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AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 01:42 pm
@Foxfyre,
That's not a FACT CHECK; it's their opinion without any support.

Your misleading heading "FACT CHECK" shows how dishonest you are.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 01:54 pm
@Foxfyre,
CI is correct; that 'fact check' is ridiculous and nothing but opinion on the part of the writers.

Quote:


OBAMA: "And I believe the nation that invented the automobile cannot walk away from it."

THE FACTS: Depends what your definition of automobiles, is. According to the Library of Congress, the inventor of the first true automobile was probably Germany's Karl Benz, who created the first auto powered by an internal combustion gasoline engine, in 1885 or 1886. In the U.S., Charles Duryea tested what library researchers called the first successful gas-powered car in 1893. Nobody disputes that Henry Ford created the first assembly line that made cars affordable.


Pointless Quibbling, the US has as much claim on the auto as anyone and we certainly made the auto industry happen from the ground up.

Quote:

OBAMA: "We have known for decades that our survival depends on finding new sources of energy. Yet we import more oil today than ever before."

THE FACTS: Oil imports peaked in 2005 at just over 5 billion barrels, and have been declining slightly since. The figure in 2007 was 4.9 billion barrels, or about 58 percent of total consumption. The nation is on pace this year to import 4.7 billion barrels, and government projections are for imports to hold steady or decrease a bit over the next two decades.


Quibbling over tiny percentages, but in fact this is one of the better sourced arguments made here.

Quote:


OBAMA: "We have already identified $2 trillion in savings over the next decade."

THE FACTS: Although 10-year projections are common in government, they don't mean much. And at times, they are a way for a president to pass on the most painful steps to his successor, by putting off big tax increases or spending cuts until someone else is in the White House.

Obama only has a real say on spending during the four years of his term. He may not be president after that and he certainly won't be 10 years from now.


Irrelevant. This does not challenge what Obama said at all.

Quote:

OBAMA: "Regulations were gutted for the sake of a quick profit at the expense of a healthy market. People bought homes they knew they couldn't afford from banks and lenders who pushed those bad loans anyway. And all the while, critical debates and difficult decisions were put off for some other time on some other day."

THE FACTS: This may be so, but it isn't only Republicans who pushed for deregulation of the financial industries. The Clinton administration championed an easing of banking regulations, including legislation that ended the barrier between regular banks and Wall Street banks. That led to a deregulation that kept regular banks under tight federal regulation but extended lax regulation of Wall Street banks. Clinton Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, later an economic adviser to candidate Obama, was in the forefront in pushing for this deregulation.


Irrelevant, Obama did not specifically blame Republicans at all. This disproves nothing he said.

Quote:

OBAMA: "Thanks to our recovery plan, we will double this nation's supply of renewable energy in the next three years."

THE FACTS: While the president's stimulus package includes billions in aid for renewable energy and conservation, his goal is unlikely to be achieved through the recovery plan alone.

In 2007, the U.S. produced 8.4 percent of its electricity from renewable sources, including hydroelectric dams, solar panels and windmills. Under the status quo, the Energy Department says, it will take more than two decades to boost that figure to 12.5 percent.

If Obama is to achieve his much more ambitious goal, Congress would need to mandate it. That is the thrust of an energy bill that is expected to be introduced in coming weeks.


Irrelevant, this does not disprove anything he said at all. It merely says that he needs to get the energy bill passed he SPECIFICALLY asked for last night.

Quote:


OBAMA: "Over the next two years, this plan will save or create 3.5 million jobs."

THE FACTS: This is a recurrent Obama formulation. But job creation projections are uncertain even in stable times, and some of the economists relied on by Obama in making his forecast acknowledge a great deal of uncertainty in their numbers.

The president's own economists, in a report prepared last month, stated, "It should be understood that all of the estimates presented in this memo are subject to significant margins of error."

Beyond that, it's unlikely the nation will ever know how many jobs are saved as a result of the stimulus. While it's clear when jobs are abolished, there's no economic gauge that tracks job preservation. The estimates are based on economic assumptions of how many jobs would be lost without the stimulus.


Irrelevant again; this does not disprove anything he said at all.

It was a ridiculous 'fact check' that had little to offer other than to disagree with Obama's spending priorities. He certainly was not factually inaccurate to any real degree.

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:07 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cyclops, you are so partisan, you should be embarrassed. Obama can't even get it right on where the car was invented, let alone trying his hand at more complicated matters of budgeting.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:07 pm
@okie,
okie wrote:

Cyclops, you are so partisan, you should be embarrassed. Obama can't even get it right on where the car was invented, let alone trying his hand at more complicated matters of budgeting.


Quit being a dunce, Okie. This childish nit-picking is ridiculous and immaterial to the matter at hand.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:09 pm
See? I've always suspected CI and Cyclop could be the same person. Same way of thinking, rationalization, denial, use of obscure sources, similar use of personal insults, while denouncing any source that they don't agree with, etc. etc. etc.

When either of you can come up with something other than your own opinion to dispute the information given though, go for it. That's what good debate is all about.

I did make an error in information I posted earlier though. I thought the House had already passed the Omnibus bill this week but in fact are still in the process of considering it. The vote may be taken today though--it is expected to be this week.

(You'll note that Cyclop said it was on line but has ignored a request for a link. I presume he'll be posting one shortly.)

Quote:
House omnibus totals more than $400 billion
By Humberto Sanchez
CongressDaily
February 24, 2009

House Democratic leaders on Monday released a $410 billion omnibus package that, if approved, would wrap up appropriations for fiscal 2009, which started Oct. 1.

The package could be considered by the House as soon as Wednesday. It includes the nine spending bills Congress has not approved.

But the measure also includes thousands of member-directed spending earmarks -- in contrast to the recently enacted $790 billion economic stimulus, which did not include any -- and would extend authorization through the end of the fiscal year for the Homeland Security Department's E-Verify program, which allows employers to check the citizenship status of employees.

Another provision would allow Cuban exiles to visit immediate family members in that nation annually, instead of only once every three years. The bill also expands the definition of "close relative" for purposes of travel, and reverses the Bush administration's 2005 regulatory impediments on the sales of food and medicine to Cuba.

The bill maintains funding for the District of Columbia's $14 million school voucher program, which originated in Bush's fiscal 2004 budget and provided D.C. schoolchildren with $7,500 scholarships for private school tuition.

The appropriation comes with strings, however: None of the funding can be used for the 2009-10 school year unless Congress passes a bill reauthorizing the program and the local D.C. government approves it. The program, dubbed the D.C. School Choice Incentive Act, expired at the end of 2008.
Republicans criticized the change. "The D.C. school choice program has provided hope for thousands of low-income children in the District of Columbia since it was established, and has been demonstrating results," House Minority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, said in a statement. He said ending the program would be "irresponsible" and "shameful."

Most federal programs are being funded by a continuing resolution, which expires March 6. It must be extended if Congress cannot pass the omnibus by then. Three of the appropriations bills were cleared in late September with the CR, including Defense, Military Construction-VA and Homeland Security.
The omnibus includes $151.8 billion for Labor-HHS Appropriations Subcommittee programs, above fiscal 2008 funding levels of $145.1 billion, and more than the $145.4 former President George W. Bush wanted. The National Institutes of Health would receive $30.3 billion for research; $17.3 billion would go for Pell Grants, and $6.6 billion for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

For programs under the Commerce-Justice-Science Appropriations Subcommittee's jurisdiction, the bill includes $57.7 billion, more than the $51.8 billion Congress provided for fiscal 2008 and the $54.1 billion requested by Bush. The measure includes $24.3 billion for scientific discovery to improve quality of life and enhance long-term economic security, such as $14.7 billion to the Commerce Department's Economic Development Administration for the Global Climate Change Mitigation Fund, to encourage businesses to use green practices.

The omnibus would provide $55 billion for Transportation-HUD Appropriations Subcommittee programs, more than the $48.8 billion provided for fiscal 2008 and above the $50.6 billion Bush sought. This portion of the bill includes $40.7 billion for highway construction and $3.9 billion for HUD's Community Development Block Grants.

The bill requires the Federal Transit Administration to develop a plan to encourage and assist transit authorities in building energy efficient facilities, and includes $4.3 million to improve road access to the Flight 93 National Memorial in Shanksville, Pa.

State-Foreign Operations Appropriations Subcommittee programs would pull in $36.6 billion. Congress provided $32.8 billion and Bush wanted $38.2 billion. This part of the package would provide $875 million for the Millennium Challenge Corporation, a Bush-favored foreign aid agency, which is $669 million below fiscal 2008 funding levels and $1.35 billion below Bush's request. This program has been cut because of slow program implementation, committee Democrats said. But the funds provided "are sufficient to move forward on new compacts," according to a statement by the committee.

The Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee portion of the bill would total $33.3 billion, above fiscal 2008's $30.9 billion and more than the $31.2 billion recommended by Bush. The bill would include $27 billion for the Energy Department and $5.4 billion for the Army Corps of Engineers, $185 billion less than the Corps received in fiscal 2008. The package also rejects Bush's proposal to double the size of the Strategic Petroleum Reserve and does not fund an initiative to reprocess spent nuclear fuel.
Interior Appropriations Subcommittee programs would receive $27.6 billion, above fiscal 2008's $26.3 billion and more than Bush's $25.6 billion request. Of the $27.6 billion, EPA would get $7.6 billion and $3 billion would go to fight wildfires.

The omnibus includes $22.7 billion for programs under the Financial Services Appropriations Subcommittee. Congress provided $20.7 billion for fiscal 2008 and Bush sought $22.3 billion. That includes $8.4 billion for the General Services Administration.

The legislation includes $20.5 billion for programs overseen by the Agriculture Appropriations Subcommittee, above fiscal 2008's $18 billion and the $18.6 billion sought by Bush. The agriculture portion includes $6.9 billion for the women, infants and children nutrition programs and $2.7 billion for USDA programs important to rural communities, including housing, water projects, community facilities and economic development efforts.

Legislative Branch Appropriations Subcommittee programs would receive $4.4 billion. In fiscal 2008 Congress provided $3.97 billion and Bush recommended $4.66 billion.
Kasie Hunt contributed to this report.
http://www.govexec.com/story_page.cfm?articleid=42107
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:13 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre wrote:

See? I've always suspected CI and Cyclop could be the same person. Same way of thinking, rationalization, denial, use of obscure sources while denouncing any source that they don't agree with, etc. etc. etc.

When either of you can come up with something other than your own opinion to dispute the information given though, go for it. That's what good debate is all about.

I did make an error in information I posted earlier though. I thought the House had already passed the Omnibus bill this week but in fact are still in the process of considering it. The vote may be taken today though--it is expected to be this week.

(You'll note that Cyclop said it was on line but has ignored a request for a link. I presume he'll be posting one shortly.)


Don't you realize that when you said the spending bill was 'already passed,' reasonable viewers would assume you were referring to the spending bill which was just passed, and is available online? And not one which has not yet been passed?

Jeez

Additionally, the 'fact check' put forth was mostly opinion and quibbling; there's no requirement to do anything other than point out the errors in their positions.

Cycloptichorn
McGentrix
 
  0  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:16 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:

Nope. I'm picking up what I know so far based on television and radio reports this morning. There will probably be something in print later on today though.


Please provide some attribution when you find it, otherwise, I'm afraid I'm going to have to remain skeptical. The entire bill is searchable online, it would be a trivial matter to provide documentation of these things people claim.

Cycloptichorn


Quote:
Jamie Dupree
Omnibus Earmarks, Part 1
By
Jamie Dupree
@ February 24, 2009 12:00 AM Permalink | Comments (9) | TrackBacks (0)
Here is just the first portion of the earmarks listed in the $410 billion Omnibus spending bill introduced by Democrats that I have been able to finally format for the internet.

These are a series of road and bridge projects. And let's remember one thing - these aren't just home state items for Democrats. There's a lot of GOP turf in here as well.

That's the dirty little secret about Washington, D.C. that both parties don't really want you to know is that when you are in the minority, you still get some pork.

Just not as much as when you are running the House and/or Senate.

-

11th Street Revitalization Project, Canton, OH $380,000
19th Avenue North Extension Project, Clinton, IA $475,000
19th Street Extension·-Redmond to Deschutes Junction (between Redmond and Bend), OR $570,000
24thSV23rd Ave Corridor Improvement, Council Bluffs, IA $237,500
4-Laning of Baldwin Road to the 1-75 Interchange, Oakland County, MI $237,500
4-Laning of Texas SH 24 (from 1-30 to the Oklahoma State Line), Paris, TX $95,000
4-laning of US 20 from the Sac-Calhoun County, Iowa line to Moville, IA $570,000
55th Street Extension, Rochester MN $475,000
7th Road Extension, Marshall County, IN $665,000
A-B Street Corridor Connector Project, WA $1,900,000
Access Ramps and Widening of Latson Road, Livingston County, MI $570,000
Advanced Bridge Safety Initiative, ME $475,000
Alemedia Road (LA 50) Intersection Improvements, St. Charles Parish, LA $285,000
Antelope Valley Transportation Improvements, Lincoln, NE $570,000
Antonio Parkway Rehabilitation, Rancho Santa Margarita, CA $95,000
Aten Road and Old County Road 111 Improvements, Imperial County, CA $712,500
Atlantic Greenway Corridor Network, Miami Beach, FL $570,000
Aurora Corridor Improvements· Phase 2, WA $475,000
Avenue of the Arts Revitalization and Streetscaping Project, PA $475,000
Barnes Crossing Road/Natchez Trace Parkway Bridge, MS $475,000
Barranquitas South Bypass (from PR 156 to PR719),. Municipality of Barranquitas, PR $95,000
Baton Rouge Riverfront Redevelopment Transportatien Improvements, LA $950,000
Belleview Bypass and Baseline Road, Marion Count}\ FL $475,000
Bellmawr Borough/Route 42 Culvert Replacement Preject, NJ $2,850,000
Bethlehem Pike Roadway and Streetscape Improvements, Springfield Township, PA $475,000
Bicycle and Pedestrian Trails of Statewide Significance, ME $475,000
Bicycle/Pedestrian Pathways Along the West Side of 189 (from 3700 North to 4200 North), Provo, UT . $427,500
Big Creek Mitigation Plan for Highway 36, TX $475,000
B-Line Trail Phase II, IN $950,000
Bluff Street Interchange at Red Hills Parkway, UT $475,000
Bluff Top Park Improvements,CA $95,000
BNMC Infrastructure Improvements Program, Buffalo, NY $237,500
Boone County Gunpowder Creek Trail System, KY $427,500
Branham Lane/Monterey Highway Rail Grade Separation, San Jose, CA $475,000
Bridge over Brandywine Creek, PA $712.50
Brush Creek at Troost Improvements, MO $475,000
Buena Vista Township, Michigan-Town Center Infrastructure and Streetscape, MI $237,500
Burnt Store Road Evacuation Route Widening Project Preliminary Design and Environmental Study, FL $380,000
Busse Woods Trail and IL Route 72 Bicycle Overpass, Elk Grove Village, IL $475.00
Butner Road/Stonewall Tell Intersection, GA $475,000
Calhoun County Highway 1 Resurfacing, IL $475,000
CampusPerimeter Transit System, Vanderburgh County, IN $522,500
Canal Street Wooster Street Widening and Infrastructure Improvements, Shelton, CT 95,000 Capitol Street Renaissance Project, MS $2,850,000
Central Expressway Auxiliary Lanes, CA $475,000
Central Riverfront Street Grid: Mehring Way Relocation, Cincinnati, OH $475,000
Chesapeake By-Pass, OH $475,000
Children's Wharf Landing Intermodal Improvements, Boston, MA $950,000
Cidra-Cayey Connector, Municipality of Cidra, PR $380,000
City of Ashland Main Street Redevelopment Project, MO $475,000
City of Haverhill Downtown Streetscape Improvements, MA $285,000
City of Hobbs, East Bypass, NM $95,000
City of San Fernando Downtown Revitalization Project, CA $285,000
Clay County Hwy 52 Reconstruction, MN $285,000
Clearview Parkway at Earhart Expressway Transportation and Drainage Upgrades, Jefferson Parish, LA $356,250
College Avenue Redesign, New Brunswick, NJ $950,000
COLT Railroad Overpass at U.S. 63, Columbia, MO $475,000
Construction of a Bicycle Path Between Lexington and Port Sanilac, Sanilac County, MI $475,000
Construction of a Full-Grade Separated Urban Diamond Interchange at US 15 and Christopher's Crossing/Monocacy Blvd, MD $285,000
Construction of a Grade Separated Interchange at SH 83 and SH 88; Arapahoe County, CO $570,000
Construction of Bridge Over Valley Creek for Loop Trail at Valley Forge Park, King of Prussia, PA $142,500
Construction of Christiansted Bypass Project and Long Bay Project, VI· $380,000
Construction of Lafayette Interchange, MO $950,000
Construction of US-95 (from Wyoming Ave. to Sagle), ID $332,500
Conversion of Outboard Detour Roadway to a Bikeway, Esplanade, NY $475,000
County Road Construction and Improvements to US-54, Liberal, KS $1,520,000
Croix Street, City of Negaunee, MI $570,000
Cumberland Parkway/US 41 Expansion, GA $950,000
Delaware Avenue Bridge, IA $475,000
Dentville ~ Jack Road Project, Copiah County, MS $475,000
Design and Construction for the Widening of US 331, Walton County, FL $237,500
Design, Engineering, and Construction of the Glen Cove Connector Road, ~Ien Cove, NY $570,000
Design, Engineering, Land Acquisition and Planning f.,r the Cross-town Connector Project at US 76, Godrey, IL $237,500
Desigl1, Engineering, Land Acquisition and Planning f.,r the Extension of Rt. 162 from Maryville towards Troy, IL $95,000
Design, Right-ot-way, and Construction for the Widening of the Choctawhatchee Bay Bridge, FL $95,000
Detroit Avenue Public Right-of-Way Improvements, OH $332,500
Downtown Revitalization, Village of Melverne, NY $380,000
Downtown Transit Circulator Streetscapes, Fort Lauderdale, FL $712,500
Downtown Transportation Improvements, City of Indianapolis, IN $475,000
Downtown Waterfront Redevelopment Access Project in Vancouver, WA $237,500
East Aztec Arterial Route, NM $308,750
East Metropolitan Corridor, Rankin County, MS $237,500
Eastern Boulevard Widening and Grade Separation (from MD At. 64 to Antietam Drive), MO $380,000
Eastgate Area Improvements, Clermont County, OH $570,000
Economic Development/Revitalization of the Rosecrans Corridor, CA $190,000
Egg Harbor City Transit Hub, NJ $237,500
Elkins Railyard Project, WV $950,000
Encinas Creek/Pacific Coast Highway 101 Bridge Replacement, CA $237,500
Environmental Impact Statement for Southern Evacuation lifeline {SELL)/US 701 Project, Georgetown and Horry Counties, SC $237,500
Expansion of Southfield Road, Southfield, MI $522,500
Extend Falcon Road from Park Lane to Veterans Drive, Altus, OK .. $427,500
Extension of MO-740 to the 1-70/Lake of the Woods Interchange, Columbia, MO $237,500
Extension of the Lawrence-Hopewell Trail, Pennington, NJ $285,000
Extension of the Riverwalk Trail, City of Danville, VA $95,000
Feasibility StUdy, Sullivan City, TX $95,000
Fennegans Lane, North Brunswick Township, NJ' $332,500
Galveston Seawall, TX $95,000
Garden Parkway, Gaston County, NC $380,000
Garrison Avenue Streetscaping, AR $950,000
Gilmerton Bridge Replacement, VA $237,500
Golden Gate Bridge Moveable Median Barrier, San Francisco, CA $950,000
Green County Route 9W/81 Intersection Rehabilitation and Traffic Reduction Project, NY $712,000
Grove Road Bridge Replacement, Castle Shannon, PA $570,000
Hagerstown Area Northeast By-Pass Project, MD $95,000
Hastings Bridge, MN $1,900,000
Hattiesburg 4th Street Improvements, MS $1,900,000
Heartland Expressway Corridor Development and Management Study, NE $475,000
Heim Bridge Replacement, Alameda Corridor Transportation Authority, CA $380,000
High Line Project, New York, NY $237,500
High Point Greenways Project, High Point, NC $95,000
Highway 140 Improvements, Jackson County, OR $95,000
Highway 169/1-494 Interchange Improvements, MN $475,000
Highway 217 Improvements, Beaverton, OR $475.00
Highway 55 Hurricane Evacuation Corridor Study, AL $570,000
Highway 64: Vilonia Bypass, AR $237,500
Hillsborough County Hillsborough Avenue Beautification Project, FL $237,500
Hudson River Waterfront Walkway, NJ $475,000
Hwy 29 at Elizabeth Street Interchange Construction, Danville, VA $95,000
Hwy 50/Missouri Flat -Western Placerville Interchange ImprovementlWeber Creek Bridge Upgrade, CA $570,000
I-10 New Orleans East Upgrades, LA $190,000
I-10 Pecue Lane Interchange, Baton Rouge, LA $475,000
I-10 Southwest Frontage Road Design and Construction (between LA 433 and US 190B), LA $175,750
I-12 Interchange at LA 1088, St. Tammany Parish, LA $237,500
I-12 Interchange at LA-16, Denham Springs, LA $950,000
I-20/59 Interchange, Lauderdale County, MS $570,000
I-278 Environmental Shield, NY $475,000
I-295/76/42 Direct Connection, NJ $2,850,000
I-295/Meadowville Road Interchange, VA $475,000
I-49 South, LA $1,900,000
I-5 to Hwy. 99W Connector, OR $1,852,500
I-555 Floodway Access Road. AR $2,375,000
I-69, Shreveport, LA $1,900,000
I-69, TN $475,000
I-80 Intermodal Corridor Study -Oakland, CA to Utah Stateline, UT $950,000
I-93 Kalispell Bypass, MT $2,850,000
I-95/U.S. Highway 301 Interchange Project, Orangeburg County, SC $95,000
IH 30 at SH 34 and Monty Stratton Parkway Initiative, TX $570,000
Illinois pedestrian and bicycling road and trail improvements and enhancements, It $2,850,000
Improvements to US Highway 41 in Outagamie County, WI $380.00
Improvements to US Route 1 for access to York County Community College. ME $475,000
Improving the West Bank RiverFront, IL $475,000
Indian River Inlet Bridge, DE $1,900,000
Interchange and Bypass Construction, Kearney, NE $570,000
Interchange Planning and Design at I-65/County Road and 750 North, Johnson County, IN $237,500
International Drive Extension/Folsom South Canal Bridge, CA $237,500
Intersection Improvements on US 212 and US 81 and Improvements to US 81,8D $950,000
Intersection Safety Improvements, Olympia Fields, It $475,000
Interstate 10 Improvements Project (from I-8 to Picacho Peak), AZ $95,000
Interstate 430/630: Interchange Modification, AR $2,850,000
Interstate 69/Great River Bridge: Highway 65, MS Highway 1, AR $2,850,000
Interstate 75/Collier Boulevard/SR 84 Interchange Improvements, FL $570,000
Kanawha Trestle Rail-Trail Project, WV $1,900,000
Kapkowski Road Transportation Planning Area/North Avenue Corridor, NJ $380,000
LA-1 Goldenmeadow to Port Fourchon, LA $1,021,250
Lemon Grove Lighting Project, CA $285,000
Lewis and Clark Legacy Trail, NO $326,563
Light Rail Corridor Improvements Study, Chula Vista, CA $237,500
Little Bay Bridges/Spaulding Turnpike, NH $1,900,000
Little Venice Road Improvement Project: Phase II, Marathon, FL $95,000
Locust Creek Bridge Replacement (at Hwy 36 West), Carroll County, KY $95,000
Longfellow Bridge Approach Gateway, Cambridge, MA $950,000
Los Banos Bypass on State Route 152, CA $950,000
Lowry Avenue Bridge Replacement, Minneapolis, MN $475,000
Main Street Improvements and Downtown Revitalization, Las Cruces, NM $522,500
Main Street Mu/timodal Access and Revitalization Project, NY $950,000
Main Street Streetscape Improvements Project, Boyertown. PA $475,000
Maintenance of the Washington Bridge (Rt. 47 Bridge) over the Missouri River, Washington. MO $285,000
Manatee-Sarasota Counties Intelligent Transportation System (ITS) Project, FL $475,000
Martha Avell-76 Connector, Akron, OH $1,187,500
Maryland Scenic Byways, MD $118,750
Massillon Road Bridge Improvement, Summit County, oH $475,000
McKinley/Riverside Avenues Safety Improvement Project, Muncie, IN $950,000
Meacham Road Toll-way Access Ramps, Schaumburg,lL $475,000
Medical Campus Access Road from Highway 231 to Wolf Creek Road, Pell City, AL $475,000
Melboume Airport Access Road and Interchange, Melbourne, Ft $1,003,865
Metro Gold Line Foothill Extension Transit Oriented Development Project, CA $237,500
Mexico Technology Park, MO $950,000
Midtown Cultural District Streetscape, Baltimore, MD $475,000
Mile 1 from Bus 83 to Mile 8, Hidalgo County, TX $665,000
Miller Road Widening, McHenry, IL $475,000
Milwaukee Avenue Revitalization Program, IL $475,000
Mineral Point and Junction Road Intersection, Madison, WI $332,500
Mississippi Drive Corridor, Muscatine, IA $475,000
Mt. Erie-Golden Gate Rd Resurfacing and Expansion, Wayne County, IL $190,000
Multi-use Recreational Trail at High Bridge State Park in Prince Edward County, VA $237,500
MurrayAthletic Center at Elmira College Access Road Improvements, Chemung County, NY $570,000
Nebraska Highway 35 (from Norfolk to South Sioux City), NE $380,000
Nellie Hill Bridge Replacement, Dover, NY $237,500
NETEX Rail Rehabilitation Initiative, TX $95,000
New Hampshire Department of Transportation, U.S. Route 4 Red List Bridge Repair, West Lebanon, NH $617,500
Newberg-Dundee Transportation Improvement Project, Yamhill County, OR $237,500
Newton County Rails to Trails By-Pass Tunnel, GA $142,500
Newton County Rails to Trails Right of Way Purchase, GA $622,250
Newton County Rails to Trails Yellow River Bridges, GA $232,750
North Parkway Safety Improvement Project, WA $475,000
Northwest Loop Access Road, Sandoval County, NM $617,500
Obed Bridge Replacement, Navajo County,AZ $190,000
Ocmulgee River Corridor, GA $95,000
Offside Roadway Traffic, Safety and Parking Improvements, Fairfield, CT $95,000
Old Allentown Streetscape Improvements, PA $475,000
PA 924 and Interstate 81 Interchange Improvements, PA $950,000
Park Avenue and Markland Avenue Intersection Improvement Project, Kokomo, IN $1,235,000
Park Avenue Multi-Use Trail, ME $760,000
Park Street Pedestrian Safety Transportation Improvements, Alameda, CA $475,000
Parking and Street Enhancements at Historic Yellow Springs, Chester Springs, PA $142,500
Pedestrian and School Children Safety Project, PA $190,000
Pedestrian Bridge Connecting South Knoxville Waterfront and the University of Tennessee at Knoxville, TN $570,000
Pedestrian/Bicycle Recreation Trail Over the Tuscarwaras River Along the Ohio and Erie Canalway Recreation Trails, Stark County, OH $475,000
Pennsylvania High-Speed Maglev Development Program, PA $950,000
Perry Square Streetscaping, Erie, PA $380,000
Pinetop-Lakeside Bridge Widening Project, AZ $190,000
Pinon Hills Boulevard East and Animas River Bridge, NM $895,375
Potomac Stree11mprovement, WV $1,425,000
Preliminary Design and Environmental Study for US 63 Improvements (Osage, Maries, and Phelps Counties), MO $332,500
Preliminary Engineering for the Interstate 95/ US Route 17 Interchange Project, Spotsylvania County, VA $95,000
Prophecy Creek Park Entrance Project, PA $237,500
Puyallup Shaw Road Extension Project, Puyallup, W A $237,500
Raleigh County Airport, WV $1,045,000
Reconstruction and Replacement of the 1-244 Bridge over the Arkansas River, Tulsa, OK $380,000
Reconstruction and Upgrade of 2300 West between 1900 South and 2100 North, Leht, UT $1,235,000
Reconstruction and Widening of SH-349, Martin and Dawson Counties, TX $475,000
Reconstruction of Roosevelt Road, Village of Broadview, IL $570,000
Reconstruction of the 1-44 Bridge Over 163rd Street (Including the Interchange), Tulsa, OK $570,000
Red Town Road/U.S. 171 Intersection Realignment, Leesville (Vernon Parish), LA $570,000
Relocation and Widening of SR 113 (from Old Alabama Rd to SR 61 South of Cartersville), GA $190,000
Relocation of Intersection FM 359 and Mason Road, TX $475,000
Reno Rail Access Corridor Enhancements, Reno, NV $285,000
Replacement of US·159 Bridge at Rulo, NE $1,140,000
Resurfacing, Repair and Improvements to C-470/lnterchange Replacement at US 85, CO $475,000
Revitalization and Development of the General Business District, Inc. Village of Cedarhurst, NY $142,500
River Des Peres Boulevard Improvements, St. Louis, MO $237,500
Road Construction, Hidalgo County, TX $522,500
Roadway Improvements for the Clemson University Advanced Materials Center, Anderson County, SC $285,000
Roadway Improvements to Fairchild Road and Hare Street, FL $95,000
Robstown Trade Processing and Inland· Center, Robstown, TX $237,500
Ronald Reagan Parkway (Middle and Southern segments), Boone County, IN $570,000
Route 120 Corridor, Lake County, IL $950,000
Route 32 Safety Improvements in Cedar County, MO $475,000
Route 5 Bridge Reconstruction, CT $712,500
Route 6 Improvements, Peekskill, NY $665,000
Route 61 Corridor Study and Engineering, Lincoln and St. Charles Counties, MO $190,000
Route 8, Duncan Avenue to Wildwood Road, PA $950,000
Rulo Bridge Replacement Project, NE $95,000
Safe Routes for Seniors and Kids Programs, NY $712,500
Salt Fork of the Red River Bridge Martha Crossing, OK $1,425,000
Salters Road Expansion Along 1-85, GreenVille, SC $95,000
SC 9 Interchange Improvements, Spartanburg, SC $285,000
SC Hwy 98 and SC Hwy 160 Connector, SC $712,500
SH 171 and FM 2231 Traffic Signal, TX $118,750
Shoal Creek Pedestrian Bridge, CA $570,000
Sidewalk and Street Milling, Repair and Resurfacing, Sweetwater, FL $475,000
Sidewalk Construction in Ashland and Cherryland, CA $475,000
Sidewalk Improvements, Williamstown, VT $190,000
Signalization Improvements, Elizabeth, NJ . $475,000
Sistrunk Boulevard Revitalization and Enhancement Project, FL $475,000
Slide Repair Work along US 60 in Eastem Kanawha County, WV $4,750,000
SR 23/US 101 Freeway Interchange Project, CA $427,500
SR 426/CR 419 Improvements, Orlando, FL $285,000
SR 46 Regional Evacuation Route, FL $570,000
SR-47 Port Access Expressway, CA . $237,500
SRB9 Mousehole Improvement Project, Truckee, CA $380,000
St. Albans Streetscape, VT $380,000
Starkweather Creek Parkway Bike Path, WI $950,000
State 'Road (SR) 80 in Hendry County, FL $475,000
State Road 87 PD and E Expansion, FL $475,000
State Route 13 from Route 24 to County Road 113, Lafayette County, MO $475,000
State Route 180 East, CA $1,330,000
State Route 71 expansion from SR·60 to 1-10, Pomona, CA $475,000
State Routes 52 and 67 Interchange Improvements! CA $380,000
Street Rehabilitation, Hialeah, FL $570,000
Street Widening, Grandview Heights, OH $237,500
Sun Valley Lighting Project, CA $285,000
Sunport Extension to Broadway Blvd, Albuquerque, NM $95,000
SW 9th Avenue Widening--Main Sf. to US69175, Durant, OK $380,000
Tabler Station Business Park: Utilities, Transportation and TechnolOgy Infrastructure, WV $332,500
Thorn Run Road Interchange Upgrade, Moon Township, PA $95,000
Town of Sherman Roadway and Traffic Improvements, MS $950,000
Traffic Light -Piedmont Road and Edmond Road, OK $95,000
Traffic Signal Modernization, City of Lakewood, CA $475,000
Traffic Signal Modernization, Utica, NY $475,000
Trunk Highway 65 Pedestrian Bridge Replacement at 49th Avenue, Columbia Heights, MN $475,000
Tucker Boulevard Bridge, MO $332,500
U.S. 101 Safety Improvements at Deer Park, WA $931,000
U.S. 12 Safety Improvements, WA $2,850,000
U.S. 17 Widening, FL $1,900,000
U.S. 61 Bypass, Hannibal, MO $237,500
U.S. 61 Fort Madison Bypass Interchange at Highway J40, IA $950,000
U.S. Highway 51/Elvis Presley Boulevard Presley Blvd Improvements, TN $475,000
U.S. Highway 59 Safety Improvements, MN $950,000
Universal Street Railroad Overpass Project, NC $950,000
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign Campus Street Extension, IL $570,000
University Parkway, Vanderburgh County, IN $760,000
University Place Pedestrian Overpass, WA $475,000
Upgrade and Partly Relocate MO Rt 141, St Louis County, MO $237,500
Upgrade of Alum Creek Drive at 1-270 and at Groveport Road, Franklin County, OH $570,000 Urban Collector Project, MS $475,000
Urban Collector Road along 1-10 North, MS $1,900,000
US 113 Safety and Traffic Improvements, Worcester County, MD $237,500
US 17 Bridge Construction in the Hardee City Line/CR 634 Segment, Hardee Cnty, FL $332,500
US 17/Dominion Blvd Widening (Cedar Rd to Great Bridge Blvd) and Drawbridge Replacement (over Atlantic Intercoastal Waterway), Chesapeake, VA $237,500
US 190 (US 11 to LA 433) Widening, Slidell, LA $237,500
US 34 Bridge, Mills County. IA $427,500
US 422 River Crossing Complex Project, King of Prussia, PA $237,500
US 74 Monroe Bypass, Mecklenburg and Union Counties, NC $237,500
US Highway 30 Improvements, Whiteside County, Il $475,000
US Highway 51 Improvement Project. DeForest, WI $380,000
US Highway 69 Corridor Study, KS $950,000
US Hwy 19 Storm water Mitigation Project at Southfork near Homosassa, Citrus Cnty, Fl $380,000
US Hwy 49/82 Mississippi.Hwy 7 Connector Road project, Greenwood, MS $380,000
US Route 64, TN $1,425,000
US-191, Moab to CrescentJunction, UT $1,900,000
US-401 Widening in Cumberland, Harnett, and Wake Counties, NC $237,500
Veterans Boulevard Project, Fresno County, GA $570,000
Veteran's Memorial Bridge, Fallston Bridge,PA $475,000
Vienna Sidewalk Construction, Vienna, VA $237,500
Warren, OH Greenway Bike Trail, OH $332,500
West Main Street Streetscape Phase II, CT $237,500
West Virginia Route 10, WV $4,750,000
West Virginia Route 9, WV $6,650.00
West Vista Way Widening (from Melrose Drive to the east of Thunder Drive). Vista, CA $570,000
Western Kentucky University (WKU), University-Community Bikeway Project, KY $950,000
Whiterock Sustainable Trail, Guthrie County, IA $380,000
Widen SR 1306 and SR 1363 (Mebane Street) from SR 1158 to NC 54, Burlington, NC $427,500
Widen US 17 in Charleston County from the Isle of Palms Connector toa point at or near Darrell Creek Trail, Mt. Pleasant. SC $380,000
Widening of Rakow Road, McHenry County. IL $570,000
Widening of Route 50, Ross County, OH $475,000
Widening of US Hwy 221 Between Hunter/Fleming-Smith Industrial City of the City of Laurens, Laurens, SC $285,000
Woodland Trail Project, WA $475.000
Wyoming 59 Improvements (from Gillette toWright), Campbell County, WY $95,000
York County Central Corridor Improvements, ME $475,000
Zanesville State Street Bridge Renovation and Repair Project, OH $475,000


Quote:
Hill staffer Tom Jones is going through the omnibus spending bill with a fine-tooth comb, and Twittering his earmark findings, including:

* $200,000 for “Tattoo Removal Violence Prevention Outreach Program,” pg. 283;

*Maine lobster earmark in the omnibus, pg. 173;

*$5.8 million earmark for the “Ted Kennedy Institute for the Senate…for the planning and design of a building & an endowment,” pg. 232;

*and National Council of La Raza, $473,000 earmark from Sens. Bingaman and Menendez, pg. 212.


Just a few of the examples...
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:18 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:

See? I've always suspected CI and Cyclop could be the same person. Same way of thinking, rationalization, denial, use of obscure sources while denouncing any source that they don't agree with, etc. etc. etc.

When either of you can come up with something other than your own opinion to dispute the information given though, go for it. That's what good debate is all about.

I did make an error in information I posted earlier though. I thought the House had already passed the Omnibus bill this week but in fact are still in the process of considering it. The vote may be taken today though--it is expected to be this week.

(You'll note that Cyclop said it was on line but has ignored a request for a link. I presume he'll be posting one shortly.)


Don't you realize that when you said the spending bill was 'already passed,' reasonable viewers would assume you were referring to the spending bill which was just passed, and is available online? And not one which has not yet been passed?

Jeez


I admit I erred in when the bill was passed. But I did say appropriations bill. I know the difference between an appropriations bill and the stimulus package. And I know that the stimulus package was not something that the pundits are just now getting their first look at. Do you?

But what appropriations bill is on line that was just recentlypassed? Or will you admit that you didn't know what you were talking about?

Quote:
Additionally, the 'fact check' put forth was mostly opinion and quibbling; there's no requirement to do anything other than point out the errors in their positions.

Cycloptichorn


Can I use that line whenever I question something you or anybody else posts? You promise you will not ask me to back up my opinion that the information is wrong ever again?
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:23 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre wrote:
What do you think the odds are that he will think $200,000 for tattoo removal is an unnecessary expense especially in the midst of an economic meltdown and crisis?


No. 1: I can't find the described "earmark" for tattoo removal in the online bill. Perhaps you can tell us how to find these earmarks.

No. 2: The bill is intended, in part, to assist the unemployed. I understand that many former gang members cannot find jobs due to gang-related tattoos. If tattoo removal assists these people to obtain gainful employment, then the allocation cannot be identified as "pork" because it is consistent with the legislative intent to assist the unemployed.
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:24 pm
@McGentrix,
Recession? What recession? I'm sure many of these are worthy projects and some may even be really necessary. But how many need to be done right now when we are already drowning in red ink?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:24 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Quote:
OBAMA: "And I believe the nation that invented the automobile cannot walk away from it."

THE FACTS: Depends what your definition of automobiles, is. According to the Library of Congress, the inventor of the first true automobile was probably Germany's Karl Benz, who created the first auto powered by an internal combustion gasoline engine, in 1885 or 1886. In the U.S., Charles Duryea tested what library researchers called the first successful gas-powered car in 1893. Nobody disputes that Henry Ford created the first assembly line that made cars affordable.



Pointless Quibbling, the US has as much claim on the auto as anyone and we certainly made the auto industry happen from the ground up.

Not only "quibbling," but Ford was the first to mass produce cars by assembly line production.

Quote:
OBAMA: "We have known for decades that our survival depends on finding new sources of energy. Yet we import more oil today than ever before."

THE FACTS: Oil imports peaked in 2005 at just over 5 billion barrels, and have been declining slightly since. The figure in 2007 was 4.9 billion barrels, or about 58 percent of total consumption. The nation is on pace this year to import 4.7 billion barrels, and government projections are for imports to hold steady or decrease a bit over the next two decades.

Quibbling over tiny percentages, but in fact this is one of the better sourced arguments made here.

Those are not "facts." They are opinions on future imports. The issue is not past or projected oil imports; it's about "finding new sources of energy."


Quote:
OBAMA: "We have already identified $2 trillion in savings over the next decade."

THE FACTS: Although 10-year projections are common in government, they don't mean much. And at times, they are a way for a president to pass on the most painful steps to his successor, by putting off big tax increases or spending cuts until someone else is in the White House.

Obama only has a real say on spending during the four years of his term. He may not be president after that and he certainly won't be 10 years from now.

Irrelevant. This does not challenge what Obama said at all.

That's a very funny quote coming from conservatives when in fact Bush transferred this financial crisis and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan to the next president. If Obama doesn't act on this financial crisis, this financial crisis will extend to the next several presidents. Jobs are being lost at new highs, and that also affects home ownership.


Quote:
OBAMA: "Regulations were gutted for the sake of a quick profit at the expense of a healthy market. People bought homes they knew they couldn't afford from banks and lenders who pushed those bad loans anyway. And all the while, critical debates and difficult decisions were put off for some other time on some other day."

THE FACTS: This may be so, but it isn't only Republicans who pushed for deregulation of the financial industries. The Clinton administration championed an easing of banking regulations, including legislation that ended the barrier between regular banks and Wall Street banks. That led to a deregulation that kept regular banks under tight federal regulation but extended lax regulation of Wall Street banks. Clinton Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, later an economic adviser to candidate Obama, was in the forefront in pushing for this deregulation.

Irrelevant, Obama did not specifically blame Republicans at all. This disproves nothing he said.

ha ha ha ha...the party of less government intervention is now blaming the democrats for less regulation. There's no end to the conservative chutzah.
FACT: It's during the Bush and republican congress for six years that did nothing. Both Bush and McCain claimed "our economy is fundamentally strong" just a few months before all hell broke lose. Bush was still president.


Quote:
OBAMA: "Thanks to our recovery plan, we will double this nation's supply of renewable energy in the next three years."

THE FACTS: While the president's stimulus package includes billions in aid for renewable energy and conservation, his goal is unlikely to be achieved through the recovery plan alone.

In 2007, the U.S. produced 8.4 percent of its electricity from renewable sources, including hydroelectric dams, solar panels and windmills. Under the status quo, the Energy Department says, it will take more than two decades to boost that figure to 12.5 percent.

If Obama is to achieve his much more ambitious goal, Congress would need to mandate it. That is the thrust of an energy bill that is expected to be introduced in coming weeks.

Irrelevant, this does not disprove anything he said at all. It merely says that he needs to get the energy bill passed he SPECIFICALLY asked for last night.

It's not supposed to rely only on the stimulus plan; that's the whole idea of the stimulus plan; to let commerce take over once they get a foothold into the development of renewable energy.

Quote:
OBAMA: "Over the next two years, this plan will save or create 3.5 million jobs."

THE FACTS: This is a recurrent Obama formulation. But job creation projections are uncertain even in stable times, and some of the economists relied on by Obama in making his forecast acknowledge a great deal of uncertainty in their numbers.

The president's own economists, in a report prepared last month, stated, "It should be understood that all of the estimates presented in this memo are subject to significant margins of error."

Beyond that, it's unlikely the nation will ever know how many jobs are saved as a result of the stimulus. While it's clear when jobs are abolished, there's no economic gauge that tracks job preservation. The estimates are based on economic assumptions of how many jobs would be lost without the stimulus.

Irrelevant again; this does not disprove anything he said at all.

It was a ridiculous 'fact check' that had little to offer other than to disagree with Obama's spending priorities. He certainly was not factually inaccurate to any real degree.


There is no magic number, but it's pretty safe to say that most Americans or the consumers of the stimulus plan "needs to hear some numbers" for it to have some meaning. Obama can't very well say, "we don't have a number," when the whole idea of the stimulus plan "is" to save jobs.

If you understood anything about economics and statistics, you would understand the difficulty of trying to come up with accurate numbers when a) we have no experience in trying to reverse the trend in job losses numbering in the hundreds of thousands every month, and b) there is no past experience that duplicates the current situation.





0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:25 pm
@Debra Law,
Debra Law wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:
What do you think the odds are that he will think $200,000 for tattoo removal is an unnecessary expense especially in the midst of an economic meltdown and crisis?


No. 1: I can't find the described "earmark" for tattoo removal in the online bill. Perhaps you can tell us how to find these earmarks.

No. 2: The bill is intended, in part, to assist the unemployed. I understand that many former gang members cannot find jobs due to gang-related tattoos. If tattoo removal assists these people to obtain gainful employment, then the allocation cannot be identified as "pork" because it is consistent with the legislative intent to assist the unemployed.


I can't find the on line bill. Would you please post the link?

And I can't qualify for certain jobs because I'm too old or too fat or too something. Will the govenrment pay for plastic surgery, a good spa, or whatever else I need to qualify for the job I want? A worthy enterprise if I am unemployed and a drain on the national treasury for sure, but would you consider that part of the legislative intent to assist with the unemployed. Or would that be pork?

(A more MAC approach would suggest that I take whatever work I can find--those tattoos aren't disqualifying those ex-gang members from all gainful employment--and I should save up enough for my own cosmetic adjustments and qualify myself for the job I want. It should not be DebraLaw's or anybody elses responsibility or burden to provide me with that.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:26 pm
@Foxfyre,
If you specifically point out which parts you think need greater attribution or argumentation, I will be happy to provide it, Fox. I think my answers are just fine as they are written, for the original accusations sucked in their accuracy.

McG, thank you for posting that link.

In the future please do not try and blame your errors for others' misunderstanding of what you are trying to say, Fox. It matters not to me if you want to quibble about the usage of the word Appropriation vs. stimulus, for that is ultimately boring.

Cycloptichorn
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 02:41 pm
@Foxfyre,
Better yet...if we are going to be forced to spend federal money to get ex gang members jobs....let's let the gang member get a line on the job he wants and is qualified for, and then let a government emissary go with him to vouch for him, offer the employer an incentive to hire him, on the condition that the gang member use his first paycheck to have his tattoo removed. At least that way we would know that we got a job out of the money expended.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:13 pm
Gov. Bobby Jindall, in the Rep reply, made a complete fool of himself.

First, he came across as a weak little kid, hardly a commanding presence. Second, he spoke about a train from LA to Vegas involving a levitating train, when neither the law nor O's speech provides for any train plying that route. Third, he denigrated the federal govt., saying that it could not help our situation. Every economist says this is ridiculous. He made other statements that bordered on the absurd.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:17 pm
@Advocate,
Gov. Jindfall was absurd; he and Sarah Palin are the conservative's leading contenders for their next president.

Absurd.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:26 pm
ECONOMY -- JINDAL OFFERS RESPONSE TO OBAMA AFTER DENYING 25,000 LOUISIANA RESIDENTS UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE: Gov. Bobby Jindal (R-LA) offered the Republican response to President Obama's address last night, in which Jindal "defended the virtues of small government that he said even his own party had abandoned in recent years." Last Friday, Jindal announced that he would reject roughly $100 million in unemployment assistance from the federal recovery package, claiming the temporary unemployment aid would eventually lead to a tax hike on businesses. Jindal's decision ensured that at least 25,000 unemployed Louisiana residents would not be eligible for unemployment insurance. However, in 2005, as a congressman representing Louisiana, he co-sponsored a bill extending temporary unemployment insurance -- similar to the type he now opposes -- to those who found themselves unemployed in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. Further, as the Wonk Room reported yesterday, in Louisiana 430 people lose their jobs every day.

[Please tell me how the Republican party can have a future in light of this performance.]

--americanprogressaction.org
0 Replies
 
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:29 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

If you specifically point out which parts you think need greater attribution or argumentation, I will be happy to provide it, Fox. I think my answers are just fine as they are written, for the original accusations sucked in their accuracy.

McG, thank you for posting that link.

In the future please do not try and blame your errors for others' misunderstanding of what you are trying to say, Fox. It matters not to me if you want to quibble about the usage of the word Appropriation vs. stimulus, for that is ultimately boring.

Cycloptichorn


Exactly, Cycloptichorn. Foxfyre won't accept responsibility for her own erroneous post and accuses others of being stupid. After all, Foxfyre claims she's the only one here smart enough to know the difference between an "appropriations" bill and a "stimulus" bill. Rolling Eyes

The recovery and reinvestment act "appropriated" billions of dollars to be spent for a multitude of purposes. Foxfyre was clearly referring to the bill that was passed by "Pelosi and company" when she was scoffing about the alleged earmarks.

There were no "earmarks" in the bill--at least none that I could find by searching.

LINKS TO BILL, Parts A & B
JamesMorrison
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:32 pm
@Foxfyre,
If the AP's demonstration of skepticism is a harbinger of things to come, this would mark a turning point in voter education. Perhaps, there is hope for us MAC's and, therefore, the country itself! I've always thought that, given a balanced view of issues and solution sets for their resolution, Americans will make the right choices. MAC's should continue to post these ear marks until regular voters are educated and become tired of all the pork coming from Congress. MAC's should politely and constantly hammer away at this. 2010 can't come too soon.

I propose that no politician be allowed to speak to the press live. All comments and speeches would be taped and only released after the new government agency, known as the DLGR (Dept of "Let's Get Real"), fact checks the content and provides truthful revisions if needed. We could then run the tape of the politicians' words concurrent with the truth. Perhaps like those speeches aired where there is a person in a little box in one of the corners of the screen, you know, like they use for ASL for the deaf.

Some questions:

1. Doesn't the Constitution charge members of Congress with the duty of passing laws and appropriations for the good of the whole country or is it still constitutional to stoop to parochialism?

2. C.I. and Cyclops:

What's the deal? Are you channeling each other?

JM
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Feb, 2009 03:35 pm
@Debra Law,
Debra Law wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

If you specifically point out which parts you think need greater attribution or argumentation, I will be happy to provide it, Fox. I think my answers are just fine as they are written, for the original accusations sucked in their accuracy.

McG, thank you for posting that link.

In the future please do not try and blame your errors for others' misunderstanding of what you are trying to say, Fox. It matters not to me if you want to quibble about the usage of the word Appropriation vs. stimulus, for that is ultimately boring.

Cycloptichorn


Exactly, Cycloptichorn. Foxfyre won't accept responsibility for her own erroneous post and accuses others of being stupid. After all, Foxfyre claims she's the only one here smart enough to know the difference between an "appropriations" bill and a "stimulus" bill. Rolling Eyes


Well I had not made that claim that I was the ONLY one who knows the difference, but I do know the difference. You linked to the stimulus bill not the appropriations bill. Do YOU know the difference?

Quote:
The recovery and reinvestment act "appropriated" billions of dollars to be spent for a multitude of purposes. Foxfyre was clearly referring to the bill that was passed by "Pelosi and company" when she was scoffing about the alleged earmarks.


Obviously? Then why would I have made a point to draw the distinction between the stimulus package and the appropriations bills. Again I know the difference between the stimulus package and the appropriations bill or bills that we are discussing. Do you?

Quote:
There were no "earmarks" in the bill--at least none that I could find by searching.
\

If you are referring to the stimulus package, then I agree. Nothing that could be identified as an earmark. Just HUGE leeway for earmarks to be included in the appropriations bills to follow as the money is distributed.



This one I had already. I was looking for the text of the appropriations bill which Cyclop said was on line and which you said was on line and I suppose, like him, you are now going to whine that I didn't make that clear and that ANYBODY would think that when I said appropriations bill I meant stimulus package.
 

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