Medal Database Sought to Catch Frauds

Forums: Politics
Email this Topic • Print this Page

What do you think? Is this necessary? Worth doing?

Quote:

Medal Database Sought to Catch Frauds
Associated Press October 05, 2007

WASHINGTON -- A pair of congressmen want to establish the first database for military awards to help law enforcement officials catch and prosecute military frauds.

The measure, to be introduced in the House this week, would collect the names of all current and former servicemembers who have earned military medals including the Medal of Honor, Silver Star and Purple Heart. Certain Coast Guard and Merchant Marine medals also would be included.

That database would be made available to law enforcement and certain researchers to help them determine rightful heroes from clever frauds.

Last year, Congress approved the Stolen Valor Act, making false possession and display of certain high-level military medals punishable by up to six months in jail.

But sponsor Rep. John Salazar, D-Colo., said many of the cases proved difficult to prosecute because investigators had no way to prove or disprove whether a suspect actually earned any medals.

"These honors are reserved for those who willingly risked their lives for our country," he said in a statement. "It is our job to protect the honor and integrity of our veterans, to make sure the memory of their heroism is not tarnished."

Defense Department officials had no comment on the pending legislation. Many of the service's old records are spread out through various subagencies and are not yet digitized, which likely would make creating the database a cumbersome task.

Doug Sterner, a Vietnam veteran whose research has exposed dozens of military frauds, agrees that compiling the data will take time, but insists it is not an impossible task.

In his research, he has tracked down numerous missing or forgotten citations, and said putting together a clearinghouse of medal recipients will prevent those records from being lost again.

"I think that's the real value of this bill," he said. "Having a database to help expose frauds is good. But having a database to preserve history and our heroes is even more important."

Salazar and co-sponsor Rep. Patrick Murphy, D-Pa., said recent reports of new scam artists claiming to be Iraq veterans further underscore the need for the legislation.

Last month, researchers also discovered that the Veterans History Project, a multimillion-dollar collection of more than 50,000 oral and written war stories from Americans sponsored by the Library of Congress, included many stories of men claiming medals they never earned.

Topic Stats
Top Replies
Link to this Topic

Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 1,729 • Replies: 20

No top replies

Sounds like a good idea to me.

BUT, wouldnt this bring validity to Rush Limbaugh's point about "phony soldiers"?

Are you sure you want him to be proven right?

0 Replies

I don't know what Rush Limbaugh's statement was and it wouldn't effect my life one waqy or the other if he's right or wrong. Why should I care what that gas bag has to say about anything?

To me, this proposed database sounds like another waste of money. Is there really an issue here that needs to be addressed by the government?

If historians or the press want a database to research information then let them submit the FOIA requests and get the raw data and they can create it themselves.

0 Replies

Now that is exactly what I need, my name on another data base. Does the concept of "privacy" mean anything to anyone any more?

Sure, let's make it a private not Government data base, it could be funded by selling the names to "various interested parties" for the purposes of trying to sell me something, no doubt.

If someone wants my info that badly, they can bloody well go up to Suitland, MD and dig it out of the musty, dusty files. (...and may the mould spores infest their sinuses.)

Halfback

0 Replies

fishin wrote:

I don't know what Rush Limbaugh's statement was and it wouldn't effect my life one waqy or the other if he's right or wrong. Why should I care what that gas bag has to say about anything?

To me, this proposed database sounds like another waste of money. Is there really an issue here that needs to be addressed by the government?

If historians or the press want a database to research information then let them submit the FOIA requests and get the raw data and they can create it themselves.

Is this an issue that needs to be addressed?
Yes,it is.

By the govt?

No.

The reason it is so important to me (and I hope to all vets) is simple.
Medals like the MoH mean something, and stand for certain things.
To have someone claim to have been awarded one cheapens the memory of those that actually did earn them.

0 Replies

Fishin--

I see your objection to Letting Big Brother Do It With Tax Money.

Unfortunately we seem to have a shortage of Private Citizens who want to Bell Cats.

0 Replies

In Germany a law about Titles, Orders and Honourary Signs (in German : Gesetz über Titel, Orden und Ehrenzeichen) regulates such.

And if you don't have got your order, medal or title legally - you get punished for such. Severely.

0 Replies

Forgot to mention, some of those Service Record Books, from whence the "data base" would be built, have Classified references and information in them.

Halfback

0 Replies

Uh, Halfback... If you are saying that you served in the military and earned a medal, no you do not have a right to records privacy. You were / are owned by the government. Something in your records that is secret would obviously be off limits, but not your record of medals. Why would it be?

0 Replies

I'm feeling like this is another overblown issue. If people are claiming to be Iraq war veterans and obtaining services based on that claim, the problem isn't with a medals database.

What is it costing us to have a dozen or even a hundred people go around bragging about their having earned a medal when they didn't? What would it cost to correct it?

Since so many seem to be cost analysis based, you might want to check those numbers before getting behind such a program.

0 Replies

Noddy24 wrote:

Fishin--

I see your objection to Letting Big Brother Do It With Tax Money.

Unfortunately we seem to have a shortage of Private Citizens who want to Bell Cats.

Actually there are a LOT of non-government people that do just this sort of thing. There is a Medal of honor Association that checks up on people who claim to have been awarded teh MOH. The same for the Silver Star award. Every military branch has at least one Association that looks into claims on a recurring basis.

This isn't about a lack of people looking into it. It's about the government making it easy for them to do it.

0 Replies

Walter Hinteler wrote:

In Germany a law about Titles, Orders and Honourary Signs (in German : Gesetz über Titel, Orden und Ehrenzeichen) regulates such.

And if you don't have got your order, medal or title legally - you get punished for such. Severely.

We have laws on false claims as well. The idea here is apparently to try and make it easier to catch people making them.

0 Replies

squinney wrote:

I'm feeling like this is another overblown issue. If people are claiming to be Iraq war veterans and obtaining services based on that claim, the problem isn't with a medals database.

What is it costing us to have a dozen or even a hundred people go around bragging about their having earned a medal when they didn't? What would it cost to correct it?

Since so many seem to be cost analysis based, you might want to check those numbers before getting behind such a program.

EXACTLY! Should we be spending millions so that some guy running for mayor of Toledo 20 years from now will be caught if he lies about having served in Iraq? Isn't that what investigative reporters are for?

0 Replies

I'm thinking we need a federal funded program to amass a database of people who under-report their weight on their drivers license (as well as their natural hair-colour)

0 Replies

I think Dyslexia had posted the most intelligent statement so far.

0 Replies

It's just chest-thumping by those on the Right; I think it's probably related to the limbaugh flap.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

rabel22 wrote:

I think Dyslexia had posted the most intelligent statement so far.

You are one silly goose to ever agree with anything I have to say.

0 Replies

What's the difference between Rush Lamebrain and the Hindenberg?

Well, one is a fat, Nazi gasbag . . .

. . . and the other is just a dirigible.

*********************************************

Seems like wasted effort to me. The United States Army already maintains a web site which lists all Congressional Medal of Honor citations as well as the full text of each citation. It would really not be that difficult to provide the same sort of thing for the Silver Star, the Bronze Star, the Navy Cross, etc.

But, as has been pointed out, why worry about it? When it comes to politics, not only will you have someone attempting to dig up the dirt on anyone who opens his or her mouth, you'll have creeps like the Swifties who will attempt to discredit others who have actually served.

0 Replies

Wrong again! One is an A** and the other is a pile of ash.

As for gas bags, I assume you are speaking from practical experience. Laughing

Halfback

0 Replies

Re: Medal Database Sought to Catch Frauds

Quote:

Medal Database Sought to Catch Frauds
Associated Press October 05, 2007

WASHINGTON --

Last year, Congress approved the Stolen Valor Act, making false possession and display of certain high-level military medals punishable by up to six months in jail.

But sponsor Rep. John Salazar, D-Colo., said many of the cases proved difficult to prosecute because investigators had no way to prove or disprove whether a suspect actually earned any medals.

"These honors are reserved for those who willingly risked their lives for our country," he said in a statement. "It is our job to protect the honor and integrity of our veterans, to make sure the memory of their heroism is not tarnished."

This is awfully problematic seeing as how the US hasn't been in any war where soldiers risked their lives for their country since World War II. Now should the medals count where these people risked their lives to advance America's selfish national interests, okay, but those are clearly mercenary medals, a whole different ball of wax and valor is not a word that should be even mentioned in the same breath.

Where's the heroism in carpet bombing countries, napalming villages, using chemical weapons, spreading cluster bombs for little kids to pick up, [if you don't happen to get them first time around], spreading depleted uranium all over someone else's country, deposing democratically elected officials, ruining economies and lives for your own selfish interests, killing half a million children thru an illegal and immoral embargo, ... ; ... ,

yup, sure sounds like the dictionary definition of 'heroism'.

How about those mercenaries who got medals to provide cover for numerous government propaganda ops? Would those qualify for protection?

"Stolen Valor Act", puuuleeeze.

Even in WWII, there easily could have been war crimes tribunals for America soldiers, commanders and politicians. Think about it, many of those war criminals were awarded medals; where's the valor in that?

All these medals have been badly tarnished with the blood of millions of innocents sacrificed solely for American greed.

And it's deja vu all over again. Stop preening, look at the damage you've done and take active steps to rectify it where you can. That would be valorous.

0 Replies

Medal Database Sought to Catch Frauds

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know