It's raining! It's raining!

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

2 to 4 $ (per) thousand gal is above the raw water cost we are used to.(Cubic meter is 262 gal at 60 degrees F) The cost of water is , (on average) about 13$ a thousand gal for a water "Authority" (That includes all costs plus debt service, permits etc etc). The pwr gallon costs for tapping undersea springs actually goes down as the system keeps qworking

Okay. So what do you think a full, apples-to-apples comparison would look like? Specifically---

Since you haven't disputed that 2-4 USD per 1000 gallons is a realistic raw-water cost for desalinated seawater, what would be a typical raw-water cost from the sources normally used in the US? What would it be for tapping undersea springs?
You say that the all-inclusive cost for a water authority is about $13 per 1000 gallons. How would that cost change if, say, New York City switched to desalinated seawater? Or to undersea springs?

I don't doubt that seawater desalination is more expensive than water from the sources we currently use. What I don't see is what MsOlga seems to anticipate, which is a cost increase that would be game-changing. Certainly not in a world that ships bottled water across oceans, because middle-class Americans don't mind paying $1.50 for a one-liter bottle of San Pelegrino or Evian.

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@msolga,

MsOlga wrote:

Worrying times in "the Garden State"

Must be a garden-state thing. (New Jersey calls itself The Garden State, too.)

1 Reply

@Thomas,

Yes?
Perhaps we should become "sister states", Thomas? Smile

We've been the garden state for a while, but that title took a bit of a beating during 10 years of drought. But at least we've learned which are the hardiest plants going, in the process! It made a lot of sense to take a "survival of the fittest" approach to our gardens after a while. If any plants couldn't survive without regular watering, then they were replaced by one which did. A completely different approach to gardening for many of us.

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@msolga,

I hear the message of the article you cite, MsOlga. But I cannot fully follow its reasoning, because the correspondent seems to suffer from a mild case of innumeracy. For example, what sense am I supposed to make of a quote like this one?

Kenneth Davidson, as cited by MsOlga, wrote:

Even if the plant produces nothing, the government will be forced to pay under its contract $570 million a year for 30 years. This is equal to $3.80 a kilolitre without the supply of any water.

Huh? (If you pay $3.80 per kilolitre and there are no kilolitres, you pay nothing. So what's the problem? ) But I do get the general message that is this plant is a secretive backroom deal, smells of corruption, will hog energy, and will contribute mightily to Victoria's air pollution.

1 Reply

@Thomas,

And I am afraid that it is too late in the piece for me to make any sense of anything vaguely resembling statistics, facts n figures, Thomas. Wink

It's past my bedtime & my brain has turned to useless mush, I'm afraid.
But I'm glad the rest of the information makes sense! Smile

Hang on!

I think that means that government (our taxes) will be paying this consortium $570 million a year for 30 years regardless of whether it performs to expectations or not. Those payments are guaranteed in the contract.
As for this part: This is equal to $3.80 a kilolitre without the supply of any water. .... I think I'll need to ponder this very carefully when I'm wide awake! Wink

1 Reply

@msolga,

Hey ho, it just started raining again! Smile

(.. & after a great deal of pondering, Thomas, I have come to the conclusion that both of us may have to remain eternally bewildered by that problematic sentence! Wink

)

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The country verses the city ...
Another aspect of our water story.
Some pretty angry farmers at that meeting in Mildura!:

Quote:

Murray chief looks to cities to save water
October 28, 2010/the AGE:

MELBOURNE'S drain on Murray-Darling waters will be more clearly declared in the draft plan for the river's reform, after a tense meeting in Mildura turned the spotlight on to urban water consumption and projects such as Victoria's North-South Pipe.

Murray-Darling Basin Authority chief executive Rob Freeman told the crowd there were ''enormous opportunities'' for cities to alter their consumption habits to help farmers. He promised to alter the authority's blueprint to better reflect the connection of cities such as Ballarat, Bendigo and Melbourne to the Murray. .....

.... Melbourne's take of 75 billion litres each year through the north-south pipe was a recurring topic at the meeting, with many angry over the basin blueprint's statement that slightly more than 1 million city dwellers, most in Adelaide, relied on the Murray for drinking water. The figure should be closer to 5 million or 6 million to include cities such as Melbourne, Ballarat and Bendigo, they said. ....

... Melbourne began drinking from the Murray in February when the first water came through the pipe to Sugarloaf reservoir. The pipe is now unused because heavy rains have filled Sugarloaf to the brim.

The Brumby government has defended the decision to connect Melbourne to the Murray, saying an equal amount of water has been saved in irrigation upgrades that Melburnians helped pay for....

http://www.theage.com.au/environment/water-issues/murray-chief-looks-to-cities-to-save-water-20101027-173w5.html?autostart=1

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It's been a really weird day here, for spring & November, anyway.
Grey, overcast & oppressively humid. Sticky.
I just checked & at close to 5 pm, the temperature is at 32 C degrees.
But, as the weather bureau tells us, things are about to change:

Quote:

Enjoy the sunshine while it lasts - temperatures are about to plunge again.

The Bureau of Meteorology says this week's rising mercury will do a U-turn on Saturday, bringing torrential rain, thunderstorms and flooding.

The heat will peak on Friday with temperatures forecast to climb into the 30s, but the trend of wet weekends will continue as lines of thunderstorms dump up to 100 millimetres across Victoria, swelling rivers and sparking possible flash floods

http://www.theage.com.au/environment/weather/new-drenching-on-the-way-as-mercury-hits-30s-20101110-17mvi.html

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@msolga,

Cool and humid here. It's been raining...but I don't know that there was a lot of it.

1 Reply

@msolga,

TAUTOLOGY ALERT:

Hot and humid in Cairns

1 Reply

@dlowan,

So not the deluge we're expecting, Deb?

http://images.theage.com.au/2010/11/10/2036010/69936_widenative-408x264.jpg

I just went outside & enjoyed a cup of tea on the back veranda.
It's starting to spit. Just a little
Trying hard to rain.
Very soon the skies will open & we'll cop the lot.

`

1 Reply

@hingehead,

I think we're having the very same day, hinge.
How weird.
So, are you expecting thunderstorms & a deluge tonight, too?

1 Reply

@msolga,

It looks a little ominous but BOM says just a few showers. Even if we got buckets it won't cool down.

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@msolga,

Dunno.

You're MELBOURNE#.

We do things more restrainedly in Adelaide.

No ChopperReid here and all.

Weather & Warnings | Water | Climate | Numerical Prediction | About Services | Learn About Meteorology | Registered User Services |

Time Wind Temp Tdiff Dewp RH Pres T Rain
00:00 064/11 25.2 9 11.7 44 1002.7 F 0.0
01:00 039/20 29.6 14 6.4 25 1001.4 F 0.0
02:00 021/14 29.3 14 6.5 25 1001.2 F 0.0
03:00 012/16 29.5 14 6.6 25 1001.3 F 0.0
04:00 023/14 29.7 15 6.3 24 1000.7 F 0.0
05:00 012/09 28.3 14 8.2 30 1001.2 F 0.0
06:00 325/11 27.5 13 8.5 32 1002.0 R 0.0
07:00 280/12 26.4 12 10.6 39 1003.0 R 0.0
08:00 241/12 25.1 9 12.9 48 1004.0 R 0.0
09:00 285/16 22.1 4 14.7 64 1006.8 R 0.0
10:00 359/07 19.3 0 17.0 87 1006.6 R 1.4
11:00 023/11 20.2 0 17.1 83 1004.8 F 2.0
12:00 324/18 20.5 -1 17.1 82 1006.4 R 2.0
13:00 279/22 19.2 -2 15.5 80 1007.3 R 2.2
14:00 240/12 18.3 -4 15.2 83 1008.0 R 2.2
15:00 223/11 18.3 -4 14.1 77 1008.2 R 2.2
16:00 228/09 18.7 -4 13.4 72 1008.4 R 2.2
17:00 214/12 17.9 -4 14.1 79 1008.0 F 2.2
18:00 221/12 17.8 -4 13.6 77 1008.6 R 2.2

1 Reply

THUNDERSTORM WARNING Issued at 8:57 pm Friday, 12 November 2010. Severe thunderstorms are no longer occurring in Victoria. The immediate threat of severe thunderstorms has passed, but the situation will continue to be monitored and further warnings will be issued if necessary.

General Conditions - Dry, Light Breeze North at 10:13 PM 12/11/10
Current Temp. 24.2°C
Max Temp Today 29.1°C at 3:13 PM
Min Temp Today 17.6°C at 3:58 AM
Windchill/Heat Index 25 C
Wind Speed 7.5 km/h (4.0 Knts) from N
Max Average Today 61.8 km/h (33.4Knts) at 4:17 PM from N
Gust Speed 5.3 km/h (2.9 Knts) from N
Max Gust Today 63.7 km/h (34.4Knts) at 4:18 PM from N
Rain 24 Hours 1.9 mm

http://www.mansfieldweather.com.au/

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@dlowan,

Quote:

You're MELBOURNE#.

We do things more restrainedly in Adelaide.

No ChopperReid here and all.

Ha.
Genteel weather in Adelaide! The city of Churches! Wink

Early Saturday morning & it's raining solidly. (Good, good!)
Looks like we'll be getting pretty much what you received yesterday (Friday), Deb.
A drastic drop in temperature (from a top of 32 C degrees yesterday to 19 C today.)
Dapad's late forecast was right. The predicted crazy thunderstorms didn't happen.

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Raining, raining, raining, raining ...
Relentlessly & oh so gently & peacefully ...
All day long.

Nothing going on out there.
Everyone is inside.
But the birds!
You should hear them!
Warbling away to their hearts' content.

Things are getting extremely soggy here.
My backyard bottle brush bushes have almost doubled over, with the weight.
My mandarin bush is suffering a similar fate
Oh well! ... Smile

Melbourne's Water Storages are at:

Quote:

51.1% full at 13-Nov-2010

http://www.melbournewater.com.au/content/water_storages/water_report/water_report.asp?bhcp=1

Woo hoo! Very Happy

`

2 Replies

@msolga,

As we used say in Canberra Uni ressies : 50 is a pass, 51 is a waste of time.

1 Reply

@hingehead,

But what about that extra bit of progress, hinge?
Is there nothing to be said for that? Wink

Jeez, it's taken us so damn long, months & months of good rainfall to reach this point ...
Clearly our water storage facilities are in the wrong places .. or need to be moved around, or something ... ? Confused

If we ever reach 60% full, I will faint with the sheer excitement! Razz

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@msolga,

Lovely rain...rained here too but I don't know how much.

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It's raining! It's raining!

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