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Get yer polls, bets, numbers & pretty graphs! Elections 2008

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 May, 2008 10:24 am
Cycloptichorn wrote:
He'll win Oregon. It'll be closer to 20 then to 4.

Cycloptichorn


Right on!

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 May, 2008 04:54 pm
sozobe wrote:
Scream.

What if his motorbike's a flying one? Technological progress, you know...
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 May, 2008 06:02 pm
Oregon vs Kentucky

Voters in Oregon unconcerned with race and satisfied with either Democratic candidate; Kentucky voters for Hillary preoccupied with race, unhappy with Obama


Check out these huge contrasts between Kentucky and Oregon!

First, the "bitterness quotient". Well, that's what I dubbed it, anyhow. More about how I defined and calculated it here, here, here and here.

What this table shows, calculated on the basis of the exit poll data, is what percentage of Obama voters would be dissatisfied if Clinton were the nominee, and what percentage of Clinton voters would be dissatisfied with Obama as nominee.

A few patterns have stood out:

1) The number of those who would be dissatisfied with the other candidate as nominee (the "bitterness quotient") has gradually risen over time

2) Hillary supporters have pretty consistently proven to be more dissatisfied with the idea of Obama as nominee than vice versa

3) The percentage of Hillary voters who would be dissatisfied with Obama as nominee shot up to a level all of its own in a number of Southern states.


http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4498/bitternessquotient3av8.png


Now how do the latest states figure in?

Resentment among Obama voters reached its apex earlier this month. In the primaries in Indiana and North Carolina, and subsequently among the relatively rare Obama voters in West-Virginia, a clear majority of over 55% of Obama voters expressed dissatisfaction with the prospect of Hillary as nominee.

This time round, however, in Kentucky and especially Oregon, that sentiment seems to have faded again. A sign of confidence among Obama supporters, who feel more magnanimous now they're sure it's a hypothetical question anyway?

Hillary voters are a different question altogether. Among them the 55% barrier had been broken already in most of the March 4 primaries. In Pennsylvania and Indiana, the percentage of Hillary supporters with some distaste at the prospect of an Obama nomination rose to the lower 60s - a level that had not before been broached outside Southern states.

In West-Virginia the number ratcheted up to 74% - three out of four Hillary voters unhappy with the idea of Obama as nominee. That was a record even taking Southern states into account.

And this round? An unprecedented contrast between the two states at hand. In Kentucky, again a new record. There, almost 4 out of 5 Hillary supporters was dissatisfied thinking of Obama as nominee. But in Oregon, serenity. More than half of Hillary voters there said they'd be satisfied with Obama too; a rate of dissatisfaction as low as it has only been in Utah, Wisconsin and Vermont since Super Tuesday.

Striking, eh?

Moving on to a possibly related metric: the influence of race on the choice of the voters.

For a long time now, exit polls have been asking voters whether race played a role in their decision whom to vote for. In the last few states, the results to that question are broken down by race too. After the primaries in West-Virginia, I posted a table here based on those numbers, recalculated so you can see directly what percentage of all white voters said race was a consideration for them.

Here's an update showing the results in Kentucky and Oregon - and the contrast again is striking:


http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/5725/roleofraceinlateprima2tr3.png


Kentucky equalled West-Virginia when it came to considering race. A little over one in five white voters said race was a factor in deciding their vote. And those people were even more massively likely to be Hillary voters than in West-Virginia: 88% of them voted for Clinton.

Considering that even in an anonymous survey, the social desirability of answers can heavily impact results, and considering that confessing that you voted against the black candidate because of race is about as political incorrect as you can get in an exit poll, I would guess that the real number here is much higher still. If one in five admit they voted for Hillary partly because of race, I tend to just sort of double that figure in my head for a wild guess at the real extent of the phenomenon.

Oregon offers a striking contrast. Here, just 8% of white voters said that race was a factor in their choice. That's much lower than in any of the other five states that voted recently, which are all in the Lower Midwest or South. And of course, it's barely over a third of the number in Kentucky.

Moreover, the exit poll doesnt break down how the whites in Oregon who did vote at least partly on the basis of race split between Hillary and Obama, because the sample is too small. But you can roughly calculate what the split must have been on the basis of the data that is available (namely, how the white vote overall split, and how whites for whom race was not a factor voted). And it looks like those whites in Oregon who did base their vote partly on race actually split evenly between the two candidates. I.e., as many who wanted to give the black candidate an extra boost as who were reluctant to vote for a black candidate. Again, that's a sharp contrast with the five Midwestern/Southern states that recently voted, where whites who voted partly on race were massively Hillary voters.

A cultural difference? Obama has certainly been polling very well in the West -- and quite badly in the South and Lower Midwest. All in all more grist for the mill for those who would guess that racial prejudice and resentment plays a large role in how he performs. Larger than most people or media will admit.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 May, 2008 09:25 pm
Quote:
2008 Kentucky Democratic Primary Results Map


http://www.cogitamusblog.com/images/2008/05/20/kentucky_dem.png
[click to enlarge]


Barack Obama won two counties in Kentucky: Jefferson (Louisville), which is something of a liberal enclave with a large black population, and the college town of Lexington (there are other things in Fayette county, but it has a much higher education than the rest of the state). He did somewhat better in Western Kentucky than Eastern Kentucky, but overall his performance among whites was worse than even in West Virginia. A few more appearances might have kept the margin to 65-35. The light-green splotch along the Southern border is a county with a large African-American population for reasons I don't undertstand.


Quote:
2008 Preliminary Oregon Democratic Primary Results Map


http://www.cogitamusblog.com/images/2008/05/21/oregon_dem_2.png
[click to enlarge]


The good people of Oregon would much rather sleep than provide a few hundred thousand political junkies with constant updates on the vote count. Obama won, and he won in lots of places. He won Portland and its Dirty Hippies. He won the college towns of Eugene and Corvallis. He won in Bend and Medford, which don't have reputations as liberal strongholds. He won six counties where fewer than 18% of adults hold a college degree. [..]
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 May, 2008 08:45 pm
nimh wrote:
What this table shows, calculated on the basis of the exit poll data, is what percentage of Obama voters would be dissatisfied if Clinton were the nominee, and what percentage of Clinton voters would be dissatisfied with Obama as nominee.

A few patterns have stood out:

1) The number of those who would be dissatisfied with the other candidate as nominee (the "bitterness quotient") has gradually risen over time

2) Hillary supporters have pretty consistently proven to be more dissatisfied with the idea of Obama as nominee than vice versa

3) The percentage of Hillary voters who would be dissatisfied with Obama as nominee shot up to a level all of its own in a number of Southern states.


http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4498/bitternessquotient3av8.png



I thought I'd try to tease out the patterns in these trends more clearly.

The thing you'd most expect is that the level of dissatisfaction with the rival as nominee would rise over time, as the battle becomes ever more protracted and bitter. And a look at the table above certainly suggests that this happened.

But putting the data in a graph shows up this trend more clearly. Each blue dot represents the percentage of Hillary voters in a given primary who said they'd be dissatisfied with Obama as nominee; the blue line indicates the trend over time. Same with the red ones for Obama.


http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/8177/whenhillvotersweremostej2.png


It remains an oddity: even as Hillary is the candidate generally criticised as having taken the low road more frequently and more egregiously, Obama voters have remained comparatively more sanguine about the prospects of her becoming the nominee than vice versa. Maybe partly because they could afford to, as his nomination came ever closer?

But by ways of alternative context for the varying levels of dissatisfaction with the prospect of the rival candidate as nominee, I wanted to map out the contrasts by region as well. Look at this map. The states in which less than 47% of Hillary voters said they'd be dissatisfied with Obama are colored blue. The states in which over 56% of them said they'd be dissatisfied are colored red.

You'd expect the timing of the primary to be the decisive element, and the map therefore to be something of a jumble, as earlier primary states turn blue and later ones red. This is indeed largely true for the map of dissatisfaction among Obama voters - no regional trends to be discerned in that one.

But look at the Clinton map:


http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/1050/wherehillvotersweremostnr1.png
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 May, 2008 05:37 pm
Still surprisingly little movement in the average of the two daily tracking polls.

Obama's been polling a couple percentage points higher than he normally does, but there's no break-through: Hillary's as stable as ever in the low- to mid-40s.

Number of undecideds as low as it ever was though.


http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/5007/galluprasmusdems18iw0.png
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 May, 2008 07:39 pm
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 May, 2008 07:43 pm
nimh wrote:
Quote:
2008 Preliminary Oregon Democratic Primary Results Map

[..] Obama won, and he won in lots of places. He won Portland and its Dirty Hippies. He won the college towns of Eugene and Corvallis. He won in Bend and Medford, which don't have reputations as liberal strongholds. He won six counties where fewer than 18% of adults hold a college degree. [..]


I should copy/paste a list here that I posted on another thread:

nimh wrote:
Just for the record, Cyclo was right about Oregon. In that state, Obama won:

  • 57% of whites, including 66% of white men
  • 54% of those whose household income was less than $50,000
  • 52% of those without college degree
  • 56% of moderates and 54% of conservatives
  • 58% of weekly church goers
  • 64% of union members
  • 56% of those who said that the current recession or economic slowdown effected them and their family "a great deal"
  • 53% of rural voters
  • outside Multnomah County (Portland), he won 59% of those on the NW Pacific coast and 53% of those in the South and East.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 May, 2008 08:06 pm
Race and gender as hurdles for the candidates
Obama and Hillary have already had a positive impact

In the wake of Obama's Oregon victory, the Boston Globe reported his characterisation of Hillary Clinton:

Quote:
The Illinois senator was careful to laud Clinton even as he neared the nomination.

"We have had our disagreements during this campaign, but we all admire her courage, her commitment, and her perseverance," he told a huge outdoor rally in Des Moines. "No matter how this primary ends, Senator Clinton has shattered myths and broken barriers and changed the America in which my daughters and your daughters will come of age, and for that we are grateful to her."

Word.

In an interview with Jake Tapper, he added that "he agrees with Sen. Hillary Clinton that she has faced some sexism in the media coverage of her campaign":

Quote:
"No doubt there are certain burdens for Sen. Clinton running as a formidable but first-time front-runner as a woman in the same way I've got to deal with some issues as an African-American," Obama told ABC's Jake Tapper.

"There is no doubt that there have been occasions where Sen. Clinton has had to overcome particular hurdles, and that is part of the groundbreaking nature of her campaign," he said.

In the same article, on the other hand, Hillary is quoted as claiming that her gender poses the bigger obstacle:

Quote:
"I think that both gender and race have been obviously a part of it because of who we are, and every poll I've seen shows more people would be reluctant to vote for a woman to vote for an African-American, which rarely gets reported on either," Clinton told The Washington Post.

This, for the record, is true, but the differences are small.

E.g.:

Quote:
ABC News/Washington Post Poll. May 8-11, 2008. [..]

"If you honestly assessed yourself, thinking in general about [see below], is that something you'd be entirely comfortable with, somewhat comfortable, somewhat uncomfortable or entirely uncomfortable?"

"An African-American president of the United States"

66% Entirely Comfortable
22% Somewhat Comfortable
6% Somewhat Uncomfortable
6% Entirely Uncomfortable

"A woman president of the United States"

62% Entirely Comfortable
22% Somewhat Comfortable
9% Somewhat Uncomfortable
7% Entirely Uncomfortable

Quote:
Newsweek Poll [..]. April 24-25, 2008.

"Do you think America is ready to elect a woman president, or not?"

70% Is
25% Is Not

"Do you think America is ready to elect an African-American president, or not?"

74% Is
19% Is Not

On the bright side, in both polls, both the numbers of those comfortable with electing an African-American and electing a woman have increased very notably over the past year, jumping up by 8-15%! In short, Obama and Hillary seem to have had an impact already in showing that it can be done.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 May, 2008 10:24 pm
Preditions on Puerto Rico's voting:


http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/24/165353/579
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2008 07:56 pm
Hey, that was really interesting. Whole different political universe out there. Thanks, Butrflynet.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2008 08:04 pm
Quote:
Myths about the white male vote

May 25, 2008
Baltimore Sun | The Swamp


This column is riddled with inconsistencies. Notably the repeated conflation of a candidate's polling among white men and his/her polling among white working class men.

The last few paragraphs, however, make a point worth citing:

Quote:
Obama's bigger challenge, and greater opportunity, given that neither he nor Clinton is likely to reverse the trend among working-class white males, is among white women.

A Gallup Poll released last week showed both Obama and Clinton trailing McCain by a larger margin than in the Pew poll. But Clinton was beating the Republican among white women.

"Clinton's edge among white voters is not, as some have hypothesized, based on Obama's problems among blue-collar white men, but reflects more the fact of Clinton's strength among white women," according to Gallup.

In general, Gallup editor Frank Newport writes, "Obama and Clinton perform exactly the same among non-Hispanic white men when pitted against presumptive Republican nominee John McCain. Both Obama and Clinton lose to McCain among this group ... 36 percent to 57 percent."

So as Obama's campaign goes forward, rather than worrying about bowling, beer or duck hunting, he needs to win over those women voters who are pulled so powerfully to Clinton's campaign.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2008 05:58 pm
Bill's gone paranoid.. I guess they're really, really not used to losing.

Anyway, this part is relevant to this thread - passed on without comment:

Quote:
Bill Clinton: 'Cover up' hiding Hillary Clinton's chances

[..] Clinton also suggested some were trying to "cover up" Sen. Clinton's chances of winning in key states that Democrats will have to win in the general election.

" 'Oh, this is so terrible: The people they want her. Oh, this is so terrible: She is winning the general election, and he is not. Oh my goodness, we have to cover this up.' "

Clinton did not expound on who he was accusing. [..]

"She is winning the general election today and he is not, according to all the evidence," Clinton said. "And I have never seen anything like it. I have never seen a candidate treated so disrespectfully just for running." [..]

"If you notice, there hasn't been a lot of publicity on these polls I just told you about," he said. "It is the first time you've heard it? Why do you think that is? Why do you think? Don't you think if the polls were the reverse and he was winning the Electoral College against Senator McCain and Hillary was losing it, it would be blasted on every television station?"

He added, "You would know it wouldn't you? It wouldn't be a little secret. And there is another Electoral College poll that I saw yesterday had her over 300 electoral votes. ... She will win the general election if you nominate her. They're just trying to make sure you don't."


He also had some things to say about Hillary's prospects:

Quote:
The former president suggested that if the New York senator ended the primary season with an edge in the popular vote, it would be a significant development.

"If you vote for her and she does well in Montana and she does well in Puerto Rico, when this is over she will be ahead in the popular vote," Clinton said. [..]

"And they're trying to get her to cry uncle before the Democratic Party has to decide what to do in Florida and Michigan," which Clinton said the party would need to do "unless we want to lose the election."

The current requirement to claim the Democratic presidential nomination is 2,026 delegates, a formula that does not take into account delegates from Florida and Michigan, whose contests were not sanctioned by the party because they moved them up earlier on the primary calendar.

But if those votes were counted as cast, Hillary Clinton would still trail rival Barack Obama in the overall delegate count. [..]


Finally, he had some strident and entirely un-self-aware complaints about the Obama campaign "bullying" superdelegates. On that count, for some fun, check out this juxtaposition (thanks also to Soz who posted that LA Times article back in April).
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2008 08:39 am
Great juxtaposition!



This is a wow post, for the "numbers" part of the title of this thread:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/5/23/8357/78578/512/520186

(Am I officially ready for some sort of medical intervention if I read -- and enjoyed -- the whole damn thing?)
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2008 08:50 am
nimh wrote:
Bill's gone paranoid.. I guess they're really, really not used to losing.


I see it as true to form rather than any new paranoia. Anything negative has always been attributed to "our enemies" or some devious plot. That's my overall problem with Hillary -- she (they) can't accept that the anyone not in agreement with her (them) is an enemy.

The concept of 'You're either with us or against us' applies equally to the Clintons as it does to GWB. That is the Number One reason I would never vote for Hillary.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2008 09:50 am
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_senate_elections/kentucky/election_2008_kentucky_senate

Quote:


Laughing

If we did to them what they did to Daschle, with less dirty tricks, that would be fantastic!

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 May, 2008 02:16 pm
nimh, you can tell us... you are Poblano, aren't you?


;-)

Cool new pollster ratings:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3295/2529867241_28d60ff95a_o.png

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/05/pollster-ratings-v311.html

SUSA's still doing well.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 May, 2008 04:55 pm
sozobe wrote:
nimh, you can tell us... you are Poblano, aren't you?


;-)

Only in my wildest dreams... :wink:
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 May, 2008 05:09 pm
Hehheh..

Quote:
Hillary Clinton has remained (very, very) chipper in demonstrating to the public that she doesn't intend to give up the nomination battle any time soon. But wouldn't it be nice if there were a completely arbitrary, junk science, psycho-linguistic way to prove that she's not going anywhere until the final Puerto Rican is counted? Well, lucky for you, there is. A dissection of Hillary's victory speeches reveals this pseud-telling trend:

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/FIGHTgraph.jpg


Your Right to Fight the Party
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 May, 2008 05:31 pm
The Field noted that several of its readers/commenters had been accepted "into the Obama Organizing Fellows training and work program, and will soon begin intensive training" (like Vietnamnurse, I guess!). The salient bit here: the Organizing Fellows registration page lists a number of states of which it notes, "We have a particular need for Fellows in the following states, and encourage you to relocate to one for this program if you don't already live in one".

The page also says, "Just so it's clear to everyone, this program will go forward in all fifty states. The ones on this list will start on June 14, and all other states will start in mid-July." Nevertheless it's interesting to see which states they're starting on with the highest urgency. It could be argued to be a good indicator of what the campaign's top targets are, although of course other factors come into play as well. (Other factors may be that small states need less organising than large ones and that tough but crucial states may have to be worked on longer and more intensively than smaller and already more favourably-minded states; whether there's other competitive races in the states probably also factors in).

Biggest surprises: Georgia is on the list; and Minnesota isn't.

At Cogitamus, Nick Beaudrot has neatly mapped out the list on two maps: states in the list that Kerry won ("where Obama is defending") and states that Bush won ("where they're playing offense"):

Quote:
The Best Defense ...

Via OpenLeft, a list of states where the Barack Obama campaign is getting a head start on organizing. Here's the map of states where Obama is defending:

CLICK FOR MAP 1 (The states in question are colored grey)

And here's a map where they're playing offense:

CLICK FOR MAP 2 (The states in question are colored grey)

Assorted notes below the fold.

  • Neither Montana nor North Dakota make the list. When you consider the fact that the Kerry campaign made a substantial investment in Colorado and Nevada, Obama is not really expanding the map in the West.
  • Team Obama is clearly spooked by the early polls that showed New Jersey to be competitive.
  • The decision to compete in Georgia and North Carolina, but not Mississippi, seems correct; Mississippi has more African Americans, but is less urban and has fewer white college degree holders. In three of the four districts, Kerry and Gore got less than 20% of the white vote. But if there's room for one more medium-sized state, it should be Mississippi or South Carolina.
  • Texas is not on the list. I'm not sure if this reflects a skepticism of the ability to hold the Latino vote, or just how deep the hole is for Democrats, or the amount of money it would take to compete there. But I'm a little sad that it's not in play: a rainbow coalition of Obama, Noriega, and a bunch of white Congressman would be pretty cool.
  • In terms of impact on down-ticket races, the decision to start early in Washington but not Minnesota looks like a mistake. Both states are only at the edge of swing state territory at the Presidential level. Washington has no Senate race, but the Minnesota Senate contest will be tight. At the House level, only WA-08 is really in play, while in Minnesota, MN-01, MN-03, and MN-06 are potentially competitive. Otherwise, he's playing in states that are home to almost all of the competitive House races.

Overall, Obama can afford to be more aggressive. He's not taking full advantage of his strength over Hillary Clinton, which is that he does a better job locking up the Upper Midwest and Pacific Northwest. Washington is not really in play. Oregon probably isn't either. The state party can take care of business in New Jersey. Those three states account for 33 electoral votes, one fewer than Texas. Iowa, which is starting to look safe, accounts for seven--one more than Mississippi and one fewer than South Carolina. Obama would be better of expending fewer resources on defense and more on offense, in the hope of spreading the McCain campaign too thin.

If I were Paul Tewes, I'd take resources out of Washington, Oregon, New Jersey, and partially out of Iowa and Pennsylvania, and instead put them in Mississippi, Texas, South Carolina, North Dakota, and Montana. But on balance this isn't a bad place to start.
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