Well that's just RUDE!

Of course females coming to the table to eat or walking around the house without a shirt on is perfectly OK.

yeah, I figured that would be someone's response....That's why I put males....I assumed women would be wearing a shirt.

I think all of those things are rude.

I think it is also rude to open the door and walk inside in front of a woman coming in at the same time. I see that happen a lot and sometimes it is the husband walking in first before their wife.

I find hauking and spitting on the street disgusting.

And people who are trying to snort-sniff up their runny noses.

People who blow their noses in public and then look at their kleenex.

People who clean their ears or pick their teeth in public.

These Rudeness discussions are just a way to get people to follow social rules... and some of these rules are silly and deserve to be broken.

The social rules that deal with issues of hygiene I can accept. Prohibitions on spitting, ear cleaning, teeth-picking are examples of rules I live by.

Rules that stem from sexist ideas I break with great joy. I will certainly enter a door first if I get to it first, and I will wear a hat anywhere I darn well please. If men and women are going to be equal--- then they should be equal. Period. This continuing special treatment for women bugs me.

Cell phones are a fact of life. You are going to have to deal with it. You can ask people to use common sense when they talk on the phone, and you should understand enough to not talking about your illicit affair in front of strangers... but telling people to not talk on the phone in public--- forget it.

The shirt at the table thing could fit into a rule about hygiene-- except you insisted on making this (like the hat thing) only a rule for men... I have been at beach parties where this was broken, but the men I know usually show up fully dressed.

Silly Social rules, especially those that reflect old sexist ideas, are made to be broken.

Hear, hear. Your first sentence should be a sig line.

I think that rudeness is largely a cultural perception.
That's why many Americans think we Europeans are rude.


And that's why most Americans prove here the opposite :wink:

Re: Well that's just RUDE!


Why? Is it annoying to only hear half the conversation so you can't eavesdrop? One thing is if you are talking unnaturally loud, but otherwise I don't see a problem.

I believe most of this "rudeness" stems from being considerate of others. Holding a door open when some one is behind you is being considerate of the person behind you for example.

If someone sits outside the house and honks their horn, or fails to remove their hat when they come inside, they just demonstrate how ill-bred and clueless they are.

Sorry you're so angry.

For me, I see any of those things as lack of concern for the comfort of others.

Doing any of the things mentioned indicated a feeling of self importance and entitlement to do whatever suits a person, regardless of how it makes others feel.

Sometimes, there isn't even a reason existing anymore for performing/not performing a certain act, like a man taking off his hat indoors.
Regardless, it's seen as a sign of respect.

I'm not going to go through or over each item line by line. Except for the cell phone...I didn't say no cell phone usage....I said, take it away to a quiet corner. The same way a person would take a loud conversation with another away from a group of people, leaving them in peace to do what they want. Loud conversations, whether in person or on a cell, is keeping others from doing what they want to be doing....i.e. not listening to you.

My idea showing respect by various acts, or refraining from, is one of the few things that separate us from feces flinging apes.

Showing manners, refraining from rude behavior is a simple, powerful way of showing others, whether they are a stranger or a friend, that you see them, you acknowledge their humaness and their dignity.

Manners are symbols, rudeness is an easy out. A lazy persons way of avoiding the thought it takes to make others feel at ease.

And yes, it is important to me to make others feel at ease....IRL.

Doesn't matter if the gesture no longer makes sense, it's a gesture that spreads goodwill.

BTW....ebrown...you can't wear a hat where ever you darn well please. Assume for a moment you really wanted to come in my house. You wouldn't unless you took your hat off. And that BTW is not my rule, but Mr. Tea's.

I'm not certain to whom you refer, but for my part, i'm not angry.

ebrown.

Oooo, goody, dirt dishing. I just skimmed and didn't read all the posts--i'll have to go back for that one.

Not even mailing her an AIDS treatment pamphlet after one night stands has been a little rude on my part. I have to work on that.

I'm not sure why people are more annoyed with those on cell phones, vs. just hearing two people talking. Of course I'm talking about where it's acceptable to speak out loud, not in something like a movie theatre, where it's ok for only black people to talk loudly.

I hate it if Slappy even drives down my street . . . but the law dogs came and took my rocket launcher, so he gets a pass . . .

Let me pose 2 questions....


1. Is the comfort of others important to you?

2. Do you appreciate it when someone make a effort, or a gesture that takes your comfort into account?



If you answer No to #1 and Yes to #2, well, you're missing the opportunity to return the favor.

If you answer No to #2 you're a selfish lout.

If you answer Yes to #1, then #2 will automatically follow.


Not everyone has a lot to give. Not everyone has money, or an intellect to share deep thoughts. Or even a sparkling personality.

However, it's in all our capabilities to show kindness and consideration, which is what manners are all about.

By the way, i found E_brown's remark about holding doors to be pretty idiotic. I hold doors for anyone who is close behind me, regardless of gender. When it comes to small children or the elderly, who may have difficulty with a heavy door, i open it, and stand back to let them pass. It's a courtesy, and it shows the kind of consideration which i hope others will show to me (if, for example, my arms were full). As for holding a door for a woman, that was how i was raised, and it has the added advantage of allowing some eye contact and at the least, a brief flirt.

Chai,

I am all for decency and common courtesy. What I don't like is being judged by a set of often silly social rules.

You have failed to respond to the fact that giving women preference at a door simply because they are women... or allowing women to wear hats where men can't, have no rationale. They are clearly from old sexist ideas.

These social rules are used to judge the "behavior" of others-- a practice I find quite uncourteous. I have friends who are very decent people who break one or more of the rules of polite society. The fact that they are decent people I enjoy being with is much more important to me than whether they remember to remove their hat.

Funny thing about who opens the door... with my wife and I it is generally the person who gets their last who enters first-- not because of social convention, but because we care about each other.

Why can we just be decent people and forget about the social rules?

Part of being a decent person is being tolerant of people around me who aren't perfect by my (or perhaps any) standards. So what?

As far as dinner... I propose a compromise. I promise I will wear a shirt, if I can wear a hat.