Sign here, you know you can trust us.

I've never stated that they MUST be in the military

that what you are entitled to is having your ego involved.

Play down your experience ?

Why would I need to provide a solution for women being in the military, when I believe they should not be denied access? All the problems they seem to cause in your so called "examples" are of men not doing their job, and you blaming the women for being in their proximity. You are trying to take one person's actions and make someone else accountable for them.
In your example, if the male soldier does not do his job, the women should be kicked out. This argument was doomed from the start.

are of men not doing their job

Show me one instance where I ignored your angle. Show me where quoting you distorted what you said.

You described a theoretical situation where a woman's presence is given the blame for what actions the men in the group take or do not take. That is the men's problem, not hers, and it's not her's to resolve for them.

You example is no different than a situation in a corporate environment. Should we not let women in other workplaces too? I work with plenty of men and women and they keep it professional, do you want to say that the military is less professional?

Would you reread what you wrote and look at the bias : ... the women only have a presence; the men have actions; pitiful women arent responsible like adults for who they have sex with. If women behave in a non-professional manner that causes conflict within the group, of course women are responsible. One woman having sex with half the unit causes conflict.

If you cant see the difference between the military and a corporate environment then I dont know what to say that would help you see the difference.

Private verses pubic concern. Midwives are private citizens offering a service. Soldiers are government employees.

What happened to the military and corporate environment being the same...have you changed your mind?

If a man was harassing a female radio specialist, I guess she invited the harassment, and the military's real concern should be with the fact that she was there to tempt the man that harasses her?

You have fabricated this bullshit and you know it.

I never stated the corporate environment was the same

yes you did, you said...

Deist TKO wrote:

You example is no different than a situation in a corporate environment.

I only was addressing the difference, and I never stated the corporate environment was the same, only that your argument make no distinction.

You have repeated your mantra, "women must be in the military because they must be" without stopping to ask am I right. You have been brainwashed in political correctness.

Quote:

I've never stated that they MUST be in the military

Allrighty. Women MUST be allowed in the military. Happy ?

Quote:

that what you are entitled to is having your ego involved.

Only in comparison with you. You are not entitled, I am. Whether I choose to do so is up to me.

Quote:

Play down your experience ?

Dont be so shocked. You arent fooling anyone.

Quote:

Why would I need to provide a solution for women being in the military, when I believe they should not be denied access? All the problems they seem to cause in your so called "examples" are of men not doing their job, and you blaming the women for being in their proximity. You are trying to take one person's actions and make someone else accountable for them.
In your example, if the male soldier does not do his job, the women should be kicked out. This argument was doomed from the start.

If they were not there, the damage would not be done. If both are at fault, what is the solution ? To throw out 10 men or one woman ? I am perfectly happy to have a defence force full of women. The men can stay home.

Quote:

are of men not doing their job

You understand nothing of combat. We are aiming for a positive, where men will fight and die for each other, and you see it as a "job". 'That man there, you didnt fight to the death because of the influence women have on morale..you will be thrown out of the army'.

Can you stretch past your PC bias to see the meaning of what you are writing ? Are you so self absorbed in being PC that you can not see you will cause deaths of men who have wives and mothers ? What about their rights ?

Are they to be trampled so a lot of tarts can run bare foot through all the boys?

But dont let me pull your head out of the sand. There isnt a problem, is there ?

You example is no different than a situation in a corporate environment. Should we not let women in other workplaces too? I work with plenty of men and women and they keep it professional, do you want to say that the military is less professional?

...of which you only replied to the red part with ..

You example is no different than a situation in a corporate environment.

I don't see a unique problem in having women soldiers.

....but you cut my sentence apart...

the women only have a presence; the men have actions

But it was YOUR example, not mine. Your example lacked any sort of means of distinction. What about a female doctor in a ER? In your wild imagination is she ******* half of the staff too? I guess people should be careful about going to that hospital because her patients might not get helped as much by another doctor she isn't *******. She should have fucked them all or none at all right? It's your example that was flawed, my parallel to the corporate environment was only illustrate that your logic didn't hold.

The point here is that public institutions don't have as many protections that public institutions have. In my corporate example, I was pointing out that your logic was not restrained in any way to the military, and in your midwife example, I replied to how the private business has the ability to make that distinction whereas the public does not.

Deist TKO wrote:
If a man was harassing a female radio specialist, I guess she invited the harassment, and the military's real concern should be with the fact that she was there to tempt the man that harasses her?
You didn't like it... but guess what, it is your example. It's a man not doing his job, and the women gets the blame. If you don't like the application of your broken logic, it isn't for me to resolve.

continuing to misrepresent me

Which didn't make any sense because I was demonstrating how public and private were different.

It's a man not doing his job, and the women gets the blame.

You (public) example is no different than a situation in a (private)corporate environment.

Which didn't make any sense because I was demonstrating how public and private were different.

3) I have not employed a argument from political correctness.

1) Many women have skills the military wants.

2) Your example is of men not doing their job, not women.

3) Military jobs are government/public jobs, and they don't have the legal discretion to deny access like private institutions do.

This is some ridiculous nonsense. AND Dude. Let's get this **** crystal: You aren't entitled to anything. you are just another person. AND Get over yourself. You are just another person here. The value of your input will be on the intellectual value of your comments, not your superiority complex. AND Another civy meme and a self serving and ridiculous non-quote. Hilarious.

You tried to play down my experience. Somehow you got your ego involved. I am the one entitled to have their ego involved, I put up with this rubbish that you say must not exist because it is politically incorrect.
Well it does exist.

The main problem, I see is that you want to address things that are already addressed.
Sexual misconduct already has procedures.
Failure to do one's job already has procedures.

In your example, if the male soldier does not do his job, the women should be kicked out. This argument was doomed from the start.

Does anyone remember the "Love Boat" from the first Gulf War where women got pregnant to avoid duty ?

Women have destroyed any semblance of professionalism in the military. I dont know about the US, but here they get their choice of posting so they can be with their family if they get pregnant. They dont have to go on exercise or do guard duty/picket duty because they have to go home and take care of the child. This puts more stress on the male members and their families. They serve less time than the males and they cost far more in support, like medical.
I had one female who was having sex with my CO. Is she a bad soldier and do I write her a bad report and suffer on my report ? Is she a good soldier and do I write her a good report and earn the CO's favour ? How do I distinguish between the two having been compromised ? What if the CO had put pressure on her to have sex ? What if he didnt pressure her but later when it falls over she tells his wife and Brigade Commander that he did ?
If we were short men I could understand it but we are not that desperate. If they have "after sex guilt" it is common for them to claim they were raped, especially if it gets them back home.
And now the situation will be even more complex with gays.
An all male hunter group has been destroyed so some women can run bare foot through the boys. Lots of fun if you like men.

There has been a dramatic rise in the number of female drivers to staff officers. On a totally different track, are you aware Ike was screwing his female driver ? Chosen specifically for him. It is not a military, it is a dating service.

I had one female soldier who was having it off with two male soldiers at once every night on exercise. Someone told her husband who thinking I was invincible, said I was the one who told him. She set about taking me up on fraud charges on a seperate matter which didnt work of course as I wasnt guilty. Eventually it all settled down and she returned to her husband and two preschool children.

Want more true stories, each more unbelievable than the last ?

Doctors are not allowed to sleep with patients, that sort of thing. The military have a long way to go. In the civy world, if someone is guilty they can be brought up on charges and drummed out. In the military world, throwing someone out of the military may be exactly what they want. What if a woman gets pregnant to avoid combat ? Is that a self inflicted wound ? What happens to the child ? Does the father have to pay child support if she was using him to commit a crime ? Should we conscript women or are they just playing soldier to get at the men - they dont want to go to war. Any women reading this, how do you feel aboput being conscripted and does it give you the right to stay home because you have a baby, like at the start of the thread ? What about men who have young kids ?

One of my soldiers was about to get married, it was a very happy occasion. He recieved a letter saying for the next 17 years he was to pay one third of his wages in child support and maintenance. Two years back, a woman made a very determined effort to get him into bed. She wanted to get pregnant so she wouldnt have to work everyday and he was fit, strong and reasonably good looking. Initially she refused to tell the government who the father was (she didnt really know much anyway) but was forced to or her support payments would be stopped. He was eventually tracked down. What happened to his body, his choice ?

The only thing I have seen women contribute that a man couldnt, is sex. And now with the new policy on gays, men can do that too. Sex is very disruptive and can destroy morale. Female soldier : "I wil have sex with you, you and of course you, sir, but not you or you". When the bullets start flying we will see what this has done to group cohesion.

Why dont we have entire female units ? Because they dont want the job, they want to run barefoot through all the boys, tee-hee ! What sex mad young woman wouldnt want her choice of fit, healthy young men ? About 10:1 is rather good odds. They are known as ground sheets because they are there to lie on.

Sexual misconduct already has procedures.
Failure to do one's job already has procedures.