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George Bush's Legacy

 
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 10:58 am
mysteryman wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
From Rama's post, above: "My fellow citizens: Not only can we win the war in Iraq, we are winning the war in Iraq."
President George W. Bush
Dec. 18, 2005

We've been "winning" this war for three years now. How come our soldiers are still being shot at and getting killed?


Do you have any idea how dumb that question is?

We started winning WW2 in late 1942 or early 1943, but our soldiers still got killed.
Just because we are winning doesnt mean that soldiers arent going to die.

So US soldiers were still getting shot and killed in late 1945 and early 1946?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 11:14 am
And that would include 1947 and 1948 - after we won the war.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 Jul, 2008 03:52 pm
The legacy of George W. Bush is not something many would be proud of. Political leaders are often judged in the media for their actions at a particular point in time and thus it's always hard to make a proper assessment of the legacy without stepping back and seeing the man in the broadest perspective.

OK, I just took a few steps back. Frankly, the legacy shows little of a statesman and more of a man with a low political intellect and a propensity to resolve most things he doesn't understand through the use of military power. His two major military adventures in Iraq and Afghanistan are political, military and social disasters. He has done nothing worthy on the domestic front. What ishis legacy, really?

Yet leaders like to leave with a last hurrah - it's sort of expected of them. Ideally he would be well advised to announce something meaningful: a timetable for withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan, something both existing governments there have been asking for (admittedly the Iraqis more than President Karzai). But then this is asking too much and I am not sure Mr. Bush even realizes that he has U.S. troops in a foreign land. At times it seems that he sees the world as his own oyster, so it doesn't matter where his fleets go or on whose soil his soldiers set foot.

The interesting part of the legacy that could have been is that the U.S. might have led the world towards peace and prosperity, acting as an honest broker amongst nations that are in conflict. It could have used its might in such a productive manner that it could seriously have changed the world. This vision needs statesmen and this is where Mr. Bush falls miserably short. The U.S. is a great nation, and I have met some remarkable Americans who have passion for positive change and feel the need for positive leadership. However, as political processes go, we are stuck with what we have.

I somehow cannot see George W. Bush doing anything monumental to make a difference to his legacy, perhaps because in his own mind he might be thinking that he is the best President the U.S. has ever had. Nevertheless, this is a legacy that has been cast and it will have some who will admire the man and some like me, who feel that it has been a failure.


http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/postglobal/anwer_sher/2008/07/a_bush_legacy_that_might_have.html
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 Jul, 2008 04:00 pm
I don't think Bush needs to strengthen his legacy. It has already been deeply engraved in the history of the Middle East. George W. Bush has in fact ruined the Middle East.

No words can describe my anger at what the United States has tolerated or promoted in the Middle East under the Bush White House. The list is long: the war on Iraq, Abu Ghraib, Haditha, Falluja, Mosul, the war on Lebanon, Qana, and not to forget, the circus in Palestine, the killing in Jenin, and the siege in Gaza, topped with the elimination of Yasser Arafat, a democratically elected leader. These images have always reminded me of Sept. 11, 2001. The blood of these children?-in Lebanon, Palestine, Iraq?-is no less valuable than that of Americans killed at the Twin Towers. Many Americans have been sending me "hate mail" recently, saying that the Bush Administration has been good to the Arabs and is trying to bring peace, security, and democracy to the Middle East. Sorry to tell them that this White House will be remembered for Abu Ghraib. It will be remembered for the atrocities in Gaza. It will be remembered for Qana.


Bush has perhaps single-handedly re-written the history of the Middle East?-certainly against our will. This history has been very bloody and embarrassing for America, and it will affect America's image for generations to come. Allow me to quote the former and legendary U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, who spoke to Congress on Dec. 1, 1862 saying: "Fellow citizens, we cannot escape history. We of this Congress and this administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. The fiery trail through which we pass will light us down, in honor or dishonor, to the latest generation."

In our part of the world, Bush has marched into history in great dishonor.

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/postglobal/sami_moubayed/2008/07/bush_legacy_a_negative_reminde.html
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 Jul, 2008 05:11 pm
Operation Iraqi Freedom was carried out with a combination of precision, and speed, and boldness the enemy did not expect, and the world had not seen before. From distant bases or ships at sea, we sent planes and missiles that could destroy an enemy division, or strike a single bunker. Marines and soldiers charged to Baghdad across 350 miles of hostile ground, in one of the swiftest advances of heavy arms in history. You have shown the world the skill and the might of the American Armed Forces.

This nation thanks all of the members of our coalition who joined in a noble cause. We thank the Armed Forces of the United Kingdom, Australia, and Poland, who shared in the hardships of war. We thank all of the citizens of Iraq who welcomed our troops and joined in the liberation of their own country. And tonight, I have a special word for Secretary (Donald) Rumsfeld, for General (Tommy) Franks, and for all the men and women who wear the uniform of the United States: America is grateful for a job well done.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/05/01/iraq/main551946.shtml
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 06:59 pm
Quote:


By one count, the president has publicly vowed to "solve problems, not pass them on to future presidents and future generations" upwards of 400 times.

As the clock starts to run out on Bush's presidency, we know, of course, that the opposite is true. Global warming, the war in Iraq, the war in Afghanistan, a weak economy … not only is Bush passing monumental problems onto his successor, he's created new ones that didn't exist when he got there.

This is especially true when it comes to the federal budget. Bush inherited the largest surplus ever recorded ($128 billion), but his fiscal legacy is a painful one.

The White House on Monday predicted a record deficit of $490 billion for the 2009 budget year, a senior government official told CNN.

The deficit would amount to roughly 3.5 percent of the nation's $14 trillion economy.

The official pointed to a faltering economy and the bipartisan $170 billion stimulus package that passed earlier this year for the record deficit.

Senate Budget Committee Chairman Kent Conrad (D-N.D.) said Bush "will be remembered as the most fiscally irresponsible president in our nation's history," adding, "If they gave out Olympic medals for fiscal irresponsibility, President Bush would take the gold, silver and bronze. With his eight years in office, he will have had the five highest deficits ever recorded. And the highest of those deficits is now projected to come in 2009, as he leaves office."

Wait, it gets worse.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/07/28/quite-a-fiscal-legacy/#more-31388

0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 07:57 pm
Bush said "each life is precious," but he loves to execute people. You know; it's difficult, but somebody's gotta do it! ..
******************



Bush OKs execution of Army death row prisoner

By DEB RIECHMANN, Associated Press Writer 41 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - President Bush on Monday approved the execution of an Army private, the first time in over a half-century that a president has affirmed a death sentence for a member of the U.S. military.

With his signature from the Oval Office, Bush said yes to the military's request to execute Ronald A. Gray, the White House confirmed. Gray had had been convicted in connection with a spree of four murders and eight rapes in the Fayetteville, N.C., area over eight months in the late 1980s while stationed at Fort Bragg.

"While approving a sentence of death for a member of our armed services is a serious and difficult decision for a commander in chief, the president believes the facts of this case leave no doubt that the sentence is just and warranted," White House press secretary Dana Perino said.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 09:36 pm
Ramafuchs wrote:
I don't think Bush needs to strengthen his legacy. It has already been deeply engraved in the history of the Middle East. George W. Bush has in fact ruined the Middle East.


Yeah, things were so nice in Afghanistan and Iraq before Bush sent in the troops.

If only things coulda stayed as they were, with the Taliban and Saddam the butcher still in power.

W really messed things up. Now Iraqis and Afghanis have the idea that they should be able to vote for their own government.

Of all the crazy ideas.

If only we could go back to the good ole days of Saddam gassing the Kurds and running his enemies thru the plastic shredder.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 09:51 pm
I'm not sure about our need to attack Afghanistan, because of the Taliban, but Iraq was and is an unnecessary war that's draining our military and treasure. Democracy has never come from the outside.

By some estimates, we've been responsible for the killing of over 100,000 innocent Iraqis, and the migration of over 2 million of their citizens - and we were not received or welcomed as liberators as Chaney and Rummy stated. We are now seen as occupiers by not only Iraqis, but many in the Middle East.

When a country has a tyrant for their leader, it's really none of our business; there are multitudes of tyrannical governments in this world - including China and Zimbabwe. They execute their citizens fighting for democracy, and our government doesn't so much as make a squeak.

Iraq was never about democracy; it's about their oil.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 10:12 pm
real life wrote:
Ramafuchs wrote:
I don't think Bush needs to strengthen his legacy. It has already been deeply engraved in the history of the Middle East. George W. Bush has in fact ruined the Middle East.


Yeah, things were so nice in Afghanistan and Iraq before Bush sent in the troops.

If only things coulda stayed as they were, with the Taliban and Saddam the butcher still in power.

W really messed things up. Now Iraqis and Afghanis have the idea that they should be able to vote for their own government.

Of all the crazy ideas.

If only we could go back to the good ole days of Saddam gassing the Kurds and running his enemies thru the plastic shredder.


Just a primer.


Quote:


Top McCain Fundraiser Lobbying Bush Admin To Help ?'Quash' Toxic-Dumping Case For Chevron»

In 1993, a class action lawsuit on behalf of an estimated 30,000 Amazon residents was filed against oil giant Chevron, who at the time had recently purchased Texaco. The lawsuit alleged that Chevron was responsible for Texaco intentionally dumping "more than 19 billion gallons of toxic wastewaters" and "16.8 million gallons of crude oil" into Ecuador's environment.

This past spring, a court-appointed expert recommended that "Chevron be required to pay between $8 billion and $16 billion to clean up the rain forest." Finally having "to disclose the issue to its shareholders," Chevron has launched "an unusually high-powered battle" to convince the Bush administration to pressure Ecuador to "quash the case."

Chevron's lobbying offensive is being led by former senators Trent Lott and John Breaux, along with Wayne Berman, a top fundraiser for Sen. John McCain (R-AZ):

Chevron is pushing the Bush administration to take the extraordinary step of yanking special trade preferences for Ecuador if the country's leftist government doesn't quash the case. A spokesman for U.S. Trade Representative Susan Schwab confirmed that her office is considering the request. Attorney Steven Donziger, who is coordinating the D.C. opposition to Chevron, says the firm is "trying to get the country to cry uncle." He adds: "It's the crudest form of power politics."

Chevron's powerhouse team includes former Senate majority leader Trent Lott, former Democratic senator John Breaux and Wayne Berman, a top fund-raiser for John McCain?-all with access to Washington's top decision makers.

So far, Chevron's power push has resulted in "a senior Chevron exec" meeting with Deputy Secretary of State John Negroponte "on the matter." "One Chevron lobbyist" told Newsweek that the company's argument to the Bush administration is: "We can't let little countries screw around with big companies like this?-companies that have made big investments around the world."

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/07/26/chevron-ecuador-lobbyists/

0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 10:17 pm
Another little primer.

Quote:


Mayer: Top DOJ Lawyers Spoke ?'In Codes' For Fear Of Being Wiretapped By White House ?'Lunatics'

Last night on PBS, Bill Moyers interviewed investigative journalist Jane Mayer and mentioned that in Mayer's new book, she notes that FBI agents refused to participate in the CIA's interrogation of terror suspects at Guantánamo Bay because they determined it to be "borderline torture." Moyers then asked, "Who were some of the other conservative heroes, as you call them, in your book?"

Mayer remembered one top Justice Department lawyer and "very conservative member of this administration" who said that after participating in White House meetings authorizing torture, he believed that "lunatics had taken over the country."

Mayer said two other top DOJ lawyers had to develop a system of speaking codes because they feared they were being wiretapped while others described an "atmosphere of intimidation," mainly from Vice President Dick Cheney:

MAYER: There was such an atmosphere of intimidation. … They felt so endangered in some ways that, at one point, two of the top lawyers from the Justice Department developed this system of talking in codes to each other because they thought they might be being wiretapped…by their own government. They felt like they might be kind of weirdly in physical danger. They were actually scared to stand up to Vice President Cheney.

Mayer later said that "there is a paper trail" documenting U.S. torture policies "that goes right to the top of our govenment" and that Congress "is beginning to" get to the truth and "piece it together."

Mayer added that the truth to the White House policies is "a humungous jigsaw puzzle" because "there are many, many secrets we still don't know. There are legal memos that nobody's ever seen."

[watch the video at]

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/07/26/doj-codes-lunatics/

0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 10:46 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bush said "each life is precious," but he loves to execute people. You know; it's difficult, but somebody's gotta do it! ..
******************



Bush OKs execution of Army death row prisoner

By DEB RIECHMANN, Associated Press Writer 41 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - President Bush on Monday approved the execution of an Army private, the first time in over a half-century that a president has affirmed a death sentence for a member of the U.S. military.

With his signature from the Oval Office, Bush said yes to the military's request to execute Ronald A. Gray, the White House confirmed. Gray had had been convicted in connection with a spree of four murders and eight rapes in the Fayetteville, N.C., area over eight months in the late 1980s while stationed at Fort Bragg.

"While approving a sentence of death for a member of our armed services is a serious and difficult decision for a commander in chief, the president believes the facts of this case leave no doubt that the sentence is just and warranted," White House press secretary Dana Perino said.


After reading the entire AP article, do you really have a problem with this, or are you just complaining because Bush authorized the execution?

BTW, the last President to authorize a military execution was a democrat, his name was John F Kennedy.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jul, 2008 06:30 am
I thought it was Eisenhower?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jul, 2008 11:38 am
Another compassionate conservative being investigated for corruption.
*********************

Tuesday, July 29, 2008
Last Update: 12:24 PM EST
The Caucus
Sen. Stevens Indicted in Corruption Inquiry
By KATE PHILLIPS
Senator Ted Stevens spoke to reporters on Capitol Hill in April.

A federal grand jury has indicted longtime Senator Ted Stevens, Republican of Alaska, on corruption charges after more than a year's investigation, a federal law enforcement official said.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jul, 2008 07:16 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Another compassionate conservative being investigated for corruption.
*********************

Tuesday, July 29, 2008
Last Update: 12:24 PM EST
The Caucus
Sen. Stevens Indicted in Corruption Inquiry
By KATE PHILLIPS
Senator Ted Stevens spoke to reporters on Capitol Hill in April.

A federal grand jury has indicted longtime Senator Ted Stevens, Republican of Alaska, on corruption charges after more than a year's investigation, a federal law enforcement official said.


Let's hurry and get this dealt with. After a few years in the can he'll be tops on the list for conservative presidential material come 2012.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jul, 2008 07:33 pm
Bush's Legacy of Torture




I still find it hard to believe that George W. Bush, to his eternal shame and our nation's great discredit, made torture a matter of hair-splitting, legalistic debate at the highest levels of the United States government. But that's precisely what he did.

Three previously classified administration memos obtained last week by the American Civil Liberties Union add to our understanding of this disgraceful episode. The documents are attempts to justify the unjustifiable?-the use of brutal interrogation methods that international agreements define as torture?-and keep those who ordered and carried out this dirty business from being prosecuted and jailed.

The memos don't call it torture, of course. Heavily redacted before being surrendered to the ACLU under a Freedom of Information Act lawsuit, the documents refer euphemistically to "enhanced techniques" of interrogation. Changing the name doesn't change the act, however. One memo, written in 2004, specifically makes clear the administration's view that "the waterboard" is an acceptable way to extract information.

Waterboarding, a technique of simulated drowning, is considered torture virtually everywhere on earth except in the Bush administration's archive of self-exculpatory memos, directives and opinions.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20080729_bushs_legacy_of_torture/
0 Replies
 
raprap
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jul, 2008 08:01 pm
McGentrix wrote:
I thought it was Eisenhower?


It was Eisenhower who approved the hanging of U.S. Army Private John A. Bennett, but he was executed in April, 1961 and Kennedy was President at the time of execution.

However, guilty Ronald Gray is (And I believe he is guilty) George Bush the lesser seems to get a thrill about signing warrants of execution (Re Carla Faye Tucker), unless he's personally connected to the condemned's family. His practice as Governor of Texas (152 Death Warrants Signed), and POTUS (approving CIA assignation, extraordinary-ne torture-interrogation) stands as evidence and legacy.

IMO even though Clinton was not a great POTUS, history will raise his laurels simply because of the practices of his successor.

Rap
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jul, 2008 08:18 pm
Bush signs new rules, roles for spy agencies

40 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - An administration official says President Bush has approved an order revising the rules governing spying, both in the United States and abroad, and lays out each of the 16 agencies responsibilities.


The executive order maintains the decades-old prohibitions on assassination and human testing.

The order has been under revision for more than a year during a national debate about the proper balance between civil liberties and security, spurred by both the 9/11 attacks and Bush's warrantless wiretapping program. It was first created under the Reagan administration in 1981.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jul, 2008 08:45 pm
Quote:
George Bush the lesser seems to get a thrill about signing warrants of execution


Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jul, 2008 09:22 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Quote:
George Bush the lesser seems to get a thrill about signing warrants of execution


Rolling Eyes


Geeze, surprise of surprises, an ignorant dickhead!

Quote:


Katrina Vanden Heuvel: Texas's Commuter-in-Chief

Back in the days when Governor George Bush was only able to screw-up Texas instead of an entire nation, 57 lawyers representing men - and a woman - on death row requested commutations so that their clients might receive life instead of death.

When approached by lawyers representing mentally retarded inmates, Bush refused.

When approached by lawyers representing inmates whose court-appointed lawyers had slept during their trials, Bush refused.

When approached by lawyers representing men who had committed the crime in question as juveniles, Bush refused.

In each case, then-Governor Bush felt that the defendants had had full and equal access to the law.

But now along comes Scooter. President Bush deemed his 30-month sentence "excessive" and - just like that - commuted his sentence prior to any judicial review. Libby had the finest legal representation. He never expressed any remorse for lying to a grand jury or for his role in the administration's snow job on the American people that led our nation into a war. Yet Scooter is the lucky soul granted clemency by Bush.

In an article for the once-hyped but now defunct magazine, Talk, conservative commentator Tucker Carlson interviewed then-Gov. Bush about Karla Faye Tucker, a woman who had recently been executed after he denied her clemency. Bush's response struck Carlson as "odd and cruel" and he described this exchange:

"I watched [Larry King's] interview with [Karla Faye Tucker]…," Bush said. "He asked her real difficult questions, like ?'What would you say to Governor Bush?' ?'What was her answer?' I wonder.

?'Please,' Bush whimpers, his lips pursed in mock desperation, ?'don't kill me.'

Odd and cruel, indeed. Carlson provoked a bit of a media storm for revealing Bush's callousness at a time when - unlike now - he was still viewed as Mr. Compassionate Conservative. (The Bush presidential campaign tried to deny that Bush had made this statement but to no avail.)

Bush seemed all the more cruel given that appeals for clemency had been made by figures from around the world, including Newt Gingrich, Pat Robertson, the Huntsville prison warden and correction officers who testified that Tucker was a model prisoner and reformed, a prosecutor of her accomplice, the brother of one of her murder victims, Pope John Paul II and the European Parliament.

Sister Helen Prejean, one of the preeminent fighters against the death penalty and the inspiration for the film Dead Man Walking, wrote, "Callous indifference to human suffering may also set Bush apart. He may be the only government official to mock a condemned person's plea for mercy, then lie about it afterward, claiming humane feelings he never felt."

(Prejean was alluding to George Bush's election-year memoir - A Charge to Keep - in which he wrote that Tucker's impending execution "felt like a huge piece of concrete…crushing me.") Preajan described her response when she was told on Larry King of Bush's final press release before Tucker's execution in which he stated, "May God bless Karla Faye Tucker…." Prejean wrote, "Inside my soul I raged at Bush's hypocrisy, but the broadcast was live and global…. [So] I took a quick breath, said a fierce prayer, looked into the camera, and said, ?'It's interesting to see that Governor Bush is now invoking God, asking God to bless Karla Faye Tucker, when he certainly didn't use the power in his own hands to bless her. He just had her killed.'"

...

http://neweraartist.wordpress.com/2007/07/13/katrina-vanden-heuvel-texass-commuter-in-chief/


0 Replies
 
 

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