9
   

Maybe the job market really is bad

 
 
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 12:10 pm
I just posted a job listing on craigslist for our family business. It's a minimum wage cashier job -- not difficult, probably nobody's career choice. I've gotten 10 responses in 5 minutes and they all have college degrees. Holy ****, people went to college for 4 years and are now "very interested" in a minimum wage cashier position? I feel awful, and I don't even know how to begin sorting through these applicants who are all over-qualified.
 
sozobe
 
  2  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 12:17 pm
@FreeDuck,
Eep. That's scary.

I guess just choose the ones (~5?) you think would be best for the job, then set up interviews... maybe give it a bit more time before starting to respond.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  0  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 12:19 pm
@FreeDuck,
FreeDuck wrote:

I just posted a job listing on craigslist for our family business. It's a minimum wage cashier job -- not difficult, probably nobody's career choice. I've gotten 10 responses in 5 minutes and they all have college degrees. Holy ****, people went to college for 4 years and are now "very interested" in a minimum wage cashier position? I feel awful, and I don't even know how to begin sorting through these applicants who are all over-qualified.


How long do you hope that a person will keep your cashier job?
How much effort do you expect to expend training them?
How reliable do you need them to be?

If you don't want turnover every few weeks, or every month or 2, hold out for the person who actually wants a job like this. They are out there, you just have to wait until they come forth.

Do you know any retirees that just want to fill some time, and make a little extra cash?
I would think they would be the most dependable, and would enjoy the interaction, and the work.

Personally, I wouldn't call any of these people. I'd just be patient, and advertise in other venues as well.
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 12:30 pm
@FreeDuck,
realize that anyone who can get a better job, will be gone as soon as said job becomes available

FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 12:34 pm
I'm definitely going to wait to respond. I figured I can use the long weekend to filter through and think up good questions to ask -- like "why the hell would you want this job?"

Basically, they just need to be reliable. If they stay for a year or so, that would be great. We realize not many people will want to work a minimum wage job for a long period of time, so we're thinking college students, retirees, prison work-release (kidding.. well, now that I think of it), that sort of person. We just want them to be nice and show up for work on time. It would only take about a day to train them, but we don't want lots of turnover because it gives a sense of instability to our customers. We're a young business (1 year) and can't afford to look like we won't make it as that can become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
kuvasz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:12 pm
@FreeDuck,
Quite seriously, did you think that the media was making up the recession? People are hurting all over the country and simply want to work.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:15 pm
@djjd62,
The reality is that there aren't a lot of those 'better' jobs available in some regions. This is how it's going to be for a while, maybe a long while in some areas.
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:17 pm
FreeDuck, do you feel a sense of social responsibility in your job selection, or are you solely after the best candidate?

The reason I ask is that for both of the above cases, I am by far your best bet...when do I start?
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  4  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:19 pm
@ehBeth,
Yes, that was my thought too. I know many people who have jobs that are not at all what they expected to get -- but they're jobs, and they're holding on to them.

I've also seen people be rejected because they're overqualified, when I know they'd be really good for the job. From an employer perspective, I get that you don't want to invest time and money in someone who could get a better job and likely will, soon. But that does seem to not be the current state of things in most fields/ geographical areas, and from an employee perspective, having no job at all is worse than having a less-than-optimal job.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  0  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:23 pm
@FreeDuck,
Retirees are best bet I think.

They get the responsibility thing, even if they quit, they would not just no show.
College students...their class schedule changes, summer and holiday vacations.

Is there a community center, bridge club, something like that you can visit and perhaps put up fliers?

Personally, I cannot fathom ever not working, at least part time, unless my physical condition prevented it.

If my basic needs were covered, a little cash would just be the little perks in life, like dinner out, extra expenses that come up.

Would you be able to provide accomodations for someone who is going to be dependable, and maybe a retiree? I'm thinking of a padded stool with a back so they wouldn't have to stand all shift, maybe provide them with a free lunch?

I'd come to work for you if you fed me. Very Happy

maybe a husband/wife, girlfriend/boyfriend gf/gf, bf/bf job share thing?
sozobe
 
  4  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 02:54 pm
An aside, kind of prompted by Kuvasz's comment but not really a reply to it:

I think FreeDuck was being ironic with her title and fully gets that the job market is bad. However, I also think there are different levels to that -- an intellectual level, where we read stuff and know it's bad, and then a more immediate/ personal level where it really hits you upside the head. For me, it was four different families I'm very close to -- my daughter's best best friend's family, my best friend's family, and then two more -- going through the loss of the father's job. All but one are stay-at-home mom families, where the father is the sole breadwinner, and the loss of the job is really cataclysmic. The first lost his job in early spring, the most recent was a few weeks ago. None of them have found new jobs yet. All of them are talking about selling houses, moving -- it's really bad, and I can't do anything about it. (I help with resumes, but I can't get them jobs.)

So even though my own husband's job is, hopefully, secure (knock on wood), this is very directly impacting me in terms of the people I'm closest to.
0 Replies
 
sullyfish6
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 04:29 pm
Do you offer benefits?

THAT's what most people are scared about nowadays.

0 Replies
 
Reyn
 
  2  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 04:32 pm
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:
Do you know any retirees that just want to fill some time, and make a little extra cash?

I would think they would be the most dependable, and would enjoy the interaction, and the work.

Yes, I'd be interested, but the commute would kill me!

I would like to see employers look more at hiring older folks like myself (58, a young retiree).

Speaking for myself, I'm punctual, reliable, available all hours, and when I show up for work, I work hard and earn my money!

So, how about it employers? I've sent a few resumes out recently, but rarely get calls for interviews. the kinds of jobs I'm applying for, probably most people wouldn't apply for, but still I'm not employed. Mad
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 04:36 pm
@Reyn,
You forever hear how employers are looking for older workers for all the reasons given, but. . . .
Reyn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 04:38 pm
@roger,
Exactly, the big but...! Mad

It cheeses me off, because I had a job paying $9 per hour, which I left last April.

I left that job, because I was getting fewer and fewer hours, due to the fact that sales were down at the dollar store where I worked. I left for that job for a full time job. Two days later, I get a phone call less than an hour that I was to show up for training saying, "Oh, by the way, we don't need you to show up any more. We've over-hired (a pack of lies)."

I tell them, look, I just left a job to take your job, you hired me, and now you're letting me go? Shocked

"Yup, that's the way it is."

In the meantime, now I'm with no job, since.

I'm in the fortunate bunch though, as I do have a private pension, but nonetheless, I really could use the extra money.
Reyn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 04:49 pm
@Reyn,
......continues.....>

I have to say, I'm very angry, as many employers just won't give me a chance. For pete's sake, I'm only 58, and to look at me, I look late 40s, maybe 50! I'm not dead yet!

As time goes on, I'm getting more desperate, looking at jobs that aren't as suitable.

There's a Denny's opening up, probably later on this year, that I'll probably apply for. Hopefully, they'll have me.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 05:44 pm
damn, that would piss me off too Reyn!

I would have asked them didn't they check their budgets, didn't they approval to hire someone?

Can you get unemployment over that?

I mean, you left one job, and immediately went to another, where you were laid off.

moving on....

ok, what I'm going to say here isn't going to be popular, but it's the truth, so help me God.

It's all well and good to discuss how people are overqualified for jobs, they can tell you how they really need the work, discuss the fairness of reviewing resumes and giving everyone their fair time at an interview, but let me give you some straight from my spreadsheet facts, as well as conversations I have daily with job seekers.

The fact of the matter is, of all the profiles I receive from our recruiting department, we end up hiring approxmately 12% of all unlicensed candidates sent to me.
For licensed people, it's a bit better, hovering around 20%

That's not all. The recruiters glean out about 5 out of 10 applicants without even calling them. Primary reason is job history. It's not at all uncommon to have people who work 5, 6, 7 months on one job, move to another, and another, and yet another. So....what will keep them from leaving us in 5 to 7 months?

Anyway, of all the people they have called, then actually pass on to me (they don't pass everyone to me of course), I only call 50% of them. Why?
They live 50 miles from the job.
They have resumes with glaring errors. How can we trust you to take care of a patient (or make proper change on a cash register) if u r bad @ speling??
Looking at their job history, I can piece together a story, one that says "you left one job for another just for more money" That may seem like a no brainer to do so for some people, but, if you ask people, ask yourself, what is the most satisfying thing about their job, they don't say money. Plus, contrary to what headhunters say, for the vast majority of people, we're not getting those calls trying to recruit us to another company,offering more money, perks, etc. For us average joe's, we have to be beating the bushes to discover that xyz company down the street is paying 50 cents more an hour, and make the effort to get that new job. You might be surprised how many people who went over to xyz company try to get hired back on at where I work, after they discover the grass wasn't greener. Unfortunately, they're out of luck. You leave for money, don't bother even trying to come back for a year. In fact, you might not want to try to come back at all, because if you left for money, you probably were hinky in other ways too.

A really bad reason to hire someone is because they were so nice. Some of the worst employees I've seen over the last 10 years were one's that were really nice people, but just could never completely get it together. However, because of their great personalities, they manage to get by.

When I'm screening someone, I try not to engage them as far as their personality, until they get by some of my first questions, such as why they left other jobs, why are they leaving this one, finding out what they current employer could do to keep them....again...saying, "if they paid me more" is a bad sign.

After a while, when I can ascertain they are on the level, have integrity, and intelligence, I can afford some time, expecially if they are impressive, to relax them, engage them in some conversation, etc.
I've had my moments when I've wanted to have someone come in for a group interview because they seemed to have had some hard knocks, they are just so nice, they really really really need this job. I've had to make some excuse to put the person on hold, or say I've got another call, can I call you right back, to get my head straight.
I've called other co-workers, one's whose opinion I respect, and said, "let me tell you about this person, and tell me what you think" In retelling, I ususally hear what I'm saying, I mean really hear myself and we both agree it's not a good idea.

The lower level the job, the harder it is to not fall for this. Freeduck, I don't know your style, but if you find yourself just liking the person, and have no other reason, start digging as to their attendance, commitment, etc, have them give you examples of when they went that extra mile for the good of the team. Ask yourself, if you hired them, how you would deal with the fact they are late, or absent or inefficient, but you keep them on because they are so nice.

It would be nice to think everyone should have a job, be given another chance. When it's your budget that the money's coming out of, wait for the best. I'd rather work double shifts for a month then get stuck with someone who in the end causes aggrievation, comes to work with their personal problems, and always has a reason for everything that happens.

You need reyn.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 06:41 pm
@kuvasz,
kuvasz wrote:

Quite seriously, did you think that the media was making up the recession? People are hurting all over the country and simply want to work.

If you told me it was raining, I'd believe you. If I went outside and got drenched, I'd say "holy ****, it's raining". It's not quite real until you see 100 (100! and still coming in) responses to what was honestly advertised as a minimum wage dead end job.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 06:44 pm
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:

I'd come to work for you if you fed me. Very Happy

That's one of the perks, dontcha know! We can't pay above minimum wage but we'll feed you and customers leave tips. That's are selling point right there.
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Sep, 2009 06:46 pm
@roger,
roger wrote:

You forever hear how employers are looking for older workers for all the reasons given, but. . . .

Two retirees so far have made the short list. A few others are culinary students -- we might just end up hiring two people if we find the right ones.
 

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