Brine line draws but doesn't refill water

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Can somebody please help me?

I have a 4-yr. old Rainsoft Silver Series softener and it's no longer using salt for about 4-6 months now. Lately, Ive been refilling the brine tank manually using a garden hose until I got fed up with it and put the softener on bypass, for now.

The softener was set for the following ever since I bought it:

Regeneration - 2am (factory default)
Regen Days - daily
Backwash Time - 5 minutes
Salt Dosage - 12.5 lbs.

There are 10 people in the house and I've been using Morton block salts from Home Depot.

Also, I have done the following:

- Cleaned the brine tank completely including both ends of the brine line, well, and the float mechanism.

- Washed and rinsed the brine flow control group of components (connected to the brass fitting) and found no blockage.

- Washed and rinsed the plastic vortex thingy with the nozzle and "throat" and also the white screen filter. Found no blockage in both areas.

- Took out the black injector plug just below the white screen filter assembly and voila! Out came a tiny opaque plastic bead about the size of a pepper corn. At first, I thought it could be a ball bearing or a part of a valve or something. But after going over the various Fleck control diagrams on the internet, there was no part not even one that closely resembled a pellet. Could this be a resin bead? Anyways, I washed and cleaned the plug injector and put it back in. Still, the brine tank would not fill water.

I am at my wits end here. Any assistance from you guys especially H2O man would be much appreciated. :wink:

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It sounds as if it isn't getting into a regeneration. Does the control keep the correct time of day? If not the motor or wire connections are bad, or a transformer is bad or there is no power to the unit.

Can you suck on the control valve end of the brine line and get salt water? If not check the float to be able to open close the 2310 valve it hangs on in the brine well.

That little ball may be part of the brine line flow control although I've never seen one on any Fleck valve.

Is the cam wheel that rotates to depress the brine valve rotating in the brine refill and brine draw positions; it pushes the stem on the brine valve down?

Is the drain line blocked or kinked shut? The far end of the drain line frozen in a puddle of ice?

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Re: Brine line draws but doesn't refill water

Namor wrote:

I am at my wits end here. Any assistance from you guys especially H2O man would be much appreciated. :wink:

Is the clock keeping time?

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Thanks for the quick response guys. :wink:

Yes, the control timer is good and the motor too; because I could hear a steady hum every time it is plugged in.

As to sucking on the control valve end of the brine line -- nope. IMO, I don't think the unit has a problem sucking brine from the tank. Because every time I put raw water in just a few inches below the topmost salt block, the next morning the water level goes down to where the brine well slits or openings are and that is it. Water doesn't come back up for next day's regen. At this point, also, the water quality is not as soft and slippery as the first time I bought the conditioner.

As to the little plastic ball, I have no idea where it came from originally.

As to the cam wheel, I don't know which of the 2 downward sloping grooves is the refill and draw positions. Also, I have no clue as to the sequence of the operations involved in regeneration but I do know that backwash is the first one. I wish you guys can tell me the timing of the whole regen cycle that is specific to my unit.

As to the drain line, I can guarantee that the brine tank overflow drain is free flowing because there is no hose attached to the elbow joint, and there is no obstruction to it. The resin well drain hose is inserted into a PVC pipe that is stuck deep into the ground, and I could feel and hear water rushing inside of it during backwash.

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The motor hum doesn't mean any gears move, it says there is power to the motor but doesn't mean the motor can drive anything.

So put it in a manual regeneration and watch what it does. It may put the water in the brine tank after backwashing and wait two hours before using it in brine draw.

Blow into the brine line at the control valve end and make sure you can.

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Namor wrote:

Yes, the control timer is good and the motor too; because I could hear a steady hum every time it is plugged in..

OK, but does it keep and show the correct time of day?

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Yes, the timer is keeping and showing the current time of day.

I have yet to experiment blowing into the brine line but that will have to wait until tomorrow because it is so cold outside.

BTW, sorry I forgot to mention this. The manual regen lever is not working. I tried pushing it down in the direction of the arrow and holding it for 3-5 seconds, still nothing happened. The only thing tho the lever does is nudge the time pointer of the backwash dial a fraction of an inch and that's it.

I'm just curious, what are the sequence of steps involved in regeneration (manual regen lever) and backwashing (backwash dial)?

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If it is too cold outside, then the thing may be frozen and can't work. If it freezes it will bust the control valve and resin tank.

Most softeners go backwash, slow rinse/brine draw, backwash, final rinse, brine refill. Some do brine refill first, then a 2 hour pause and then the rest minus the refill.

When the manual 'lever' is depressed, it takes a number of minutes before the regeneration starts.

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I forgot to mention that I got colds so I'm a bit sensitive to the temperature outside which was 52 degrees last night. It's a good thing tho that you mentioned "freezing." The unit was installed outside partially dug in -- atypical to a Florida setup. I remember we only had 1 freeze warning back in January, I think. Could the unit been affected by the freeze? Do I have to disassemble the whole thing?

BTW, I was able to blow thru the control valve end of the brine line which was attached to the brine well on the other end. So there is no problem there.

What will I do next?

Thanks.

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The RainSoft Silver Series control panel is my least favorite.
They are not user friendly and they are a PITA to work on.

You may need a service call from your local RS dealer on this one.
You could consider replacing the valve with a metered Fleck 2510 SE.
The SE is a direct bolt-on replacement valve and it is an upgrade over the RS.

I hope that helps Cool

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How much does a Fleck 2510SE cost?

How do you remove the control unit from the resin tank?

I want to take the head unit and resin tank apart and see what is inside them before I spend money on a new control unit. Who knows, maybe the problem is just a clogged chamber or something.

Also, do you know of any site that sell replacement parts for the Silver Series? I've been all over the net and I haven't found anything that is labled 'for RS Silver Series' or a parts list and even a diagram.

Thanks.

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H2O Man, what does # of grains mean and what is recommended for a household of at least 8-10 persons?

Do you think my resin tank need a resin bed replacement? If so, what would you recommend?

Thanks.

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RainSoft likes to hide everything in an effort to force the customer to deal within their network of dealers.

Shop around online for a 2510 SE valve. You may need a matching brine tank with your new valve.

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Namor wrote:

H2O Man, what does # of grains mean and what is recommended for a household of at least 8-10 persons?

Do you think my resin tank need a resin bed replacement? If so, what would you recommend?

Thanks.

# of grains is the total hardness of your water in GPG.
Your resin should be fine.

Bottom line, your RainSoft system will give you problems - a new ECOwater system would be better than putting band-aids on what you have.

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H2O Man,

With regards to the Silver Series, does it have an up flow or down flow piston? Why does it take a few minutes for it to start regeneration after holding down the manual regen lever? This is ludicrous because you really wouldn't know if the regen has started or not.

I went to the ECO web site and found their models very appealing. Their resin tanks have an extra layer of protection which is what I really needed because mine is situated outside.

So which of the ECO models would you recommend for 8-10 persons?

Again, thanks.

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Namor wrote:

H2O Man,

I went to the ECO web site and found their models very appealing. Their resin tanks have an extra layer of protection which is what I really needed because mine is situated outside.

So which of the ECO models would you recommend for 8-10 persons?

Again, thanks.

Contact your local dealer for a free test and quote. They may have a trade-in offer for you.

I'm not sure about how the Silver Series piston ...

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Namor wrote:

With regards to the Silver Series, does it have an up flow or down flow piston? Why does it take a few minutes for it to start regeneration after holding down the manual regen lever? This is ludicrous because you really wouldn't know if the regen has started or not.

I went to the ECO web site and found their models very appealing. Their resin tanks have an extra layer of protection which is what I really needed because mine is situated outside.

So which of the ECO models would you recommend for 8-10 persons?

Again, thanks.

Upflow or downflow has nothing to do with your problem but only RS can tell you which piston you have.

If the control valve is a mechanical type, the gearing is driven by a clock motor and will take a couple minutes before it can move the piston. If you want instantaneous, buy an electronic valve.

IMO, ECO is a high priced version of the GE, Whirlpool or Kenmore. You'd do better with a softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve.

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Gary Slusser wrote:

IMO, ECO is a high priced version of the GE, Whirlpool or Kenmore. You'd do better with a softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve.

ECOwater offers a complete system that is professionally installed and serviced...
if you get the Clack, you're just getting an over priced version of a Fleck control valve and you're on your own from there.

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Those Fleck valves ain't what they used to be.

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Gary Slusser wrote:

IMO, ECO is a high priced version of the GE, Whirlpool or Kenmore. You'd do better with a softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve.

H2O_MAN wrote:

ECOwater offers a complete system that is professionally installed and serviced...
if you get the Clack, you're just getting an over priced version of a Fleck control valve and you're on your own from there.

Actually a Fleck valve that can compete with the features of a Clack WS-1 costs more...

If he gets an ECO or any other national brand softener and has a problem he must call a local dealer for service.

That's where he is now and notice how he is tearing his Rain Soft apart instead of calling for service?

He wants to fix it himself, and if he had a Clack WS-1 control he could.

And with parts that cost no more than half what Fleck and ECO, Culligan, Rain Soft, etc. etc. cost and he wouldn't have to pay for a service call.

With a pair of channel lock type pliers he could change all five parts of a Clack and have his water back on in less than 30 minutes.

I think someone is stuck on stupid.... that would be the guys here that keep telling people that are posting for help in do it yourself forum, to go to local dealers. If the poster wanted to do that, they wouldn't be here!

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Brine line draws but doesn't refill water

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