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Fallacies- Can you help me locate fallacies in this text?

 
 
Reply Mon 4 May, 2009 05:29 pm
In 1810, Hahnemann published his Organon, and initiated the practice of homeopathic
medicine. In this book, Hahnemann delineated the ‘principle of similitude’
that underlies homeopathic practice. This principle briefly stated is that
‘like cures like’: if large amounts of a medicine induce certain deleterious symptoms,
then small amounts of that medicine are effective in combating a disease
with those symptoms. If this principle is correct, it unlocks the way to simple,
natural cures of many ailments. The medical world should be very excited about
this ability. So why won’t medical science properly assess homeopathic remedies?
Since Hahnemann’s time, homeopathy has flourished around the world, and
now has thousands of followers. The British royal family has long retained a
homeopathic doctor. With its long and distinguished pedigree, homeopathy deserves
to be taken seriously. And make no mistake, homeopathy works. Some months ago, my son Gerard was laid low with a bout of food poisoning " he
was distressed and in pain for two days. If our principles are right, then he
should be able to take some carefully prepared homeopathic medicine and recover
quickly and painlessly. And that’s exactly what happened " when he was
finally persuaded to try a homeopathic remedy, he was better in 24 hours. My
opponent here this evening will try to tell you that our methods aren’t tested, and
don’t work. Yet each case like Gerard’s gives proof much stronger than any lab
test " real cures for real people.
There is a sorry history of medicine refusing to acknowledge alternative medical
practices. Look at acupuncture. After being dismissed by Western medicine
for years, it is now increasingly accepted for pain relief and other uses. Yet
homeopathy is not accorded the same respect. Remember Hippocrates’ advice
to the doctor: ‘First, do no harm’. Homeopathic remedies are natural substances
in dilute form. Contrast this with conventional medicine’s cabinet full of
dangerous and toxic drugs. Who here is honouring Hippocrates advice?
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Type: Question • Score: 3 • Views: 1,388 • Replies: 16
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 May, 2009 05:32 pm
@stevie051,
The kid might have been better in 24 hours if you had sung him a song.
solipsister
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 May, 2009 07:57 pm
@spendius,
do no harm with the homeopathic hair of the dog
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 May, 2009 11:59 pm
@stevie051,
1. Homoeopathy does not administer "medicines" in the normal sense of that word, it administers dilute quantitities of substances which produce similar symptoms to the disease.

2. The patient who had food poisoning would probably have recovered naturally by the third day.

3. Acupunture has nothing to do homeopathy.

fresco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 12:58 am
@fresco,
4. (Earlier) "Appeal to authority/celebrity" - the British Royal Family - is a logical fallacy.

5. Since homeopathy could be "doing nothing" and preventing proven cures, it is in breach of the Hippocratic Oath.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 01:14 am
There's no physiological reason that the principle should hold true. It's metaphysics, not science.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 06:28 am
@MontereyJack,
Thats not quite true. The principle of vaccination is to give a mild form of the disease so that antibodies are produced which combat the full disease.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 06:36 am
Not the same thing at all. "A substance that produces the same SYMPTOMS" is by no means the same as a reduced/weakened form of the DISEASE that produces the same antibodies.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 06:53 am
@stevie051,
stevie051 wrote:

In 1810, Hahnemann published his Organon, and initiated the practice of homeopathic medicine. In this book, Hahnemann delineated the ‘principle of similitude’ that underlies homeopathic practice. This principle briefly stated is that ‘like cures like’: if large amounts of a medicine induce certain deleterious symptoms, then small amounts of that medicine are effective in combating a disease with those symptoms.

If this principle is correct, it unlocks the way to simple, natural cures of many ailments. The medical world should be very excited about
this ability.

This is begging the question: it assumes that the point being argued (homeopathy works) is true.

stevie051 wrote:
So why won’t medical science properly assess homeopathic remedies?

He hasn't shown that it won't.

stevie051 wrote:
Since Hahnemann’s time, homeopathy has flourished around the world, and now has thousands of followers. The British royal family has long retained a homeopathic doctor. With its long and distinguished pedigree, homeopathy deserves to be taken seriously.

Popularity does not demonstrate effectiveness. (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-common-practice.html http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-popularity.html)

stevie051 wrote:
And make no mistake, homeopathy works. Some months ago, my son Gerard was laid low with a bout of food poisoning " he
was distressed and in pain for two days. If our principles are right, then he
should be able to take some carefully prepared homeopathic medicine and recover quickly and painlessly. And that’s exactly what happened " when he was finally persuaded to try a homeopathic remedy, he was better in 24 hours.

Anecdotal evidence is not reliable. (This is an example of cum hoc, ergo propter hoc. http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/hasty-generalization.html )

stevie051 wrote:
My opponent here this evening will try to tell you that our methods aren’t tested, and don’t work. Yet each case like Gerard’s gives proof much stronger than any lab test " real cures for real people.

There is a sorry history of medicine refusing to acknowledge alternative medical practices.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/guilt-by-association.html

stevie051 wrote:
Look at acupuncture. After being dismissed by Western medicine for years, it is now increasingly accepted for pain relief and other uses.

Red herring.

stevie051 wrote:
Yet homeopathy is not accorded the same respect.

Begging the question. (Makes the assumption that homeopathy works.)

stevie051 wrote:
Remember Hippocrates’ advice to the doctor: ‘First, do no harm’. Homeopathic remedies are natural substances in dilute form. Contrast this with conventional medicine’s cabinet full of dangerous and toxic drugs. Who here is honouring Hippocrates advice?

Red herring/strawman.
1. Who cares?
2. Drugs in the medicine cabinet have presumably been tested and found safe.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 06:56 am
@fresco,
I don't think this is meant to be a debate on homeopathy. It's homework to identify logical fallacies.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 10:59 am
@DrewDad,
Of course ! That's why I used the phrase "homeopathy could be doing nothing and preventing.....etc" implying that its use could be deemed "harmful". The logical fallacy involves the assumption of homeopathy "not being harmful".
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 11:03 am
It just says "fallacies", not "logical fallacies"and stating a principle is true, without any evidence that the principle actually has any validity in the real world, especially when there is no experimental or experiential evidence that it is true, is fallacious.
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 11:21 am
@MontereyJack,
The article makes an assertion, which it fails to support. The assertion itself is not a fallacy; an argument that is not logically sound is a fallacy.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 11:26 am
No argument with that. A statement that makes an argument about the real world that is not supported by the facts of the real world is also fallacious (or not necessarily fallacious, since it can in fact be true, but since it's unproven, and there's no evidence to support it, acting as if it were true is fallacious)
0 Replies
 
Dr Nancy Malik
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2010 03:11 am
@stevie051,
Law of similar (1796): Like cures like

Disease can be cured by a medicinal substance given in micro doses that produces similar symptoms in health people when given in large doses.

a. An onion is a substance which makes your eyes water and your nose burn. If you are having an attack of hay fever with watering eyes and a burning nose, a homeopathic remedy made from onion can relieve it.

b. Poison ivy causes redness, intense itching, burning, blistering and sometimes stiff muscles. Homeopathically it has been used for everything from herpes and burns to eczema and arthritis.

c. When you are stung by a bee you feel a burning, stinging pain and the tissues surrounding the area swell up. Some relief is gained from applying cold to the area. If you had swollen tonsils with burning and stinging pain relieved by cold, a homeopathic remedy prepared from the same source could cure.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2010 04:57 am
Bullshit artist.

Flim-flam peddler of nostrums to the credulous.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2010 08:16 pm
@Setanta,
Quote:
Bullshit artist.

Flim-flam peddler of nostrums to the credulous.


Why the sudden need for a full confession, Set? Are you ailing?
0 Replies
 
 

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