17
   

Get yer polls, bets, numbers & pretty graphs! Elections 2008

 
 
engineer
 
  5  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 06:08 am
Not polls related, but this graphical representation of McCain's and Obama's tax proposals is interesting from a "nice use of graphs" perspective. The Y scale is proportional based on the number of households in that bracket.

http://chartjunk.karmanaut.com/wp-content/images/taxplans.gif
Diest TKO
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 06:28 am
@engineer,
engineer - where have you been hiding?

T
K
O?
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 07:04 am
@Diest TKO,
Diest TKO wrote:

engineer - where have you been hiding?

Lost enthusiasm for a while. When there is very little substantial comment on the boards, it's hard to slog through all the garbage posts to dig out the good nuggets. Even my favorite conservatives seem to be overwhelmed by the waves of garbage coming out these days. But I'm learning about that ignore button.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 10:01 am
@engineer,
Oh dear!!
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:20 pm
@nimh,
Hey Nimh; I have a bone to pick with Pollster.com and wonder if you can explain it:
For more than a week now; they've had Texas as Dark Red, signifying "Strong" Support for McCain, while they've had Wisconsin as Light Blue, signifying "Lean" support for Obama. What gives?
Texas:
50.3 Support for McCain
43.4 Support for McCain
6.9 Is the difference
Wisconsin:
48.1 Support for Obama
40.4 Support for McCain
7.7 Is the difference

Clearly, Texas is no stronger behind McCain than Wisconsin is for Obama, so what gives?
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:45 pm
Engineer - great graph! I'd been looking for smething like that.

O'Bill - dunno really. Havent really been paying attention to their maps I must admit!
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:46 pm
I don't know if anyone has posted a link to one before but here is an interactive map to look at state electoral votes and come up with your own plan to help your candidate win the Presidency.

http://www.270towin.com/
0 Replies
 
fishin
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:47 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
OCCOM BILL wrote:

Hey Nimh; I have a bone to pick with Pollster.com and wonder if you can explain it:
For more than a week now; they've had Texas as Dark Red, signifying "Strong" Support for McCain, while they've had Wisconsin as Light Blue, signifying "Lean" support for Obama. What gives?
Texas:
50.3 Support for McCain
43.4 Support for McCain
6.9 Is the difference
Wisconsin:
48.1 Support for Obama
40.4 Support for McCain
7.7 Is the difference

Clearly, Texas is no stronger behind McCain than Wisconsin is for Obama, so what gives?


I don't think that is necessarily based on current poll numbers. The coloring (i.e. "strong" or "leaning") has a compnent of trending to it so a state where the numbers are more volitile is more likely to be "leaning" while a state with steady support is more likely to show as "strong".

(Click on the states in question and look at the trend graphs for each of them! Wink The numbers you posted are the current median of the most recent polls but there are some mixed results in WI a few months ago. McCain has led Obama in every poll in their graph for TX.)
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:51 pm
Quote:
McCain Gains Not Limited to Red States

http://www.pollster.com/blogs/BluesRedsPostRNC-thumb-600x450.png

Obama advisor David Axelrod is quoted in today's Washington Post article by Dan Balz and Peter Slevin:

"I think one of the things driving the national polls is that the red states are redder," said David Axelrod, one of Obama's closest advisers. "In the battleground states, the race has held pretty firm."

An interesting claim. Let's take a look at the data based on state polls, rather than national.

Among the strong Republican states, McCain has gained more than 8 points over Obama since shortly before the conventions, turning a 14 point lead into a 22.5 point margin, a huge gain.

Among the strong Democratic states, the effect of the conventions is a tiny 2 point move in McCain's direction, from an Obama lead of 12 points before to 10 points now.

But the rest of the states, rated lean or toss up, have also shown movement. These swing states had a 1.5 point Obama lead before the conventions, and that has now turned into a 3 point McCain lead, a 4.5 point shift.

So Axelrod is right that the biggest gains for McCain have come in the reddest of states, and those may influence national polling. But the evidence doesn't back his second claim, that the battleground has held firm, unless of course you mean they are still battleground states. But now battlegrounds that on balance favor McCain rather than favor Obama as they did before the conventions.

One caution: the lean and tossup states are themselves heterogeneous, so a single trend estimate such as the 4.5 McCain lead here is itself a simplification. If you wanted to focus on the six or eight states that probably hold the key to the electoral vote, you could slice this more finely.

We currently rate eight states as pure tossup: NH, VA, OH, MI, CO, NM, NV and MT. (Note the last has few polls and the latest 9/8 shows a 53-42 McCain lead. But it does fit our statistical criteria, and Montana was listed by the Obama campaign as a target state.)

When we fit the data to just these eight tossup states, we see a 3.5 point move in McCain's direction, from a 2 point Obama lead to a 1.5 point McCain lead. Only a point less shift than among all lean and tossup states. [..]

http://www.pollster.com/blogs/TossupsPostRNC-thumb-600x450.png
0 Replies
 
fishin
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:53 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
Just found this by poking around on their WWW site:

"What is the basis of the classification of each race?

Regardless of the number of polls, we calculate a "confidence interval" around the trend estimate based on the average sample size for the available polls. This reflects the uncertainty in the estimate due to random noise in the polling data.

If a race shows a lead that is outside the 95% confidence interval, then we classify this as a "strong" lead. If the lead is between the 68% and 95% confidence intervals, then we classify it as a "lean". If the race is inside the 68% confidence interval, then we classify the race as "too close to call.""


http://www.pollster.com/faq/map_faq.php
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 09:30 pm
Interesting little thing about intrade today.

Obama is trading at less than 50% but the trading on who will win each state gives Obama enough electoral votes to win.
revel
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Sep, 2008 06:18 am
All in all pretty depressing numbers nimh.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Tue 16 Sep, 2008 07:02 am
@parados,
parados wrote:

Interesting little thing about intrade today.

Obama is trading at less than 50% but the trading on who will win each state gives Obama enough electoral votes to win.

Seems like an opportunity for a hedge bet.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Sep, 2008 09:55 am
@engineer,
Don't tell everybody you silly moo.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  2  
Reply Tue 16 Sep, 2008 09:55 am
From the ever-wortwhile political science blog The Monkey Cage:

Quote:
Sarah Palin Favorability Ratings

Out of curiosity, I made this graph of Palin’s favorability ratings (data here, here, and here; this may not be exhaustive):

http://www.themonkeycage.org/palin-thumb.png

This is a nice lesson " e.g., for an undergraduate class " in the process of “opinionation,” where a large fraction of the public suddenly acquires an opinion.

In the last week, Palin’s favorability rating has, well, paled. This demonstrates the consequences of a highly visible campaign: it is difficult for any Republican or Democrat candidate to command sustained attention without attracting roughly equal proportions of detractors and admirers. In a September 4 Rasmussen poll, Palin’s favorability was 1 point higher than McCain’s or Obama’s. Nine days later, according to a Sept. 13 poll by Daily Kos, it is slightly lower than theirs (49% vs. 55%; however, given the margin of error, it isn’t conclusively lower).

Of course, we would expect the usual polarization along partisan lines here, with most Democratic respondents having an unfavorable opinion and most Republican respondents having a favorable opinion.

Posted by John Sides on September 15, 2008 08:01 PM
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  3  
Reply Tue 16 Sep, 2008 08:31 pm
@nimh,
nimh wrote:
I posted this graph last night on the Obama thread - it looks like McCain's post-convention bounce is stagnating or maybe even starting to fade away again:

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/8926/dailytrackingpollswb9.png


I thought I'd update and expand this graph a bit. Today's update is pretty good news for Obama, though the shifts are of course well within the kind of margin that might also just indicate statistical noise.

I expanded the graph backwards to the day before the Democratic Convention started, and I also indicated the time periods during which at least part of the interviews were conducted during the respective conventions. (The double line, which lasts just 2 days, indicates the period where all of the interviews were done during the convention in question.)*

The Diageo/Hotline poll, obviously, was not a daily poll until Sept 8.


http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/2396/dailytrackingpolls2ib9.png


* I assumed a 3-day period underpinning the tracking polls. That's not entirely accurate: it's 3 for Gallup, but 4 for Rasmussen. But I opted for a bit of simplification.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Sep, 2008 10:04 am
@nimh,
http://img393.imageshack.us/img393/5431/fav1yw8.gif

I guess if you don't trust R2K, this graph won't mean much to ya. But it does to me.

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Sep, 2008 10:27 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Why is that Cyclo? Millions don't give a flying ****.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Sep, 2008 10:28 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Why is that Cyclo? Millions don't give a flying ****.


I'm not interested in the opinions of fools who don't follow politics; but I do agree with you, millions don't care.

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Sep, 2008 10:40 am
@Cycloptichorn,
I follow politics Cyclo. Have you seen the gold price. I only take any notice of the ones who put their money where their mouth is. Any fool can talk. Your mind is a creation of the media you digest like your body is of your food.

I'd bet you are a budget eater.
 

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