1
   

mathematics define or create reality?

 
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 05:36 pm
@Alan McDougall,
Alan McDougall;66177 wrote:
I am somewhat your senior, no matter I like to speak to the youth, How the young waste their youth

Just kidding I know you are an Elder Statesman of remarkable repute, you just need to be discovered thats all

Peace

Why do I have that feeling some one is blowing sand up my essss???
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 05:41 pm
@Fido,
Fido;66263 wrote:
Why do I have that feeling some one is blowing sand up my essss???


You are a nice guy no harm intended, just kidding

Peace :bigsmile:
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 09:16 pm
@Alan McDougall,
Alan McDougall;66265 wrote:
You are a nice guy no harm intended, just kidding

Peace :bigsmile:

A couple of week back they were trying to ban me because I said something nasty about the Indians, and how ever you conceive of them, they are not a single group, and as Caucasians are not distinct from us, so it was more a comment on culture... So, perhaps I am not nice, or perhaps, if people can misconstrue what you are saying they will...Which means that even in this free place we must always be concerned lest we offend... And yet, I may tend to agree with you, that I am a nice, if that means good guy, with no harm intended...Bless you...
0 Replies
 
Labyrinth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 08:29 pm
@The Architect phil,
The Architect;44861 wrote:
Equations, theorems, and proofs explain natural occurrences and can predict certain life situations. But is that all they do? Can mathematical expressions do more than just describe what already exists? Or can they be used to create, to build?
No more rhetorical questions. I want answers but they aren't easy to find. My real problem is that I don't know where to look for a solution. Ability, talent, whatever you may call it, is not the problem. I know that I have the capability to succeed in life, in school, in anything; but, I don't have direction. I want someone or something to push me the right way. I don't think thats happened yet, and herein lies the unsolvable question.
As esoteric as this may be, I'm crying for outside help. I want to study. I want to know the reasoning behind reality.
I want to believe that mathematics will end my search.


I wish you the best in your search. According to (or inferred by) Locke, mathematics' advantage over other demonstrations of reason is sure signification. There's no need to argue over the signification of numbers, but a study about the moral term, let's say, justice...must start with a clear definition of justice. Even if the definition is extremely well worded, agreement is far from guaranteed because of the variable signification of words held by individuals. Mathematics can just go right to the demonstration.

Given this, one can argue that mathematics will always be ahead of other fields because of their dependency on words. It sounds great to me as an adjunct study. This is how I plan to approach it myself. I don't see what mathematics alone may show you.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 09:21 pm
@Labyrinth,
Labyrinth;66467 wrote:
I wish you the best in your search. According to (or inferred by) Locke, mathematics' advantage over other demonstrations of reason is sure signification. There's no need to argue over the signification of numbers, but a study about the moral term, let's say, justice...must start with a clear definition of justice. Even if the definition is extremely well worded, agreement is far from guaranteed because of the variable signification of words held by individuals. Mathematics can just go right to the demonstration.

Given this, one can argue that mathematics will always be ahead of other fields because of their dependency on words. It sounds great to me as an adjunct study. This is how I plan to approach it myself. I don't see what mathematics alone may show you.

Even one plus one equals is a moral question... There is no escaping it...It is just like a microscope or a telescope...Each improves ones vision, and narrows the field of focus...If the object is to see one thing, physical reality well, then math is for you...If your need is to see how all life works and everything fits together, then even moral terms fail us... We can possibly understand more than we will ever give words to...We know reality but cannot express truth, and of all means of communication numbers lie the most...Their exactness is all facade...
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 01:14 am
@Fido,
Fido;66472 wrote:
Even one plus one equals is a moral question... There is no escaping it...It is just like a microscope or a telescope...Each improves ones vision, and narrows the field of focus...If the object is to see one thing, physical reality well, then math is for you...If your need is to see how all life works and everything fits together, then even moral terms fail us... We can possibly understand more than we will ever give words to...We know reality but cannot express truth, and of all means of communication numbers lie the most...Their exactness is all facade...


A little off topic guys But does it not amaze you here we are communicated as almost instantaneously , from all mourners of the earth

As I look at my monitor my thought and words bounce of into cyberspace, and you guys pick them up and humiliate me with your deep and profound insight to existence :bigsmile:
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 07:13 am
@Alan McDougall,
Alan McDougall;66488 wrote:
A little off topic guys But does it not amaze you here we are communicated as almost instantaneously , from all mourners of the earth

As I look at my monitor my thought and words bounce of into cyberspace, and you guys pick them up and humiliate me with your deep and profound insight to existence :bigsmile:

Is that for all mourners of the earth, or from all corners of the earth??? I hate to be the one to point this out in front of all the math heads, but the world, as a sphere may have some point, but it does not have any corners...
Peas....
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Jun, 2009 02:48 am
@Fido,
Fido;66524 wrote:
Is that for all mourners of the earth, or from all corners of the earth??? I hate to be the one to point this out in front of all the math heads, but the world, as a sphere may have some point, but it does not have any corners...
Peas....


You are very perceptive, maybe the best mind on the forum oh! great one, now we know the earth has no corners , it does have points of reference

So I alter my most unmathematical statement and say, we are interconnected via amazing cyberspace www from reference points all over the revolving planet

Anyway maths is abstract logical thinking the universal language of logic , observed as concrete reality in nature
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Jun, 2009 05:59 am
@The Architect phil,
Al; the whole is more than the sum of the parts... Until math finds the missing moral piece it will be worse than useless...I am not saying that people do not find it useful, but that without the moral question the answer will always be destructive, and so, dangerous for humanity... Now, mind you, I love what people can do with math...I read a history of the development of nuclear weapons; and you may notice the different shapes of the bombs dropped on Japan... What those shapes reflect is the different assembly speeds of the different bomb material...One material could essentially be shot from a cannon to assemble, and one had to be assembled with a shaped charge, at a higher rate of speed... That means all of the material had to be forced together at high speed to induce an explosive nuclear reaction whose force was exhausted in a fraction of a second... There were still a lot of zoomies flying around, and people were still dying, but the parts of the bomb had long since quit being explosive... Here is the thing... We had all kind of math at work in every process of production, but if morality had worked at anytime leading up to that production, in the years or centuries before, then not one part of that war would have been necessary... Who can care if math can get the answer correct if the correct question is not asked of math, and if it were asked, could not be answered by math???Physical reality is not the problem, and not the solution... The solution lies in the spiritual conception of mankind, and in the literal spiriual conception of the individual... Here God becomes our devil, when he makes individuals, one at a time, disconnected from the genes they are made of, and the cultures they are raise in... Eveyone needs a mountain top, or a step ladder to climb that can raie them above it all...The stuff we calculate, space, time, matter; all have to seem as nothing... We have to be able to see through reality to truly see reality, because moral reality is by no mean clearly visible...The world is burning, and all we can see is the smoke and shadows...
0 Replies
 
 

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