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The 82nd Rainforest Thread ~

 
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 02:14 pm
The ads are for the companies that fund care2 and the land purchases. There's no reason Cadillac couldn't be one of those sponsors.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 03:39 pm
Understood - but they are blocking the entire page - not over on the side or at the top. At times I have found it difficult to get my cursor in to click.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 05:00 pm
Dan, inventive quotes arn't they? {laughing}

A miracle! I clicked ehBeth's link from the thread, connected to the site and clicked, then saw that I wasn't logged in at the site - clicked the link from 'favorites' and voila! Two clicks for the day!

sue, the sites having some sort of difficulty. Try just clicking the link from the thread and see what happens.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 05:03 pm
oops, here's the link....


http://rainforest.care2.com/i?p=583091674
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 05:14 am
That sure worked for me. I will change my shortcut on desktop to that one.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 09:11 am
sue,

Each day instead of connecting to care2 from 'favorites' or desktop, instead visiting the thread then clicking the link posted daily, seems to be the better choice.

Saying 'howdy' to all the wildclickers! Very Happy




http://rainforest.care2.com/i?p=583091674
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 09:26 am
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f3/Earth_flag_PD.jpg/320px-Earth_flag_PD.jpg
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 12:44 pm
Love that photo!
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 12:50 pm
Now here is something that never occurred to me, or would have occurred to me.

Researchers Fear Southern Fence Will Endanger Species Further

By Juliet Eilperin
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, April 20, 2008; A03

TUCSON -- The debate over the fence the United States is building along its southern border has focused largely on the project's costs, feasibility and how well it will curb illegal immigration. But one of its most lasting impacts may well be on the animals and vegetation that make this politically fraught landscape their home.

Some wildlife researchers have grown so concerned about the consequences of bisecting hundreds of miles of rugged habitat that they have talked of engaging in civil disobedience to block the fence's construction.

"This wall is so asinine, and so wrong, I am one of a dozen scientists ready to lay our bodies down in front of tractors," Healy Hamilton, who directs the Center for Biodiversity Research and Information at the California Academy of Sciences, told colleagues at a recent scientific retreat here. "This is one thing we might be able to stop."

"Make it 13!" said Allison Jones, a conservation biologist at the Wild Utah Project, an advocacy group.

Hamilton and Jones have yet to throw themselves before bulldozers, but their call to arms reflects the researchers' growing fears that the wall will imperil species that, in Hamilton's words, "walk, fly or crawl across that border."

The scientists cite examples such as the 70 remaining Sonoran pronghorns in Arizona's Cabeza Prieta National Wildlife Refuge, deerlike animals that are the fastest land mammals in North America. They are the only remaining population on U.S. soil, and the five surveillance towers that the administration plans to build in the area will be in the middle of the pronghorns' range, producing noise and human activity that would disturb the sensitive species.

On April 4, Benjamin Tuggle, a regional director of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, told customs and border protection officials that an interagency team of scientists concluded last month that the construction would inhibit breeding and, "over time, may ultimately lead to the eventual extinction of the species."

The Sonoran pronghorns are not alone: Rare species such as jaguars, ocelots and long-nose bats are also likely to face problems with the new barriers, scientists said.

Earlier this month, however, the Bush administration waived more than 30 environmental and land-management laws to meet its deadline for building at least 360 miles of the border fence. Two advocacy groups, the Sierra Club and Defenders of Wildlife, have gone to court to challenge the constitutionality of the authority that Congress gave the administration to set aside federally required environmental reviews.

Amy Kudwa, spokeswoman for the Department of Homeland Security, said that despite the waivers, the agency has prepared draft environmental assessments or impact statements for much of the fence -- which will be composed of metal, concrete or wire along different stretches -- and that officials will continue to explore ways to mitigate its effect on vulnerable wildlife.

"Just because we're using this waiver authority doesn't mean we've not been mindful of our obligation to be stewards of the environment," she said in an interview. "For a number of miles, we've determined that it would have only insignificant impact."

Kudwa could not specify which areas would feel the greatest effects from the barrier, but she said Homeland Security is negotiating to give the Fish and Wildlife Service $800,000 to mitigate the wall's impact on the Sonoran pronghorn and the long-nose bat in the Cabeza Prieta refuge, even though DHS has waived its obligation to comply with Endangered Species Act requirements there.

Brian P. Segee, a Defenders of Wildlife staff lawyer, said the waiver decision will affect plants and animals in areas ranging from the Lower Rio Grande Valley National Wildlife Refuge in Texas to Arizona's San Pedro Riparian National Conservation Area.

"We're going forward blindly now, and we're going to be learning about the consequences for years to come," Segee said in an interview.

The legal and scientific battle over the fence -- which will continue despite the administration's waivers -- highlights the reality that prized wildlife species are not respecters of international borders.

While popularly perceived as a barren desert, the landscape that straddles the border includes some of the world's most diverse terrain, such as Arizona's Sky Island area, which features isolated mountains surrounded by grassland or desert. Dotted with evergreen trees at higher altitudes, the region attracts jaguars as well as the Sonoran pronghorn and bighorn sheep that regularly crisscross between the United States and Mexico.

Farther to the east, the Lower Rio Grande Valley is home to one of the last free-flowing rivers in the United States, as well as more than 300 butterfly species, more than 500 bird species and the ocelot, an endangered wild cat. Even though 95 percent of the brush habitat in the four counties encompassing the Lower Rio Grande Valley refuge has been eroded, it still boasts 17 federally endangered or threatened species -- more than the entire state of Louisiana.

"The significance of this area, biologically, is extraordinary," said Evan Hirsche, president of the National Wildlife Refuge Association. He said the administration completed a draft environmental impact statement about the fence in three months, a process that would normally take two to three years.

Ken Merritt, who served as project manager for the Lower Rio Grande Valley and two other wildlife refuges in South Texas before retiring in January, called Homeland Security's environmental assessment "a totally inadequate job. They just threw it together." One planned project on the west side of the Lower Rio Grande Valley refuge "basically cuts off wildlife from water," he added.

One of the most vulnerable species in the valley is the ocelot, a small hunter whose fur resembles that of a jaguar. Between 80 and 100 ocelots remain in South Texas, but their survival depends on access to water and getting to Mexico to breed with ocelots there, because the Texas population lacks genetic diversity.

"They're perilously close to going extinct," said Nancy Brown, a Fish and Wildlife public outreach specialist for the refuge. "You think of that irony, we need our cats to get into Mexico. Genetically, they're all starting to look like the same cat."

Homeland Security's assessments do mention ocelots and other imperiled species in brief passages. The draft environmental impact statement, published late last year, noted: "Habitat loss and fragmentation especially along the Rio Grande pose a critical threat to the long-term survival of the ocelot. Efforts are underway to preserve key habitat and biological corridors necessary for ocelot survival."

But Brown said the government has failed to accommodate the needs of ocelots and other species.

"Locally, we tried very hard to seriously make this fence a wildlife-friendly fence," she said. "When you've got a wall 27 miles long and 16 feet high, that's a tough one. It's really hard to make that wildlife-friendly. Whether you're an ocelot or an armadillo, when you bang into six miles of a concrete wall, you're in trouble."

Homeland Security's Kudwa said that agency officials tried to be sensitive to "both environmental and cultural artifacts" in the area, adding that by reducing the trash left by immigrants crossing the border, the barrier could improve the environment in some ways.

"We need to weigh the impact on the environment and the impact on human lives and our ability to secure the border," she said. "That illegal activity does not stop at the border as we have this endless debate."

Scientists are continuing to debate what will happen. A cadre of Mexican scientists is working with U.S. researchers to try to assess the populations that mix across the border even as fence construction is moving forward.

Rurik List, an associate researcher at the Institute of Ecology of the Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico, said that aside from the Great Wall of China, "never before has something of this scale been constructed. So nobody knows what will happen."
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teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 02:12 pm
sumac wrote:
Clicking back in after being AWOL. Will talk to you soon, teeny. And thanks, Dan, for reminding me of that alternate method of multiple clicking. I will give it a try.

Wish I had a pretty picture to post. Must connect with some public sites so that I can do so. Any ideas, other than Google images? Sometimes I can get a National Geographic photo to upload properly.

Thanks for the advice, Sue. It worked! I had some of the salve you cited in our conversation! Thanks! All clicked! Cool
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 02:20 pm
sumac wrote:
Understood - but they are blocking the entire page - not over on the side or at the top. At times I have found it difficult to get my cursor in to click.


you may be getting "see-through" ads that I don't get here - look for an X in the upper right corner of what you think should be the body of the ad - click on the X - it should get rid of the ad.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 06:08 pm
Tried that - it didn't work. But if I just go with the posted link here, I seem to have eliminated all of my problems. Keeping fingers crossed.

Blessed rain here, and enough of it.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 07:25 pm
sue,

Not only will illegals find another route - the animals cut off from water and their natural habitat range, will either adapt or die.

gwb, suspending enviornmental laws to build the friggings wall - {btw spending billions via homeland security} is an ass#### - the only word that totally describes the jerk.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 07:48 pm
Stradee,

Certainly agree with that, although I might add an adjective before your term.
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danon5
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 12:57 am
Arshole comes to mind - stupid arshole - thief arshole - Papa's puppet - Papa's third term as president.

A few of my thoughts.

I tried explaining my wording above and was again barred - be careful of your wording from now on. I think there has been a change in management of this thread.

Great clicking to save more Rain Forest.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 04:25 am
Barred, Dan? Once more, I am in good company. I was once barred by the Administrator, and reinstated by the owner.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 05:04 am
Editorial from today's Washington Post.

Mr. Bush's Train Wreck
The president raised a legitimate concern in his climate speech. Too bad he's the cause of it.

Monday, April 21, 2008; A14

LAST WEEK, President Bush announced a climate change goal that is insufficiently ambitious, and he failed to endorse any mechanism to make even that goal come true. But he had a point when he warned against using laws, such as the Clean Air Act and the Endangered Species Act, to address global warming. Citing the 2007 Supreme Court ruling that the Environmental Protection Agency could regulate greenhouse gas emissions under the Clean Air Act, the president said, "This would automatically trigger regulation . . . all across our economy -- leading to what [House] Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman John Dingell [D-Mich.] . . . called 'a glorious mess.' "

If the EPA classifies carbon dioxide from tailpipes as a pollutant that threatens public health or welfare, then the agency will have to regulate greenhouse gases from all other sources as well. Think residential and commercial buildings, which are larger sources of global warming pollution than are motor vehicles. This could knock various economic sectors for a loop and become a "regulatory train wreck," as White House press secretary Dana Perino aptly described it, that could stay mired in the courts for years.

So a legislative solution aimed at climate change would be far preferable to adapting laws that were enacted for very different purposes. But this is a train wreck of the Bush administration's making. Rather than working with Congress on legislation that would put a cap or price on carbon to reduce the nation's greenhouse gas emissions, the White House questioned the science underpinning climate change warnings and stood in the way of legislation. This led environmentalists, governors and others to look for roundabout ways to cajole the White House into action. Hence the push to list the polar bear as an endangered species because global warming is melting its Arctic Sea ice habitat and the move by California and 17 other states to regulate vehicle tailpipe emissions.

During his Rose Garden speech, Mr. Bush railed against decisions being made by "unelected regulators and judges." He offered no plan of his own while issuing veiled opposition to cap-and-trade legislation being hammered out on Capitol Hill. No matter. Such a bill is coming. One sponsored by Sens. Joseph I. Lieberman (I-Conn.) and John W. Warner (R-Va.) that would cut greenhouse gas emissions 65 percent below 2005 levels by 2050 is scheduled to be debated in June. Even Mr. Dingell said at his April 10 hearing that cap-and-trade should be "the cornerstone" of a climate change program. And a new president who will be serious about meeting the challenges of global warming is just nine months from assuming office. Given all that, Mr. Bush is but a bystander.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 10:43 am
Dan and sue, print whatever you want - just make sure you add a few ## to the lettering.

Cap and trade is b.s., imo - companies complain about how expensive reduction of emmissions will be - yet the gov spends billions for policies that go nowhere quickly - and the gwb greedy kissarsers of congress approve the spending - when funds could be routed for progressive programs instead of filthy oil rigs and chain saws.

Oil and energy corps profits through the roof, so i guess the 'gouging' law passed by lawmakers a few months back stands for nothing except congress and gwb stink from the smell of crude oil.

gwb should just keep his dumb arse mouth closed for the next few months

{forgetting that jerk}



You're making difference for the enviornment wildclickers! kudos Very Happy




http://rainforest.care2.com/i?p=583091674
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teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 12:41 pm
sumac wrote:
Tried that - it didn't work. But if I just go with the posted link here, I seem to have eliminated all of my problems. Keeping fingers crossed.

Blessed rain here, and enough of it.

A foggy day, down here at the Ocean! All clicked! Cool
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2008 02:16 pm
I have never understood the logic behind cap and trade. It doesn't reduce emissions, doesn't encourage good practices - it just seems to be an accounting/tax gimmick that has no real benefits for the environment. And yet everyone thinks it is swell.
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