The KKK are right

real life wrote:

aperson wrote:
real life,
The next part of your post regarding good and bad people is completely off the point, indicating that you have no idea, or wish to have no idea, what I'm talking about. If I must point it out to your seemingly slow brain, my point was in the last phrase, that religion causes people to do atrocious things, where they would otherwise not.

My point is that religion does not 'cause' anyone to do anything.

People make choices and take action.

A set of beliefs is just that . Beliefs. People have free will to make their own choices.

Do you believe that people have a free will?

When a person has been brainwashed to the point where they believe with all their heart that God commands them to believe or behave in a certain prescribed manner they have lost their free will. Mind you this is the loss of free will with respect to what they believe God commands of them, not with respect to which pair of underwear that person will put on on any particular day. I said this because I know how much you like to make strawmen and divert ideas.

0 Replies

Sentanta,
Amen to that.

real life,
xingu and vikorr anwer for me, I particularly like vikorr's point - that the Bible is a contributing factor.

0 Replies

xingu wrote:

kate wrote:
But what i find ironic is that many in this debate, pick a few scriptures, run with it, rant on God being evil etc and yet when we give evidence supporting a less "evil" action, they choose to ignore it and keep up the rant. That is closeminded and ignorant. Very sheeplike, parroting from websites.

Kate
If God is so just, loving and good as you would like to believe there should be no "bad" or "evil" parts identified with your God in the Bible. The fact there is, and there is a lot, is a contradiction of what Christians say their God is and what the Bible shows this God to be.

You say we only pick the bad parts and ignore the good. Then we can also say you ignore the bad and only want to believe the good. By your own admission God is bad but you don't want to acknowledge it. You become offended and angry when we point it out.

....and you go back to the same old stuff when someone talks about the the New Testament and how it brought about change and is the basis for Christianity.

0 Replies

xingu wrote:

BTW, if you read my comments on the recent tornados you will see that Christians still believe God kills people because of his anger. This goes hand in glove with the "bad parts" of the Bible you so dislike. Is this something you will ignore as well?

Obviously, not all of us "Christians" are alike. God does not kill.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

I, personally, don't consider all religionists to be fundamentalist idiots--i do find that it is the fundamentalist idiot variety, however, who rail so loudly against atheists, and make such claims about them. I have no need to prove that there is no god. As no one has ever proven to me that there is, i consider it a useless debate. It is because people's minds are open that they become atheists. It is people who have closed their minds to any possibilities outside their creed that they are canting dogmatists.

Among my circle of Christian friends, nobody looks down upon atheists. We feel that they may be missing something, but God gave us all free will and atheists choose to use it as they see fit. Just as we do.

Just as you do not feel that you need to prove that there is no God to justify your position. Christians should also have the privilege of not having to prove that God exists.

To say that religionists have closed minds and that atheists have open minds and that is why they become atheists is rather superficial. You talk as though all Christians are mindless sheep and can't make their own decisions.

0 Replies

aperson wrote:

Sentanta,
Amen to that.

Interesting that you would use a biblical word in your answer. Very Happy

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

Setanta wrote:
I, personally, don't consider all religionists to be fundamentalist idiots--i do find that it is the fundamentalist idiot variety, however, who rail so loudly against atheists, and make such claims about them. I have no need to prove that there is no god. As no one has ever proven to me that there is, i consider it a useless debate. It is because people's minds are open that they become atheists. It is people who have closed their minds to any possibilities outside their creed that they are canting dogmatists.

Among my circle of Christian friends, nobody looks down upon atheists. We feel that they may be missing something, but God gave us all free will and atheists choose to use it as they see fit. Just as we do.

Just as you do not feel that you need to prove that there is no God to justify your position. Christians should also have the privilege of not having to prove that God exists.

To say that religionists have closed minds and that atheists have open minds and that is why they become atheists is rather superficial. You talk as though all Christians are mindless sheep and can't make their own decisions.

In many respects, christians can't make their own decisions, because it would be contrary to their dogma. I understand that many, and perhaps most christians are not canting dogmatists, but my remarks were specifically related to the attitudes and behavior of people who have closed their mind to any possibilities outside their creed. That is definitely as "if the shoe fits . . ." kind of situation. If you assert that you and your religious acquaintance have given due consideration to the possibility that your belief set may be in error, but have come to the conclusion that it is not in error, than the remark does not apply to you. Don't holler 'til you're hurt.

As for Aperson's remark, i believe you'll find that that was intentional ironic humor. I know you religious types have a problem with that kind of thing, so i thought i'd tip you wise.

0 Replies

You apparently missed the smiley in my remark to aperson. :wink:

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

xingu wrote:
BTW, if you read my comments on the recent tornados you will see that Christians still believe God kills people because of his anger. This goes hand in glove with the "bad parts" of the Bible you so dislike. Is this something you will ignore as well?

Obviously, not all of us "Christians" are alike. God does not kill.

Quote:

And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

I can see where they get the idea.

0 Replies

Close minded? What good is a set of beliefs if you don't fully believe in them? The Bible warns about people swaying with every wind of doctrine.

Call me closed minded if you wish. I definitely am closed minded about God. I believe in Him fully and nothing or no one will ever change my mind about it.

0 Replies

Quote:

Close minded? What good is a set of beliefs if you don't fully believe in them?

Lots of good - you can question them for a start, and by questioning, you can seek understanding of the deep principles that give your belief life, and you can improve your beliefs, and at the same time, grow...or if you find your beliefs in error, or no longer for you, you can discard them.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

I have no need to prove that there is no god. As no one has ever proven to me that there is, i consider it a useless debate.

Which is why you spend some much time on S&R debating it. Cool

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

xingu wrote:
BTW, if you read my comments on the recent tornados you will see that Christians still believe God kills people because of his anger. This goes hand in glove with the "bad parts" of the Bible you so dislike. Is this something you will ignore as well?

Obviously, not all of us "Christians" are alike. God does not kill.

Which is point I was making earlier. Christians created their own Gods.

I look on the Bible as being a big Lego box. Believers take out pieces and build their own God.

So your telling me your God (who does not kill) is different from the Bible Belt God (who does kill).

Doesn't surprise me one bit.

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

....and you go back to the same old stuff when someone talks about the the New Testament and how it brought about change and is the basis for Christianity.

Your missing a few points here Intrepid.

First off the NT does not in any way absolve your God from the evil that said God did in the OT. It would be the same as a serial killer saying he has decided not to kill anymore so we can all forget what he has done in the past. It doesn't count anymore.

Second the God of the OT ruled by fear. The same God rules in the same manner in the NT. Same God, same style.

Why do you think so many Christians believe natural disasters are caused by God? Read your Bible Intrepid. God killed people through natural disasters.

One last thing. Whenever I discuss religion with Christians invariably one of them will say "Read the whole Bible". Now I have one suggesting that I read only part of the Bible.

0 Replies

real life wrote:

Setanta wrote:
I have no need to prove that there is no god. As no one has ever proven to me that there is, i consider it a useless debate.

Which is why you spend some much time on S&R debating it. (emoticon removed in the interest of having an adult discussion)

I don't spend any time debating that question. I will, and often have, pointed out that no one have provided any proof. Otherwise, i just amuse myself by pointing out the cruelty, the hypocrisy and the hatefulness of the fanatically religious.

0 Replies

vikorr wrote:

Lots of good - you can question them for a start, and by questioning, you can seek understanding of the deep principles that give your belief life, and you can improve your beliefs, and at the same time, grow...or if you find your beliefs in error, or no longer for you, you can discard them.

Study and learn yes. The Bible tells us to study to show ourselves approved. What I mean is I am not going to adopt beliefs from other relgions because they sound good, etc. If another belief doesn't line up with the Bible then it's highly suspect to me.

0 Replies

Quote:

Kate
If God is so just, loving and good as you would like to believe there should be no "bad" or "evil" parts identified with your God in the Bible. The fact there is, and there is a lot, is a contradiction of what Christians say their God is and what the Bible shows this God to be.

xingu but thats just it, the things you believe show evil in God's character, i view differently. And when i first came into this particular debate, you guys were speaking about the bear that killed a bunch of youth. You believed it portrayed actions of an evil God, but even after i broke down the scripture, gave you the actual hebrew and reason behind the scripture, instead of going and studying for yourself what i had to say, you totally ignored my post. That leads me to believe that you don't really want to debate, you just want to bash the bible.

Quote:

You say we only pick the bad parts and ignore the good. Then we can also say you ignore the bad and only want to believe the good. By your own admission God is bad but you don't want to acknowledge it. You become offended and angry when we point it out.

i never admitted that God is bad, you read what you want to believe in what i say and choose to ignore the rest. But in case there is any confusion on what i believe here it is: God is HOly and Just, He is Creator, Father, Provider, Judge and My Rock of Salvation.
and i haven't become offended and angry when anyone disagrees with me. I enjoy debating and i believe others have a right to believe differently than myself. so where do you get that im angry or offended?

0 Replies

Quote:

There are certainly people who make a religion of atheism, and i consider them to be no different than religionists. However, atheists are not by definition of such a character. You have a typical theist blindness. Atheists don't attempt to "prove" that there is no god--it is the failure of anyone to provide proof, or even plausible inference for a god which leads them to reject the concept.

yet ironically many of these topics on this site are written by people trying to disprove the bible, deny the existence of God etc...not to mention the numerous websites, and groups of athiests who proudly and vocally attack christianity ie blasphemy challenge and rational responders. You have a typical atheist blindness :wink: Regardless of what you claim, you have a set of beliefs, You believe that there is no God, and it doesn't matter why you believe that(lack of what you call evidence etc) You still believe there is no God.

Quote:

I, personally, don't consider all religionists to be fundamentalist idiots--i do find that it is the fundamentalist idiot variety, however, who rail so loudly against atheists, and make such claims about them.

who on this site does this?

Quote:

It is because people's minds are open that they become atheists. It is people who have closed their minds to any possibilities outside their creed that they are canting dogmatists.

yes i love the openmindedness of atheists. The fact that many believe their intelligence vastly surpasses that of a religionist, the fact that they love to lump all religionists together in the same mold (yet rant and rave when the same is done to them) and my favorite evidence of the openmindedness of atheists is given from this topic and debate that has ensued.

0 Replies

Kate, you have an excellent handle on things as indicated by your last two posts. You have the naysayers and bashers pinpointed to a T. Some things, however, never change and probably never will.

0 Replies

xingu wrote:

Intrepid wrote:
....and you go back to the same old stuff when someone talks about the the New Testament and how it brought about change and is the basis for Christianity.

Your missing a few points here Intrepid.

First off the NT does not in any way absolve your God from the evil that said God did in the OT. It would be the same as a serial killer saying he has decided not to kill anymore so we can all forget what he has done in the past. It doesn't count anymore.

Absolve? What puts you into such a lofty position. Um, your analogy is rather lame IMHO.

Quote:

Second the God of the OT ruled by fear. The same God rules in the same manner in the NT. Same God, same style.

Perhaps you could describe fear as it pertains to "The fear of God". You are trying to put things into your own mindset. I know that you cannot provide proof of this allegation.

Quote:

Why do you think so many Christians believe natural disasters are caused by God? Read your Bible Intrepid. God killed people through natural disasters.

Where do you get this information? I am not aware of Christians who think this way. I do read my bible. It is unfortunate that you use it for a different purpose.

Quote:

One last thing. Whenever I discuss religion with Christians invariably one of them will say "Read the whole Bible". Now I have one suggesting that I read only part of the Bible.

Where did I suggest that you only read part of the bible. You would have to read the whole thing in order to understand what I was referring to. Obviously, you have not.

0 Replies

The KKK are right

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know