my view has that (an unacceptably high percentage of violent followers).

So you point to the religion and ignore other factors. When the IRA were setting off bombs over here, we didn't blame Catholicism. Hitler was a Catholic, and you don't get more violent than that.

Briefly, during centuries of Western hegemony in Moslem countries, radical Islam has been the only constant source of opposition. When people are disillusioned with their political leaders, have little work, or money and hear about Western exploitation, radical Islam seems a way of fighting back.

These things never occur in a vacuum. The vast majority of Moslems are decent law abiding people who just want to get on with their lives.

You're an Aussie, you should appreciate this.

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@izzythepush,

That video took a little getting used to, but it was quite funny.

Quote:

So you point to the religion and ignore other factors.

No, I'm trying to keep things simple in what is a very complex discussion. Unfortunately, if you were do dig...you would find that many things are interconnected to me, and to join all the dots in a post is...very difficult without seeming to write a book.

Although my response I find that the western world govt's & companies decades long history (and current behaviours) of incredibly predatory practices in third world countries to be ugly, enslaving (semantically : impoverishing), and something that should be criminalised alludes to the just last half century, I'm well aware that there is also another 2 Centuries or so where Islam has 'lost to the West' (and before that the crusades etc). I'm aware of how the boundaries of ME countries were redrawn after WW1 (surprisingly few people are), and how this affected certain countries (like Iraq / Kuwait), and the controversy surrounding the Iraq/Iran war and the Saddam's subsequent 'invasion' of Kuwait.

Quote:

When the IRA were setting off bombs over here, we didn't blame Catholicism. Hitler was a Catholic, and you don't get more violent than that.

Certainly you don't get more violent than that...though this point does illustrate something else too - Hitler (even if he was Christian) invaded to further the cause of the Germans, or perhaps the Arean race, and the other stuff perhaps because he was nuts, as well as hateful - and he never claimed religious motivation for the violence. My issue with Islam is that the violence appears to receive major motivation from the religion itself, and they are often committing the violence to further the cause of Islam (which is often their claim).

I think I've also already discussed in this thread the difference between Jesus & Mohammed's teaching (PS I'm not Christian). Once I became aware of the history of Islam's founding, I found that the behaviour of fanatics became much more understandable (I started reading after 9-11 because I couldn't understand why Arabs in particular hated the Americans so much - and I also read books by muslims, Tariq Ali wrote and interesting one).

My opinion is that if more people read up on the founding, more people would find the current violent behaviour follows a historic pattern set at the founding, and would therefore find it very concerning.

Quote:

These things never occur in a vacuum. The vast majority of Moslems are decent law abiding people who just want to get on with their lives.

Of course.

To talk about a violent side does not mean I'm not aware of the peaceful side. My point has always been the percentage of violent individuals within the religion, and how it seems religion plays a major part in that (combined with the number of sympathisers)

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@vikorr,

In relation to Hitler and religion by the way, wikipedia has the following to say :

Quote:

In his semi-autobiographical Mein Kampf, Hitler makes religious allusions, but declares himself neutral in sectarian matters and supportive of the separation between church and state, while criticising political Catholicism. He presents a nihilistic vision, in which the universe is ordered around principles of struggle between weak and strong, rather than on conventional Christian notions long prominent in Germany.

While campaigning for office in the early 1930s, Hitler offered moderate public statements on Christianity, promising not to interfere with the churches if given power, and calling Christianity the foundation of German morality. In power, the Hitler regime conducted a protracted Struggle with the Churches.

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The "West" has exploited the middle east for its oil for more than a century. You ignore a significant factor in the attitudes of Muslims, especially the radical Muslims. That is the crusades. As far as many Muslims are concerned, the crusades never ended. Mehmet Ali Agca, who shot the Pope in 1980, said he wanted to kill "the leader of the Crusades." Whether cynical or not, many Muslim radicals use such a claim about the crusades to underpin their propaganda. It's very effective, because many Muslims have a mindset that the West has been attacking and exploiting them for a thousand years. It doesn't matter if it's true, politics is about perception, not reality. I highly recommend The Crusades through Arab Eyes by Amin Maalouf. It turns on its head the notion that the Arabs were backward and barbaric, and shows the barbarism and greed of the "Franj" ("Ferengi" to the Turk) who invaded the middle east. Whether or not one agrees with Maalouf's analysis and historical synthesis, he accurate describes the attitudes of Muslims toward the West, and that a lot of it derives from the crusades. To ignore that is the equivalent of ignoring the obsessive anti-Muslim attitude of the Serbs in the 1990s, which they traced back to their humiliation in Kosovo in the 14th century--they cast themselves as heroic defenders of Christendom, and the Bosnians as evil. The loony Sarajevo psychiatrist, Radovan Karadzic, who was the Bosnian Serb propagandist, insisted that the Serbs call the Bosnians Turks, because he knew it would inflame their hatred.

Maalouf's book is short, well-written, easy to read and shows just how important this perception of westerners as greedy, rapacious and murderous exploiters is to the Muslim world.

1 Reply

Why Islam? Fastest Growing Religion in America

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