What's good for the goose will make the gander.... gay?

Aaack, Set.

On the other side, there was a girl in my senior class in high school who wanted to be an engineer, and the nuns wouldn't send her transcripts to wherever - that was '59.

I quite enjoy the feeling of womens undergarments on my skin. Especially that womans from up the road. Have to be careful to get them back on the washing line before morning though.

But I'm not gay

Seriously though I think things are changing. Son enjoys his cooking classes at school. and notes that he has more success with the chicks when he does girl stuff, like letting them experiment with make up on him.

I was a bit surprised when he came home with eyeliner and that smile that says scored big time.

well now...

Ha! I'm glad to see the boys join this thread. I was waiting for you.

Mr. B and I just celebrated our 18th anniversary and I am still convinced that one of the reasons I love him is that he took a class in high school called "singles survival" which was essentially home-ec for boys. There he learned basic sewing and cooking and the importance of a clean house.

So yeah, dadpad, you're son is right. Chicks dig that. At least this chick does.

I would have bought a ticket too, Set.

Your post jarred loose a million memories and thoughts about why I can't quite throw away that pickle jar.

I think that those of us who grew up with depression era parents or grandparents (or even being those people ourselves) have a hard time wasting things so we teach our boys to sew and how to make bones into soup and how it only takes four ingredients to make bread.

You know, those "girl" things.

Just remembered. I tried to take auto mechanics as a freshman in high school and it was dismissed as if completely ridiculous.

Not to be obnoxiously nosy, what year, eoe?

1969
Girls weren't even allowed to wear pants in school until 1971

Hmmm, I remember taking trig at city college in the summer while I went to ucla in the regular year. Lets say summer of '61 - you couldn't wear pants there but could at ucla. The changing of the guard....







I'm glad to see the guys here too.

Re: What's good for the goose will make the gander.... gay?


People who have courage have "balls" those who don't are "pussies." Boys who show feminine traits are "sissies," girls who show masculine traits are merely "tomboys." Monuments are built to worship the penis while the vagina is a hole where the penis is supposed to be.

In the workplace, women who get ahead are accused of acting like men. When men are assertive they are praised for standing up for their rights while women are called "bitches."

Men have an extreme fear of all things feminine. Don't believe me? Ask a man to hold your purse or buy you tampons. Even so-called feminists eschew femininity. Western culture has been steeped in patriarchy throughout its history. We, as women, owe our very existence to the whim of a man. Adam. And were even created from his rib.

The woman's movement is a mere blip on the radar of eons of male domination. We have a long way to go, sisters.

I dunno. I was the one that made the comments that led to this thread (thanks for starting it, boomer!). My daughter is forever trying to do "boy-only" things (sometimes successfully, sometimes not) and gets a lot of positive feedback about it. It's not really the same the other way around.

There are exceptions, sort of. Sozlet has a crush (and has for a long time -- it ain't budging) on this kid J. J has a big sister (his only sibling) and does boy things but is very comfortable with girl things too. It'll often be him and a gaggle of girls doing stuff together at recess. Still, as another (male) friend of sozlet's grumbled, J is a "girl magnet." EVERYONE has a crush on him.* That's seen as a positive thing by his male peers, and seems to kind of "excuse" the fact that he does this stuff.

*Sozlet started a "J Fan Club" which has at least a dozen members. He's bemused rather than mortified, thank goodness. He's even the president. (I, on the other hand, am mortified.)

Our old neighborhood was totally girl dominated. Girls everywhere. All of Mo's friends were girls. I've noticed at this school he has a certain tomboy that he plays wall ball with every recess. He likes to jump rope. He wants to sew. I'm glad he doesn't make the distinction between girl things and boy things (except for dolls which he sees as being very girl).

I get what Roxx is saying. For a long time many, many doors were closed to girls.

I'm still gathering my thoughts on this.

Like my friend the stylist who would get gay during the course of the day because people expected him to be gay.

Or like my gay friend Mike who is a makeup artist and who acts very feminine. I knew him before he came out to his family. When you called him on the phone he answered in his man-voice. When he found out it was you he would switch over to his gay-voice. When you were with him and his family you would never guess he was gay.

Isn't a stylist being labled "gay" because of their job kind of like a woman being labled "bitch" if she's "acting like a man"?

Or am I way off base?

Sort of, both are products of misogyny.

I know what you're saying, but that seems a little simplistic. If a girl wants to do something boyish and can do so easily; but if a boy wants to do something girlish he gets guff about it; is that really misogyny? Who is more negatively affected by that, the boy or the girl?

One of our godsons (now 12) had had a lot of difficulites during his time (four grades) at primary school and his first years at grammar school: not only that he's one of those intellectually gifted children, he's badly influenced by his older brother's (some intelligence ... as his twin sister, too) and father's 'male attitudes.

So the parents -finally- send him to a Waldorf school, a grammar school ('highschool').

At first he had more than just a lot of prejudices - but now he's one of the overall best in needle work and cooking. (Both are 'normal classes' like English, French or German!)

I had to fight to get into mine and the teacher was a dink to me the whole year. I was 15, so that was in 1973. Then, in 1980, I signed up for the four yr course at our vocational school and the instructor was so awful to us three women that we all quit. He berated and abused us all day long.

Get into what Mame. Pants or auto mechanics?

ha ha ha - how did I manage to delete the part of the post I wanted to answer? lol

I had trouble getting into girls pants at high school too.

I'm a dab hand at baking--try to find a good buttermilk biscuit recipe, the buttermilk reacts better to the baking powder, so they rise nice and light, and you use way less shortening. I'm sure you know that if you substitute one tablespoon of cold white vinegar for one of the tablespoons of iced water in a pie crust recipe, you'll get a flakier, lighter crust, and you can roll it out thinner without worrying that it will break.

Four ingredients for bread? I can't remember if it's the Italians or the French, but one of them (the Eye-talians, i think) only use three--flour, water and yeast. Ever-body else adds salt.

Good thread, Boss . . .