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Displaying the American Flag = Hate Speach?

 
 
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 12:21 pm
Will idiot Americans finally admit defeat and genuflect to Hispanic culture or will it take Mexican gangs going door to door beating some sense into the heads of the last holdouts?

Tensions are rising at a California high school where five students were sent home for wearing American flag T-shirts on Cinco de Mayo. More than 200 Hispanic students reportedly skipped class on Thursday and marched to school district headquarters while chanting "we want respect" and "si se puedes" -- "yes we can.”

Film critic Roger Ebert also took to Twitter saying, “Kids who wear American flag T-shirts on 5 May should have to share a lunchroom table with those who wear a hammer and sickle on 4 July.”

http://dailycaller.com/2010/05/07/bound-to-taint-prom-gang-violence-retaliation-feared-for-five-students-who-wore-american-flag-apparel-to-school-on-cinco-de-mayo/

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/07/tensions-high-california-high-school-following-flag-flap/
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Type: Question • Score: 8 • Views: 2,664 • Replies: 31

 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 12:36 pm
I disagree with the schools decision; although I suspect there is more to this story about how obnoxious these kids were. Of course, obnoxious kids still have free speech rights.

So, the school administrators most likely acted in an idiotic matter.

That being said... claims that Robert Ebert is now part of a Mexican gang are a little ridiculous.

There are Hispanic Americans.



0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  4  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 12:42 pm
i only wear my Hammer and Sickle t-shirt on May 1st

i wear my Union Jack t-shirt on July 4th
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 01:21 pm
I think the school's reaction was way too much. Having said that, I think that the fact that these student felt compelled to send this kind of message illustrates a lack of cultural education in our schools and media.

The use of authority in this case only makes this worse. I'd have rather let the kids wear the shirts and let them self advertise their ignorance to their peers. No need for the adults to get involved. I give a lot of credit to the youth on matters of racial equality. Being a hateful bigot is not "cool."

In fact, perhaps they deserve more credit than us adults at times.

T
K
O
TheCorrectResponse
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 01:35 pm
@Diest TKO,
So would wearing the American flag on Bastille Day mean those kids are: "Being a hateful bigot..."


Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 01:45 pm
@TheCorrectResponse,
TheCorrectResponse wrote:
So would wearing the American flag on Bastille Day mean those kids are: "Being a hateful bigot..."

Not by itself no. Just wearing a shirt is nothing at all. If however wearing the flag is some sort of message to other ethnicities, it's an entirely different thing. It's not coincidental anymore.

These children might have simply thought they were being funny, and if that's the case, I'm inclined to let this be a educational moment. However, Hispanics are fighting for their dignity in our country, and constantly having to push back against the idea that they belong here less. I see a real reason to advocate on the behalf of Hispanic children in these schools as well.

I think that their peers and not the principal are the correct agents for this advocacy.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 01:48 pm
@djjd62,
djjd62 wrote:
i wear my Union Jack t-shirt on July 4th
I wore my USA soccer jersey in London on the 4th of July. The Brits had fun taking the piss out of me while we drank and celebrated Independence Day together. the next day however, I was a bit achy and sore. That day we called Dependence Day.

The English have a good sense of humor, and sarcasm.
K
O
rabel22
 
  0  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 04:00 pm
@Diest TKO,
I love most hispanics. Its only the illegals I have a problem with. If I have to show my drivers lisc. why shouldent illegals.
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 04:09 pm
@rabel22,
It's only the bigots I have a problem with... if we could keep the immigrant landscapers and kick out the racist idiots, the country would be a nicer (and greener) place.

TheCorrectResponse
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 May, 2010 05:32 pm
@ebrown p,
Since Rabel22 is against illegal immigrants is he by definition a racist?

If being against illegals equals being an “idiot bigot” are just whites who are against illegals bigots or are Blacks and Hispanics who are against illegals bigoted too?

TKO is for “peer pressure”. You tell me, what form is peer pressure likely to come in your average California High School: rational discourse or intimidation/bullying and violence?

How can one have rational discourse with “idiot bigots” anyway? Doesn’t that leave violence or statutory law as the two real alternatives?

Is TKO being bigoted by assuming that Hispanics from Ecuador or Nicaragua, etc. care about a day that isn’t even celebrated in most of Mexico let alone a national holiday there?

Why should Mexicans be “respected” but not people of other Hispanic Nationalities? Should there be TKO’s “peer pressure” against American children who wear the flag to school on August 10th or September 15th?

I am sure you have answered questions like this on this board but I am apolitical (I hate the left and the right equally) so I haven’t read them. Personally I think we are past the tipping point and are now a Hispanic country. I have no children and so have no dog in the fight of the “future of America.” My only concern is how much violence it is going to cause while I am still around.

While it seems most people who talk a lot on the subject concentrate on what “idiot bigots” the vast majority of whites are if there is violence I don’t know if that is where the lion’s share of the violence will come from. This is why I mentioned Ecuadorians and Nicaraguans. Most of the Hispanics I have known personally are from these two countries and they are generally well disposed to Americans (possibly because their families are here legally) but have a deep abiding HATERED of Mexicans. Frankly at first I was surprised. Of those who gave a rational reason it seemed to be because their compatriots who went to Mexico looking for work were treated horribly by the Mexican people and the government or because they see Mexicans as setting themselves up to speak for all Hispanics in the U.S.

So even if we can avoid violence by creating hate laws that whites who disrespect Hispanics are acting criminally I don’t see that as solving the problem of violence among Hispanic groups that hate each other. What do you think? Will the biggest problem be “idiot bigot” whites vs. Hispanic or Hispanic nationalities vs. each other?
rabel22
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 12:01 am
@TheCorrectResponse,
According to E Brown I am. I of course being a law abideing citizen disagree.
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 01:00 am
The problem here is that the kids were being confrontational and likely to incite violence by wearing such clothing.
That (the confrontational attitude) is what needs dealing with.

Likely now is that on 4 july hispanic kids will wear Mexican or other national flags and the cycle will continue.
TheCorrectResponse
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 02:02 am
@dadpad,
In what news report are you getting the information that the kids were being confrontational? Or are you saying that simply by wearing the flag that is being confrontational? So back to my original question: is wearing the American flag hate speech, if some group says it is? If a group says if you wear the American flag will will hurt you does that give a school the only reason they need to ban the wearing of the American flag?

If those students were attacked would it be the attacking students who should be arrested (the students committing the violence) or the students wearing the flag (for inciting violence)?

Can you name one other country in the world where wearing the flag of that country would be considered racist or a crime? Again, would wearing the flag on Bolivian independence day constitute hate speech? El Salvadorian independence day? Or is it just Mexicans that are somehow special? Who do Americans need to get permission from to be patriotic?

If you believe being patriotic is now hate speech why won’t you just come out and say it?

Since every country in the world that I know of requires foreign nationals to carry identification are all these countries racist or just the U.S.?

Can you explain why it is fair that a natural born citizen that lives one mile over the boarder from another state must pay out of state fees to go to college in the neighboring state but illegals in that state get a large in-state resident fee reduction?

Mexican laws versus illegals are draconian compared to those in the U.S. (it is a felony to be in the country illegally, it is also a felony to assist illegals, Mexico deports more illegals each year than does the U.S.) why are only Americans compared to Nazis if they want their laws enforced?
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 02:11 am
Quote:
In what news report are you gettin the information that the kids were being confrontational?

That knowledge comes from my knowledge of teens and my knowledge of a American culture.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 02:24 am
the message relayed here was "stick to the script or else face the consequences....freedom is not wanted around here".
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 03:01 am
@TheCorrectResponse,
Quote:
This is why I mentioned Ecuadorians and Nicaraguans. Most of the Hispanics I have known personally are from these two countries and they are generally well disposed to Americans (possibly because their families are here legally) but have a deep abiding HATERED of Mexicans.


This is actually quite funny for anyone who knows anything about Hispanic Americans.

Google NACARA if you want to know way (hint: it is an amnesty bill that applied to Ecuadorians and Nicaraguans who came illegally).


0 Replies
 
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 05:56 am
@TheCorrectResponse,
I have to say that I find this whole thing rather ridiculous. I don't understand the reaction of the school officials at all. I don't really even understand the negative reaction of anyone involved at all. And I do think it smacks of what you said, thecorrectresponse- that maybe it is becoming less and less appropriate to show signs of patriotism at all.

And please understand...I am NOT a particularly patriotic person. I have never owned or flown a flag at my house or even had a flag decal on my car or bought a piece of apparrel that incorporated a flag logo or identified me as American in any way.

I mean, this is like saying that on St. Patrick's day, English people shouldn't be allowed wear their St. George's jerseys or it'll be taken as an insult and negatively confrontational by those of Irish descent-that's just ridiculous.

These students didn't jeer or interrupt the Mexican cultural festivities in any way - they just identified themselves as they identify- and now even THAT'S confrontational and inciteful of violence?!

This political correctness thing is getting out of hand. If I say, 'I'm American' or even wear a shirt or baseball hat or anything else that identifies me as such - that is NOT the same thing as saying, 'I have no respect for Mexicans and their culture.'

And I know teens and I know American culture and I still think this is absolutely ridiculous and actually scary that people would react this way to something like this.

Quote:
“Kids who wear American flag T-shirts on 5 May should have to share a lunchroom table with those who wear a hammer and sickle on 4 July.”

And they probably do - every day - again just because you identify yourself as one thing doesn't mean you hate the other.
0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 06:05 am
as a human being i never feel the need to wear or display a flag anywhere on my person

with one exception of course, i was in Ottawa and visited as many international embassies as i could, including our own house of parliament, and in front of each i shouted the most vile (and country appropriate) racial epithets i could think of, in this case i did wear a US flag t-shirt
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 06:07 am
@djjd62,
Okay - why? Sorry, maybe I'm dense, but I don't get your point.
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 May, 2010 06:27 am
@aidan,
absurdity baby, the only way to live


 

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