AHMADINEJAHD WINS AGAIN!!!!

And Waterboy once again displays the highest level to which his rhetorical skills can be expected to attain.

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@Setanta,

Setantass, would you like me to translate my response for you?

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@George,

George wrote:

Are these the brown shirts Obama wants to see in this country?

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@H2O MAN,

Waterboy is such an immense intellect. The only arguments in his quiver appear to spelling edits and brain dead insults.

His GED is showing.

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@farmerman,

farmergirl is quick to launch personal attacks this morning.
A classic sign of immaturity and lower than average intellect.

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@Brandon9000,

Quote:

since I simply don't know enough about him to decide, but, generally, there are some national rulers to whom extending a hand of friendship is not the right tactic, because they are the sorts of people who will continue to do bad things no matter how we approach them.

So far youre the only one who has used the term "extend a hand of friendship".
Any dialogue has to at least begin with some point of commonality. Ive implied no "extending a hand of friendship" either stated or implied. National self interest and regional status quo should be the only guides for our dealings in this matter. Several of the GOP want more severe language in dealing with Ahme. They havent thought it out very thoroughly.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Remember a president isnt elected by those who vote, a president is elected by those who count the votes

The country's highest electoral authority, the Guardian Council, acknowledged voting irregularities in 50 electoral districts in
the June 12 vote, the most serious official admission so far of problems in the election that the opposition has labeled a fraud.

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Right now the opposition is being seen as heroic underdogs, but everything the US says can and will be used as ammunition against the opposition in Iran. As much as those in Iran do not like their leaders, I imagine they would like the interference of the US, who is seen as the big Satan even by moderates, even less. If Obama had been on TV giving one those Bush's speeches, right away the story would change from being about the Iranian election into being about the US and the Iranian election.

But for those who think Obama should say more than express disapproval for the actions of the Iranian leaders actions in this matter, what else should he say or do to satisfy you sense of rightness for the situation? Also, in what way is Obama responsible for the occurrence of the election in Iran and its results regardless of his Iranian policies? Make the connection from Obama's words and policies to the result being the circumstances in Iran right now.

Also in what way would Mousavi be different in regards to Iranian stance on nuclear weapons and Israel which i assume is the rejection of Ahmadinejad to start with.

(onejerusalem.com)

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but there are actually some Obama supporters who are claiming that his extending his hand to Iran has been a success so far.

I don't feel that it has been a success or a failure. It's hard to call the chess game after the first move. What is happening in Iran is due in its entirety to the Iranian people and the choices they are making. To claim Obama is responsible would be silly. To claim his policies have failed is equally silly. I think this current posture is fine. There is nothing positive the US can do in this situation and several things we can do that are negative. The Iranian people know the people of the US and Europe support them. No jaw-boning by Obama will change that.

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@Brandon9000,

Brandon9000 wrote:

I'm not talking about Ahmedinejad in particular, since I simply don't know enough about him to decide, but, generally, there are some national rulers to whom extending a hand of friendship is not the right tactic, because they are the sorts of people who will continue to do bad things no matter how we approach them.

I think there is a general misconception opening a dialog is the same as endorsing a particular administration. I don't have any problem with having talks with Iran or Cuba, if fact I think they are essential. Those talks might consist of our reps and their reps yelling at each other for a couple of hours or it might be meaningful, but the concept that the best diplomacy is silence just seems silly. How do you know if sanctions and political pressure are working unless you have a regular dialog?

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@revel,

Earlier I meant to leave a link to this article and I messed up.

Quote:

What all this means for Israel is that no great surprises were in store, no matter who would win, and that the anti-Israel rhetoric will continue, as well as the nuclear program, which went into high gear when Ahmadinejad was elected in 2005. Mousavi is even said to have begun the nuclear program back in the 1980’s.

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@engineer,

engineer wrote:

Brandon9000 wrote:

I'm not talking about Ahmedinejad in particular, since I simply don't know enough about him to decide, but, generally, there are some national rulers to whom extending a hand of friendship is not the right tactic, because they are the sorts of people who will continue to do bad things no matter how we approach them.

I think there is a general misconception opening a dialog is the same as endorsing a particular administration. I don't have any problem with having talks with Iran or Cuba, if fact I think they are essential. Those talks might consist of our reps and their reps yelling at each other for a couple of hours or it might be meaningful, but the concept that the best diplomacy is silence just seems silly. How do you know if sanctions and political pressure are working unless you have a regular dialog?

I'll add to that that if you don't have an open dialogue then you have no leverage. We can't, for instance, pressure the Iranian government about how they treat their protesters because we're no-one to them right now. All the bluster of the last 8 years has left us with nowhere to maneuver.

I think the people who are making this all about Obama's reaction are suffering from delusions of national grandeur. We are not all-powerful. Our every step does not create wakes in the universe. We have no power over the situation in Iran. The Iranian people are doing this because they're bad-ass and they've had enough. I fully support them and sincerely hope for their success and I'm quite sure that Obama does as well. But I'm also quite sure that he understands, from his unique vantage point, how little power we actually have anymore.

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@okie,

okie wrote:

farmerman wrote:
I see that Obama is handling Ahmedinejad much better than Bush. Obama doesnt let Ahmedinejad contol the dialogue by responding to his crap with similar crap. Obama seems to havce changed the rules in engagement. This seemed to be frustrating to Ahmedinejad in the run up to the election. even Ahme-started to talk about opening engagement with the US.

Is that why Obama's poll numbers are dropping?

Speaking of polls, a plurality of Americans believe that he is handling this about right.

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Free Duck may find that not everyone agrees with him/her?

The last paragraph of today's Wall Street Journal editorial reads:

"Focused as he is on domestic matters, Mr. Obama no doubt wishes he could return to his campaign illusions about the powers of diplomacy. But the world's rogues have other priorities and stopping them will take more than an extended handshake."

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Okie- I don't think FreeDuck has noticed Rasmussen Reports for TODAY.

Note:

Daily Presidential Tracking Poll
Monday, June 22, 2009
The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Monday shows that 33% of the nation's voters now Strongly Approve of the way that Barack Obama is performing his role as President. Thirty-four percent (34%) Strongly Disapprove giving Obama a Presidential Approval Index rating of -1. Today is the second straight day the President’s rating has been below zero (see trends).

The Presidential Approval Index is calculated by subtracting the number who Strongly Disapprove from the number who Strongly Approve. It is updated daily at 9:30 a.m. Eastern (sign up for free daily e-mail update). Updates also available on Twitter.

Most voters still place the blame for our nation’s economic woes on the Bush Administration, but a growing number say it’s Obama’s economy now. The number blaming Bush has fallen to 54%. That’s down eight points from a month.
***************************************************************

And the Stock Market continues to plummet. Down 200 points today.

Only the demented can blame that on Bush!!! After all, the Messiah has been President for more than five full months.

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Question: The Ruling Council admitted there were some "irregularities" today..but they would not have affected the outcome.
Damage control for a rigged election?
Or an honest mea culpa?

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@panzade,

Are you joking? It is not even damage control for a rigged election. It is a slap in the face to all civilized countries of the world. Khamenai and his goons are the kind of people who cut off the head of Mr. Pearl and exhibited it to the world on TV.

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@panzade,

panzade wrote:

Question: The Ruling Council admitted there were some "irregularities" today..but they would not have affected the outcome.
Damage control for a rigged election?
Or an honest mea culpa?

My take: an offering. They realize that the official outcome is nearly impossible without tampering/cheating so they're trying to acknowledge the incredible results while holding on to the actual outcome. It won't work. The fact that they're backing away from the big lie tells me that they're losing ground and they know it.

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I, would opine that Ahmedinejad has won pretty much nothing. Iran is an economic disaster, has a better than typical professional/educated population and is not a happy camper. I believe the theocracy has run its course and the only future is entropic chaos.

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@genoves,

I think free ducks is aware of the Obama's approval poll number slipping, after all it has been discussed for days on these threads. But what does that have to do with polls which show more Americans think Obama is handling this situation in Iran right?

You forgot the end paragraph from your link.

Quote:

Overall, 54% of voters say they at least somewhat approve of the President's performance so far. Forty-five percent (45%) disapprove.

Admittedly not good numbers, but his approval rating is not down to 33%, just the strongly approve rating. The world is in a bad shape and it is not going to be fixed instantly, nor did Obama ever claim any such thing nor had any of his credible supporters.

Although I hope you guys keep up the rants, it only starts making you guys look even worse than Obama's polls numbers.

Quote:

Lost in the news yesterday about the polls showing eroding support for Obama’s policies was a funny detail in the NBC/Wall Street Journal poll: The overall popularity of the Republican Party has now dropped below even the abysmal level of approval enjoyed by Dick Cheney.

The poll found that 26% of respondents have a very positive or somewhat positive view of Cheney, up eight points from April. Meanwhile, it found that the GOP overall is viewed very or somewhat positively by only 25%, down four points from April.

source

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AHMADINEJAHD WINS AGAIN!!!!

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