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Another relationship going bad

 
 
Reply Mon 25 Feb, 2008 11:52 am
I hope someone can give me some insight on my situation. My wife and I have been married for 8 years and have two great children. But, in the last year or so things had been getting very tense. She started to go out often with friends I never met. She wanted to her independence, was her statement and to feel free to do things on her own accord. She moved to new city and had no friends at the time we first got married and didn't have a job either. She made a lot of sacrifices at the beginning of our marriage to come live with me.

She grew up in a very restrictive household and I was her first and only boyfriend. We got married and at the same time I started a new job hic was quite taxing because of the commute. She gave 100 % at the time to our marriage and me. I on the other was not equally respondent. But, I wanted to make it up to her once I got settled with my job. But, 6 months into our marriage she was pregnant with our first child, it was by an accident. I was not ready for this, or had planned to a have child so soon. I wanted to get settled and be in a sound financial situtation before bringing a child into this world.

My focus changed dramatically and I start focusing on the welfare of our child and less so on the emotionally needs of my wife. So went up and down, but she hung in there with. We then had our second child, planned this time and I just really focused on the kids more so then her. I was not abusive to her, I was very affectionate. But, I was doing some the romantic things with her that would have showed how much I appreciate her.

Anyway after our second child, things started to go downhill with her. She was on the chat rooms to late hours of the night. We were not sleeping in the same bed because of the baby. We felt it was important that child was with us rather than a crib. I started to see a pattern of her ignoring me and doing her own thing.

I had helped her get another job that was more conducive to raising a family. She was working shift work before. Also I thought she would make friends there since it was now 9 to 5. She did make friends and started to go out once and while with them. I encouraged that because I thought it important she have her own friends, rather then always hanging around with mine.

It also occurred to me that I had had been ignoring her for so long and I need to bring back some of the intimacy and romance she never really got from me. I made attempts, but she ignored and wanted to go out with her friends. The more she started to go out with her friends, no more suspcisious I got. Finally, I caught her in a lie and found out she was not going out with her coworkers but some guy, whom wouldn't tell was. She apologized and said it was stupid and would never happen again. I was angry and it took time and I forgave here and tried to carry on.

A few months later I started to see a similar pattern and this time I recorded a conversation with here and a guy. This time talking about where their relationship was heading. I of course was fumed. But, we talked and talked and argued and talked. And I admitted I should not have ignored her and I would do everything to work on this relationship. I would plan romantic get aways and surprises and we would things together. All I asked in return was her being honest with me and tell me the truth and if anything was bothering her to talk to me. I asked if there were any guy friends I should know about, so I don't get suspicious to tell me now. She told me who they were and I was ok with that. I also asked to see her emails to prove to me that this relationship was nothing more than an attention gatherer, she said no and said it was an invasion of her privacy. I said this would help me deal with the situation and if the emails were indeed nothing than she shouldn't have to worry about anything. She still said no. Finally, after two days she came up to me and said I could see them after she had deleted most of the emails. Well, I thought that was useless. But, I still trusted and we both agreed to start working on the relationship.

Three months later, doing everything I could to make her feel special she started acting up again. This time she said it was due to work and she was sorry to ignoring and yelling at me. I took it in the chin and made every effort to make sure she got her work done. What I failed to mention, is the job allowed her to work at home. One day I got suspicious again cause see called me home early to look after the kids, because she had a very important meeting she couldn't miss. I reluctantly agreed because I was overwelhemed at work as well. But, I did it for her. The thing that bothered me was there was a snow storm and the roads were not in great shape and most people were advised to stay and home.

So, I suggested why you had to go out. Just call and rescheduled for the next day. She was adamant that she had to go. So Placed a tape recorder in her car and low and behold she met up with another "friend" for the afternoon to take him to the doctor. Well, as you can see I have lost it. I don't know what to do. I can forgive her for lying to me and move past it, but the now that remains was she intimate with these friends. I can not stand that, she of course swears on our kids lives that there was nothing going on sexually. But, she swore on their hads that last time that there are no other friends too. I can not believe a word she says anymore. She deleted everything on her phone and emails.

I am tired of this, I want to continue on for the sake of the kids. But this image will not fade from my mind and how am i to trust her again. Never once did she say I would never do this to you or the kids. She just defended her stance and said how dare I thing of here as a whore. She admits she lied , but nothing more.

Can you please give some insight on what I should do. I asked to she a marriage counsellor and she refused because she doesn't want text book thrown at her. Also, she feels she can move and work on the relationship, but I have to del with my issues on my own if I can't trust her words. I have been unable to eat and sleep properly for the last 2 weeks. Everytime I try to talk to her she, goes "not again!!" what do you want me to do.

Thanks
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 1,013 • Replies: 15
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CannibalCrowley
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Feb, 2008 12:48 pm
I'd start with paternity tests. All you'll have to do is cheek swab yourself and the kids and then send the kit off to the lab.
0 Replies
 
Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Feb, 2008 02:46 pm
Confusedtur--

Welcome to A2K--

Evidently your marriage has been going downhill for a long time.

You and your wife haven't been able to solve your differences through talking. You do not trust her. She doesn't trust you.

I suggest that you see a marriage counselor. If your wife can't go with you, go for individual counseling. A trained outsider can give you an objective view of what is going on and help you decide what is the best way to deal with the situation.

Good luck.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Feb, 2008 04:40 pm
I'd disengage. Tell her something along the line of "If you decide that you want to be married to me and are willing to be honest with me I will work with you on our marriage, until then I am done" Talk to her only if she comes to you except about the critical matters such as the kids and finances. When ever you can find other things to do and other people to be with. When you are supposed to be handling the kids and she is home pack them up and go out. Don't sleep with her, don't touch her. Change your routine, pick up new habits. To the extent possible with out disrupting the kids, when she makes hints about doing something together tell her that you would rather not.

This is a recalibration of sorts, as restart at square one. You both need to get back to the same table again and lay your cards on the table. This would consist of you both deciding and telling the other what you want and what you are willing to do for the marriage. There is a high likelihood that her cards will be either that she does not want you or she is not willing to work on the marriage, in which case you would need to accept that it is over.

You can't negotiate with someone who will not take a meeting. Until your wife is willing to meet with you and talk with you with out screwing around what can possibly accomplish by running after her?
0 Replies
 
doggface
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Feb, 2008 04:42 pm
Some thoughts
First, let me start by saying I can relate to your situation and I tell you there is hope! Next, I am not a professional counselor and any tips or suggestions I give are just that.
There is hope my friend, and where there is hope, there is a chance. The first thing I could suggest is to continue to get both of you into counseling. If it is not possible to get her to go, then you go by yourself. You may say that the problem is not with me. This may be true, I wouldn't even pretend to know, but in my experience, you had something to do with it and you need to shift your focus. A licensed counselor will help with that where no one else can.
One of the most helpful things in your situation is to relieve the tension. It was put to me like this; yours and your wife's relationship is like two rubber bands tied together right now. the more you try to pull her back, the more tension she feels. And that tension makes you do strange and uncharacteristic things. Go get two rubber bands and tie them together. Pull on them, as you do this you will inevitably feel the apprehension of one side breaking and snapping you. That is the tension your wife is most likely feeling right now. That needs to be relieved. So you need to back off. In doing so, she gets to do what she wants. That's right, revelation, you CANNOT control her or the situation. It may mean that she goes out all the time or spends all her time in chat rooms. That is her choice, and you cannot do anything to stop her.. that is, if you want to have a chance to save your marriage. When I was told that, I thought, "Man, we have hired a quack as a counselor!" Even though he had come very highly recommended and he had helped a couple I know to work out their issues. I still thought the guy was nuts. But, I learned that if I was going to do this, I needed to be sold out to the program that the counselor designed for us.
Next thing you need to do is work on communication. And that takes a lot of work. I don't know you two, so I don't know what your communication styles are, but start with the basics. Do the old "drive-thru-window" thing. She says something and in a non-condescending way, you repeat back to her what you heard. Just like at a drive-thru. this works wonders in making sure that there are no misconceptions or misinterpretations. It is hard, you feel a little silly doing it at first, but it works.
There is a lot more you will have to deal with and go through. You are not going to like all of it and much of it may be painful. Look at it this way, there has been a lot of pain that you and your wife have avoided over the years by not dealing with it. Well, hurt and pain do not just go away. You have to learn to live with it. It cannot be swept under the carpet, because all you end up with is a huge mound in the middle of the walkway that you WILL trip over eventually. So, just find the ways that help you to deal with and learn to live with the pain. (and I do mean non-destructive ways... I.E. stay away from drugs, that aren't prescribed to you, and alcohol.) Support and accountability groups come to mind. There are many available at local churches. Find one that fits for you.
Now for some hope. My wife and I have been married for quite some time. Our beginning situation sounded a lot like yours, that is why I wanted to write to you. We were young when we started out, I was just beginning a career we lived away from friends and family. And we swept a lot under the carpet. Long story short, a little over two years ago, we really began to have problems. I tried creative ways to reconnect with my wife, but it lead to disaster only because I was going about things all wrong. I tightened that rubber band to the point of breaking, which just pushed her to seek what she wasn't getting from me other places. Such as chat rooms and guy friends. Well, she eventually left me. It was like a shot in the heart when she said she didn't know if she loved me anymore, but she was sure she didn't like me anymore. But again, there is hope! By applying the things we learned in counseling, we were able to, after two years of separation, to begin rebuilding our relationship. We celebrate or 16th wedding anniversary tomorrow.
I hope that this message if nothing else gives you hope. Best wishes to you and your wife. May God bless your future together.

Some books I recommend:
Boundaries by Cloud and Townsend
How to win your wife back... before it is too late by Smalley
Safe People by Cloud and Townsend
Hope these help
0 Replies
 
confusedtur
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Feb, 2008 11:06 am
Thanks for all your suggestions and support. It is hard and I know it will take time and effort to correct things. I just hope I have the strength to complete it. As I mentioned before, I understood the guy friends and the chat rooms. And after the first incident I thought we were in agreement and on the right track. But, to be lied to again makes it doubly hard. Plus, the feeling she may have slept with one or two of them. The sleeping part hurts the most and it is something I have to overcome some how.

As for the kids, one I know 100 % they are mine and two I want to make sure they do not grow up in a broken home because I didn't try to fix things.

But, my greatest fear is that she played me for a fool and did an OJ on me. That is committed the crime and got away with it. With amount of times she lied and covered up and changed stories it is hard to tell the fact from fiction. So, I will proceed with some of the suggestions and see how it goes.
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Feb, 2008 04:07 pm
this is why im glad women dont like being in relationships with me.

man, i have to be real with you, marriage can be boring for both men and women.

If shes not happy with you shes going to go somewhere else, DO NOT FORCE ANYTHING.

You need to accept the fact she might have cheated on you, if you cheat this shouldnt be difficult, if you were devoted this can be devastating.

Id advise just having fun, just go out and have fun. but do not force it. Get over your ego, dont be jealous, but dont be a pushover. Most people just lose "the spark" after a while.

Remember, your a man. Women usually like the bad boy, or whatever. they just like having fun. really thats what its about, keeping your woman entertained and giving her affection.

but dont take my advice, im sure every woman here hates my guts :X
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Feb, 2008 04:12 pm
if you feel like your trying to hard, you are by the way.
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hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Feb, 2008 04:12 pm
confusedtur wrote:


But, my greatest fear is that she played me for a fool and did an OJ on me. That is committed the crime and got away with it. With amount of times she lied and covered up and changed stories it is hard to tell the fact from fiction. So, I will proceed with some of the suggestions and see how it goes.


Worrying about what happened or did not happen is not productive. Look forward. Give her the choice of taking you seriously going forward or ending the marriage. When she feels that she can get over on you she loses respect for you and the marriage has no meaning for her.

If it were me I would not even ask about what she did with these men, it is water over the bridge. I also would not spend much time trying to get promises, at the moment her promises are worth very little. Pay attention to the dynamic, pay attention to how much she respects you or not, pay attention to her level of her willingness to work on the marriage.
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OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Feb, 2008 04:18 pm
i dont tolerate dishonesty at all. soon as she lied or cheated i would have said, we can be friends with benefits, friends or enemies. but we cannot be in a relationship.

all done.
0 Replies
 
SULLYFISH66
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Feb, 2008 04:17 pm
From your description of how YOU act, I don't see the reason for her wandering.

YOU say you are affectionate and try to give a lot of attention, help her with the kids and with her work.

YOU say she sneaks around (on the computer, and now in the car) with other men.

I'd like to hear her side.

Something's missing here . . . . .
0 Replies
 
confusedtur
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Feb, 2008 10:37 am
Again, Thanks for you input

We are trying to work things out, she is making an effort at it and that is certainly helping. The only issue I see now is my own of getting over the doubt and pain of her possibly sleeping with one of these guys. But, we will have to wait and see. Although she seems to be a making a greater effort than the first time we had the issue, only time will tell if this is going to work for the long term.

In response to her side of the story, well true you haven't heard her side and what she feels or why she wanders. But, as I mentioned before after the first incident I was hoping to open the line of communications with her and we discussed the fact that what drove her to this was the lack of appreciation and attention she was getting was not good enough. We discussed what I had to do to try to fix this and what I had to do to try to get back on the right track together. I also said to be open with me and let me know if I was not doing enough or too much so we could find the balance that would make the relationship work. Everything was good from my perspective for the first 2 months or so. Then, she started going to her old habits and when I asked her what was wrong and why she was distancing me again. Her response was that it was work related and once she got past this little stressful hurdle she would spend more time with me and the kids. Then, the second incident happened and then what was I supposed to think. I understand you can only see my point and it seems very one sided, but I mentioned I tried to communicate with her, but either she felt it was pointless and she moved on or it was smoke I don't know. All I know is that there was no lack of trying on my part and I was open with her. But, to betray me this way certainly did not make me feel she really wanted to continue on.

So, like I said time will tell. She wants another go at it and I am willing to try for the kids and us, but 6 months down the road will be the true test. All I have to work on is trying accept the worst case scenario and see if I can move past that.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Feb, 2008 12:47 pm
Hello, confusedtur. Welcome to A2K.

I'm not exactly sure of how long this has been going on but it doesn't sound like your marriage is based on trust and/or happiness.

I understand your trust issues but secretly recording your wife's conversations almost seems like you're beyond the point of no return.

With so much water that's flowed under the bridge that is your marriage, I'd suggest going back to what it was that brought you together to begin with. Do those things still exist for both of you? Unless the two of you find a common ground of appreciation there's little footing to use as a place to rebuild respect and trust.

If I may ask... How old are your children now?
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confusedtur
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Feb, 2008 02:13 pm
Thanks JPB for your perspective.

You maybe right with your conclusion. That is why I am trying to talk to my wife about us and where we stand. I totally agree we have very little trust in each other and right now everything is very tense. I know I have hurt her in the past and I was trying to make amends recently. But, the last incident makes we question all of this. There are number issues circulating in my head, hence I am confused. The loss of trust on my end started when she changed her behavior towards me and the kids. At that time about 1 year and half ago, I realized I had distanced myself from her. I then tried to talk to her and see what was bothering her, Initally I did a poor job as it was a half-ass job. But, as I saw the change in her progressively get worse. I tried to salvage it. I asked to talk to her over and over again, but kept getting excuses Like " I don't have time" or "this is not the right time, we'll talk later" extra. I tried to spend alone time with her, but everytime we did that some other problem would arise like the babysitter cancelled or there was an emergency in the family. As I noticed her spending less time with me and the kids and more time with her friends, I started to wonder what was going on. She started to lie to me about phone calls and emails that I noticed and suddenly would disappear when I confronted her with it. I felt I was not getting the straight answer so I resorted to the taping. It was the only way in my mind I could really see what she was doing and feeling, since she wasn't communticating with me. I had trusted her in the past and never spied on her. But I with her new job and new found freedom, ie using her job to get out of the house or an excuse for being tired it just didn't seem right. So, now here we are not trusting each other and on edge.

She has asked me to forget her stupidity and look at working on our relationship. I can not talk to her about the guy "friends" or what happened in the past as it is uncomfortable for her and she feels ashamed. I wanted to talk to her about why she would see these guys and what was so interesting about them. But, she says she doesn't want to talk about it and just wants to rest from the arguing for now. That we will talk later as the days go by and she feels like opening up. She doesn't want me to push her into talking to let it come naturally. Am I being unreasonable?
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Feb, 2008 08:14 am
confusedtur wrote:
She has asked me to forget her stupidity and look at working on our relationship. I can not talk to her about the guy "friends" or what happened in the past as it is uncomfortable for her and she feels ashamed. I wanted to talk to her about why she would see these guys and what was so interesting about them. But, she says she doesn't want to talk about it and just wants to rest from the arguing for now. That we will talk later as the days go by and she feels like opening up. She doesn't want me to push her into talking to let it come naturally. Am I being unreasonable?


You can't force her to talk about it. She doesn't want to talk yet and you're chomping at the bit to get answers and perspective. The two of you are still not on the same page as to where you're going and how you're going to get there. I get the sense that this is typical of much of your history -- being on different pages, that is.

What do the two of you have in common besides your children?
0 Replies
 
confusedtur
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Feb, 2008 11:03 am
Hey JPB,

You are right again, about not being on the same page. I though about it last night and realized I should not push it so hard. We have need to feel comfortable with one another again to be able to open up. I think I need to take a step back and start to diffuse some of the pressure and tension I am causing by my actions.

As for common things, we enjoy the outdoors, similar sense of humour similar movies. We both like to travel (budget permitting). But, honestly now after this past year I don't know anymore. I know what I will talk to her about this weekend then.

Thanks again
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