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Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

 
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 12:56 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Ive challenged several of the banner carriers about these (and to show us where the methods of ID and Creationism have given us ANY scientific dicoveries) and I have always been met with silence and, in some cases, changing of the subject.


Yes--but what sort of banner carriers? No sooner are you not met with silence and subject changing, a technique you have employed many times, you reach for the Ignore function or huffily declare that you're leaving the thread and not coming back no more.

Your assertions are more mush.
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 01:01 pm
@wandeljw,
It's not any different then the test standards the federal government imposed by the No Child Left Behind legislation. How are students supposed to take a science test when there are questions like, "How old is the Earth," or "What animal do we share a common ancestor?" Are the going to get those questions correct, or put down "6,000 yrs." for the first one and "We have no common ancestor to any animal?" This is simplified for lower school grades and could be more complicated answers in high school.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 01:04 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
I never try to resemble any character in the comic book called the bible; that would be a "sin" of unimaginable proportions!


Do you really think that referring to The Bible as a "comic book" is going to further your cause? All it does is demonstrate your ignorance, superficiality and lack of originality and I can't see that causing too many to jump across to your side.

All books could be called comic books. With Origins an exceptionally funny case.
Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 01:43 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Quote:
I never try to resemble any character in the comic book called the bible; that would be a "sin" of unimaginable proportions!


Do you really think that referring to The Bible as a "comic book" is going to further your cause? All it does is demonstrate your ignorance, superficiality and lack of originality and I can't see that causing too many to jump across to your side.

All books could be called comic books. With Origins an exceptionally funny case.



I wonder if you could take your hand off your cock long enough to actually provide some evidence for your own position? I suspect not. You'll just dribble out some more tripe like the sad, pathetic little loser you are.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 03:06 pm
@Wilso,
You might be habituated to insulting people in that unoriginal, school playground manner Wilso and it having some effect on those who have to put up with it but I can assure you that the only effect it has on me is to make me laugh.

A belief is a function of perception and what most people will preceive from it is that if atheism leads to such types of baby bullying as that then they are likely to become aversive to atheism.
Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 03:19 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

You might be habituated to insulting people in that unoriginal, school playground manner Wilso and it having some effect on those who have to put up with it but I can assure you that the only effect it has on me is to make me laugh.

A belief is a function of perception and what most people will preceive from it is that if atheism leads to such types of baby bullying as that then they are likely to become aversive to atheism.


In other words, you are not going to provide evidence for your position, and will continue to trot out the same pathetic drivel in the manner of the sad, pathetic loser that you are.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 03:24 pm
@Wilso,
Wilso, You have to overlook
Quote:
"...the same pathetic drivel in the manner of the sad, pathetic loser that you are."
, and enjoy the various way spendi is able to present his opinions in interesting, varied, ways that's baseless but full of humour.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 04:19 pm
@cicerone imposter,
As I just said--belief is a function of perception. My perception, and that of the majority of the population, is that Christianity, after an admittedly long struggle with our animal nature, has provided a way of life which was undreamt of, indeed unimaginable, in the whole previous history of the human race.

Science is one of its productions but science can go at a rate which requires some inhibitions as expressed anti-ID rejection of cloning and eugenics goes to prove. Copernicus was a shock to the culture. So was Darwin and then Freud and modern behavioural science is such that few people dare even to look into it.

Religion provides for those inhibitions and allows cultural change to be managed at a speed people can come to terms with. Those who want untrammelled science without constraints simply lack a working knowledge of what it is now capable of and what it will be capable of in the future.

They have had a lesson of what untrammelled financial instruments are capable of in the absence of moral constraints.

What is there to provide the inhibitions and constraints if it is not religion?

And what is the use of providing evidence, which I have supplied plenty of, for people who won't even listen to it so closed are their minds.

How often have anti-IDers been asked whether they want a society of 300,000,ooo atheists. They won't answer. And I know why. They don't want that. Which means they actually want religion as a civilising influence and, at the same time, as an easy target at which to vent frustration and spew their invective presumably because spewing invective has a pleasureable effect on the bag of electrical currents and chemical reactions which their own position necessarily says is all we consist of.

Discussions of the social consequences of any policy or philosophy are never baseless. What is baseless is discussion without reference to those consequences. That is just introverted conceit.

The US is the most religious of the modern industrial societies and the most advanced scientifically. I saw the shuttle launch the other day and nobody can touch it. One of our cricketers needs a delicate operation on his elbow and he has gone to the US to have it.

The idea that America is not out on its own in scientific acheivement is laughable. Such an idea is a delusion. A false belief. A crutch.

Onward Christian soldiers.

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 04:46 pm
@spendius,
Your use of the christian religion as a comfort blanket is not germane to human function. One of the oldest cultures in the world came from China, not the west, and christianity didn't even exist. Get used to it, because religion has already had its hayday, and is now on a downward spiral as more physical reality outstrips that which god composed.

Some have come to the realization that a young earth doesn't sit well with a planet that's been in existence for some 4.5 billion years. Even Dick Tracy comic books has more realism than the bible, and we all know who wrote comic books.

The days of miracles are over; turning a woman to salt, and flooding the whole world for god's vengeance just doesn't cut it much longer. People are just lucky if ten percent of their prayers are answered; and that's only through luck.

God's love is an oxymoron.
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 05:04 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Arthur C. Clarke's short story which profoundly ends in a spine chilling single sentence (no spoilers here):

“The Nine Billion Names of God” follows three employees of a computer company as they sell, deliver and maintain a relatively large and fast computer to a group of Tibetan monks. The monks want the computer to help them print out all the possible names of God, of which they believe there are about nine billion. They figured it would take fifteen thousand years to do it by hand, but with a computer the task can be reduced to a thousand days. (Even that number seems ridiculously slow by today’s standards!)

The story is divided into two parts: the first describes Dr. Wagner as he makes the initial sale to a lama from the monastery, and the second part describes George and Chuck, the two men who delivered the computer to Tibet and are helping maintain it while it performs its duty. It is when the computer is almost finished with its task that George and Chuck discover why the monks want to print out all nine billion names - and it isn’t a cheerful reason either!

“This is a project on which we have been working for the last three centuries " since the lamasery was founded, in fact. It is somewhat alien to your way of thought, so I hope you will listen with an open mind while I explain it.”

“Naturally.”

“It is really quite simple. We have been compiling a list which shall contain all the possible names of God.”

“I beg your pardon?”

“We have reason to believe,” continued the lama imperturbably, “that all such names can be written with not more than nine letters in an alphabet we have devised."

“And you have been doing this for three centuries?”

“Yes. We expected it would take us about fifteen thousand years to complete the task."

-Excerpt from Best Sci Fi.com
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 06:06 pm
@Lightwizard,
So many gods; which one do I pick to serve?
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 06:18 pm
@cicerone imposter,
None. You're an atheist. That's it. No choices. Nothing but meaningless futility from end to end. Dust to dust. Womb to tomb. End of story.
rabel22
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 09:31 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

None. You're an atheist. That's it. No choices. Nothing but meaningless futility from end to end. Dust to dust. Womb to tomb. End of story.



God has judged in the name of Spendius.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 04:07 am
@rabel22,
Nah-- science is the judge. He's the atheist. He has no other choice. It has nothing to do with me. Or you. Except that my succinct summary is what he thinks applies to everybody and every thing.

It's in Shakespeare. And he cribbed it.
0 Replies
 
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 08:50 am
Quote:
University Place Student Receives ACLU Scholarship for Challenging Teaching of “Intelligent Design”
(ACLU of Washington Press Release, March 18, 2009)

Colin Moyer, a senior at Curtis High School in University Place, has been awarded a 2009 ACLU Youth Activist Scholarship for challenging the teaching of a form of creationism in his science class and for promoting freedom of speech at his school. Moyer is one of 16 students across the nation to receive the award.

The ACLU awards scholarships annually to honor the efforts of graduating seniors who have demonstrated a strong commitment to civil liberties through student activism. In addition to a $12,500 college scholarship, Moyer will be invited to participate in a Youth Activist Institute at the National ACLU office in New York.

“Colin Moyer is a thoughtful, articulate activist who showed courage in taking a stand. He ensured that students would receive a science education based on science, not religion,” said Kathleen Taylor, Executive Director of the ACLU of Washington.

Moyer was shocked when his popular tenth-grade biology teacher began teaching a view of evolution that focused more on religious views than on scientific facts and didn’t tolerate criticism. “A class that was usually interactive was suddenly single-sided,” said Moyer. “Students were not allowed to ask questions, and there were no textbooks or tests.”

Moyer began to read books and articles on evolution. He soon realized that his teacher was promoting creationism in the guise of “intelligent design,” the same approach that was ruled unconstitutional in a 2005 case in Dover, Pennsylvania (Kitzmiller v. Dover).

Moyer contacted the ACLU and then the National Center for Science Education for advice. With their support, he worked out an agreement with the school administration. The issue was quickly resolved, and the teacher was forced to stop teaching intelligent design.

Encouraged by his success, Moyer then tackled freedom of speech at the school, where the official student newspaper had ceased publication. He recruited a student staff and produced an alternative newspaper, The Viking Underground . Moyer helped finance its publication costs out of savings from a summer job and by selling his letterman’s jacket.

“We shared a passion for the truth and a belief that the student voice has a right to be heard in the community,” said Moyer.

The paper has been recognized by the Student Press Law Center for exercising and protecting students’ civil liberties. Moyer currently helps other student journalists whose newspapers are being censored and subjected to prior review.

Moyer’s philosophy is to work quietly but with determination. “For me, being an activist is not about a personal agenda or making a scene; it is about defending civil liberties and getting the job done,” he said.
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 09:44 am
@cicerone imposter,
You're stuck with worshipping (or not) all nine billion -- there's no proof which was is the Big Kahuna.

I'm for worshipping (or not) the Three Wise Men -- they were wise and look really good as a foreground for a nativity scene.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 09:47 am
Good for the kid. He brings up the point that many teachers, when left to their own devices wont do whats required of them. Teaching ID in science is pushing it. I hope the teacher can be suitably embarrased by the kids approach.
Ill bet that, behind the-shithead teacher , sat a smug assed school superintendent who had a religion agenda to push and he was trying to accomplish it by the "stealth" approach.

This crap isnt going away and training a generation of intelligent kids who can "smoke" out these clowns is , to me, just wonderful. I love to hear bout these shithead school teachers getting their lunches handed to them by some 14 year old. Har Har Har.
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 09:49 am
@rabel22,
He obviously believes there's a Ritz Carlton in the sky and is hoping they serve ale.
0 Replies
 
Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 01:24 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

None. You're an atheist. That's it. No choices. Nothing but meaningless futility from end to end. Dust to dust. Womb to tomb. End of story.


I get plenty of meaning looking into the eyes of my stunning wife. Out of watching my beautiful daughter grow and learn. The wonder she shows in everything around her. Where's your meaning come from, your religion fantasy, or sinking ivory balls on a snooker table while swilling pints of ale. You're a loser with a capital "L".
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2009 02:01 pm
@Wilso,
Poor spendi's life swirls around the local pub and a2k, and he has the chutzpah to speak to us as though his life has any meaning. He'll continue to believe in an afterlife that'll never happen, because his god is all made up from men's imagination - and nothing more.
 

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