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Why are we in Irag without the UN?

 
 
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 03:27 pm
Where are the WMD's or other junk?
Orange , yellow , blue, Green, why the color code for attacks?
Enimies will attack when ready, the color code is silly.
Bush jr is wrong in Iraq, our enemy was in Afganistan, or so I'm told.
Wish we had proof of anything.....
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 2,003 • Replies: 24
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 03:40 pm
Well you can wish in one hand and . . . uh . . . spit in the other, and see which one fills up first . . .
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 03:47 pm
Proof:
The administration is showing that repeating a lie often enough equals proof for the more gullible in the chattering classes.
0 Replies
 
Fedral
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 03:48 pm
Re: Why are we in Irag without the UN?
jon28518 wrote:
Where are the WMD's or other junk?
Orange , yellow , blue, Green, why the color code for attacks?
Enimies will attack when ready, the color code is silly.
Bush jr is wrong in Iraq, our enemy was in Afganistan, or so I'm told.
Wish we had proof of anything.....


1) Even if Saddam didn't have any more WMD, it was still worth going to war to remove a sadistic, aggressive murderer out of power. Although Iraq is the size of California and they had over 10 years to practice hiding things that they didn't want us to see....We should expect to find everything immediately Rolling Eyes

2) The color warnings are to warn people of the LIKELYHOOD of an attack based upon the data gathered by our Intelligence organizations (If another attack happens and they DIDN'T warn us beforehand, how many people would bitch then?)

3) We have proof that he and his sons murdered tens of thousands of their own people and that the news organizations failed to report it because they were afraid that they would lose 'access' to the dictator.

I for one am glad we took care of him now before he hurt too many others.

"When a rabid dog is running down the street threatening the neighborhood, you dont hold a local meeting to see what you should do about it. You just grab the gun in the closet and shoot it down"
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 03:55 pm
Re: Why are we in Irag without the UN?
Fedral wrote:
jon28518 wrote:
Where are the WMD's or other junk?
Orange , yellow , blue, Green, why the color code for attacks?
Enimies will attack when ready, the color code is silly.
Bush jr is wrong in Iraq, our enemy was in Afganistan, or so I'm told.
Wish we had proof of anything.....


1) Even if Saddam didn't have any more WMD, it was still worth going to war to remove a sadistic, aggressive murderer out of power. Although Iraq is the size of California and they had over 10 years to practice hiding things that they didn't want us to see....We should expect to find everything immediately Rolling Eyes

But that isn't how international law works. War would have been justified had Hussein been proven to have been hiding WMDs. I removing sadistic leaders is good enough reason for invasion, sign me up as a collaborator when the Canadians invade the US!

Quote:
2) The color warnings are to warn people of the LIKELYHOOD of an attack based upon the data gathered by our Intelligence organizations (If another attack happens and they DIDN'T warn us beforehand, how many people would bitch then?)

alsthough the frequencey of increased "alerts" when Bush's poll number were slipping was certainly suspicious. So suspicious that I notice very few alerts occur anymoer.

Quote:
3) We have proof that he and his sons murdered tens of thousands of their own people and that the news organizations failed to report it because they were afraid that they would lose 'access' to the dictator.

But Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch (two organizations
on the "terrorism" list according to Ashcroft) have reported on thses conditions for years. They have only become worthy of comment by the chatterrers since the teams have failed to find WMD.

Quote:
I for one am glad we took care of him now before he hurt too many others.

Good for you. Do you want a cookie?

Quote:
"When a rabid dog is running down the street threatening the neighborhood, you dont hold a local meeting to see what you should do about it. You just grab the gun in the closet and shoot it down"

Ohhh...how testoseroney! Do you feel better now?
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 04:53 pm
Serious questions
Has anyone posting here lost a relative &/or a loved one or had one injured badly in Iraq? Has anyone here been seriously wounded in Iraq?
You get the drift?

If so, then let us know "it was worth it, K.
0 Replies
 
Fedral
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 05:13 pm
I am part of the third generation of a four generation military family (American, British or Italian military). My grandfathers, father, uncles, cousins and now my nephews and cousins children have served or are now serving in the military. (Mostly Army with a few marines or Airforce)

I currently have 4 members of the family in Iraq plus 2 in Afghanistan along with 7 good friends that I grew up with or served with during my time in. My family deals with the agony everyday of waiting and not knowing what may happen.

One of my cousins is a Combat Engineer with the U.S. Army and was part of the group that helped dig up some of the mass graves in Iraq, so don't ask him whether it was important that we went. My brother-in-law is an infantryman in the 101st Airborne and has spoken with a large number of Kurds about how they were treated by Saddams regime. My cousins 20 year old son has been wounded 2 times by shrapnel from RPG and IED's but wouldn't leave if he could because he feels his specialty (Medic) is needed in Iraq.

We have over the years lost 7 members of our family in WW II, Korea, Vietnam and 1 to a training accident. So yes, my family understands loss. But we also learned about why dictators and despots need to be fought. Ask me and I'll post my uncle's pictures that he took when his unit liberated a camp in Germany. But I guess people like you only care about saving people when it doesn't incovenience you.

Y'all need to get a clue and realize that some 'leaders' need to be eliminated before they kill or hurt anymore people around them.
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 05:33 pm
Quote:
But I guess people like you only care about saving people when it doesn't incovenience you.

That was a mean spirited comment, in addition to being a stupid one.

Quote:
Y'all need to get a clue and realize that some 'leaders' need to be eliminated before they kill or hurt anymore people around them.

Okay Mr. Smart guy, which ones? Who decides? The US? Don't make me laugh! The UN is perhaps the best guardian for world peace. Isn't it a pity Bush and Co. wouldn't work through them? But that is assuming that Bush and his buddies wanted peace. They wanted war, the evidence is plain as day. Mad
0 Replies
 
perception
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 05:50 pm
Fedral

Thanks for your postings---Don't mind Hobitbob----no one here takes him seriously.

Hobitbob

Why don't you tell Fedral why you're so bitter at the US, the US Army and life in general?
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 06:09 pm
People like me?
What do you know about me or people like me?

BTW this isn't about me or people like me. It's about policy.

If the "good people" went around invading all the "bad people" there would be more wars than we have now; a whole lot more. Now that pre-emptive strike has been deemed OK I am guessing that it's open to any country to invade any other on that basis? The USA has the most WMDs, so any country is open to invade the USA now if they feel that the USA is an immenent threat, right?
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 06:47 pm
Why our going it alone is failing:Japan, Korea refuse troops offers
Quote:
U.S. Allies Rethinking Roles in Iraq
By NICK WADHAMS

In a blow to U.S. hopes for more support in rebuilding Iraq, Japan on Thursday delayed sending troops and other American allies altered plans after a surge in anti-coalition violence.

South Korea decided to cap its possible troop deployment at 3,000, rebuffing Washington's request for a bigger force. Denmark said Thursday it would not, for now, send more soldiers. And nations such as France that opposed the war that ousted Saddam Hussein again declared that the U.S.-led coalition's postwar plan must be changed.

The reassessments came a day after a suicide truck bombing at a headquarters for Italian forces in southern Iraq killed at least 31 people - the latest in a series of attacks aimed at foreigners helping the United States rebuild Iraq.

Many countries and agencies in Iraq, including Spain, the Netherlands, the United Nations and the international Red Cross, have been reconsidering their presence since they became targets.

Japan, one of Washington's most steadfast and vocal supporters, had planned to send its first troops to Iraq by the end of 2003. But after Wednesday's attack on the Italian compound, Chief Cabinet Secretary Yasuo Fukuda backed off, saying the security situation is not yet stable enough.

That means Japan will almost certainly delay deploying personnel, who would have filled non-combat roles, until sometime next year. Attacks like Wednesday's have spurred questions over whether any area can be considered safe, and the political fallout of any Japanese deaths would likely be high for Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi.

Speaking in Washington, National Security Adviser Condoleeza Rice said the Bush administration understood Japan's reconsidering the timing of its troop deployment. She added that out of all nations giving money to Iraq's reconstruction, Japan had pledged the most.

``We're very pleased with what Japan is able to do, and understand that countries have to make their own determinations about when they do what,'' Rice said.

In announcing South Korea's capping the number of troops it would send, President Roh Moo-hyun's office said he hopes any deployment would ``focus on assisting rehabilitation while leaving security to Iraqi police and military.''

Others also pledged to stand by the United States but said their plans - as well as the coalition's for postwar Iraq - must be rethought.

The suicide bombing against Italians in Nasiriyah prompted Portugal to send 128 elite police officers originally slated for that city to Basra instead.

Denmark's defense minister decided not to bolster the 410-strong force it already has in Iraq, rejecting a push by two Danish soldiers unions to send 100 more troops.

``It is an extremely dangerous job that our soldiers are doing,'' Defense Minister Svend Aage Jensby said Thursday, adding that it was still possible at a later time to send more forces. ``We are monitoring the events, and should the terror move to the south to our area, we would have to reconsider.''

Immediately after the attack, Italy's conservative Premier Silvio Berlusconi said his country would not be intimidated and reaffirmed the country's engagement in Iraq. His coalition parties promptly agreed, yet opposition forces said the government should review its Iraq policy.

The opposition urged the government to press its European allies and the United States to speed the transition of power to Iraqis and hand the United Nations a larger role. But it stopped short of calling for a troop pullout.

Other countries were reducing their staff well before Wednesday, already finding the security situation untenable.

Spain is withdrawing much of its diplomatic staff from Iraq after a Spanish navy captain was killed in the truck bombing of the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad on August 19, and a Spanish sergeant working for Spain's military intelligence was assassinated Baghdad on Oct. 9.

Two other U.S. allies, the Netherlands and Bulgaria, moved their diplomats from Baghdad to Amman, Jordan, last month.

Britain, Washington's most steadfast ally, has lost 19 soldiers but Prime Minister Tony Blair has not backed down despite pressure from Britons.

Yet there are indications the United States may be considering a change or speeding up the transfer of power to Iraqis.

The top U.S. administrator in Baghdad, L. Paul Bremer, met with President Bush in Washington on Wednesday to review new strategies to hasten the transfer of political authority.

``We are in a very intense period as we come up on the Dec. 15 deadline'' for Iraq's interim Governing Council to set a timetable for writing a new constitution and holding democratic elections, said Bremer.

Creating a smaller body within the council, perhaps 10 people, with expanded, leading roles, or establishing one person as a leader were among options now considered by the United States, according to a senior administration official in Washington.

The attacks also emboldened countries to declare that they don't think the American postwar policies are working.

``Everyday, it is spiraling in Iraq with American, British, Polish, Spanish, Italian deaths,'' French Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin told Europe-1 radio Thursday. ``How many deaths does it take to understand that it is essential to change the approach?''

De Villepin added that France was prepared to help with the reconstruction of Iraq once sovereignty was awarded to a provisional Iraqi government.

``This is an extended hand that I hold out to our Americans friends, because what is at stake concerns us all. It is the security of the world we are concerned with.''


11/13/03 14:53
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:04 pm
A guess.
The Provisional Govt. of Iraq will be declared. The US troops will be phased down. Mission Accomplished will be declared. Behind the scene the Multi-Nationals will make deals with whoever the feel will really be in power. If civil war breaks out, which I strongly feel it will, the Shrub Regime will state that the US & the coalition did their best but the Iraqi people are free to fashion their own Govt. The Liberation was successful.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:20 pm
Quote:
As this long and difficult war ends, I would like to address a few special words to...the American people: Your steadfastness in supporting our insistence on peace with honor has made peace with honor possible
.
Richard Nixon as we left Vietnam with honor. Bush will also, no matter the actuality, say "Mission Accomplished"
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:34 pm
perception wrote:


Thanks for your postings---Don't mind Hobitbob----no one here takes him seriously.



perception - please do not post lies like this. You are speaking for yourself and not all members of this forum. Many of us do take Hobitbob seriously, and appreciate his thoughtful postings. I don't always agree with the conclusions he reaches, but then I don't agree with any one person all the time.
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:48 pm
Hobitbob is much appreciated.
Can we refrain from attacking people personaly and focus on the topics? Uh....we can try, right?
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:49 pm
even moi?
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:53 pm
Where is the UN anyway? They refused protection, got hit with a bomb, and all but pulled out of Iraq.
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 07:57 pm
Brand X wrote:
Where is the UN anyway?

New York and Geneva, I think. Very Happy
0 Replies
 
perception
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2003 09:46 pm
Brand X wrote:
Where is the UN anyway? They refused protection, got hit with a bomb, and all but pulled out of Iraq.


They're back safe in the cocktail circuit-----now you know why it was folly to think about turning Iraq over to the UN.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Nov, 2003 05:46 am
At the moment, the issue of UN participation is moot--they provide peacekeepers. The Shrub and his "last drop of some other poor fool's blood" military cowboys have no peace to keep . . .
0 Replies
 
 

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