Elizabeth Edwards - long term

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I've been hearing over and over the past few days about concerns of Elizabeth Edwards and her health during the campaign.

Also about John Edwards dealing with this while campaigning, and how it might/would hurt his chances of being elected.

I'm not sure if the general public is simply unaware, or if the media is just doing its usual business of not providing full information (so they'll have a bigger story later on).

Simply put, Elizabeth Edwards cancer has gone to the bone. There is no cure for this, it is only treatable. She may have years left, but not as many as one might think, or not many at all.

Do we want someone in office, who, 2, 3 years during his presidency, may very well be dealing with a dying spouse?

I don't know that I would trust the decison making ability of someone whose wife and mother of his children is in such a condition.

That's all.

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I think the press conference by the Edwards' the other day made the fact that her cancer isn't curable pretty clear. I don't know how it could have been made any more clear.

I don't like Edwards and it is highly unlikely I'd ever vote for him but his wife's cancer wouldn't make or break any decision for me. If people vote with the expectation that the President can't have any personal family issues then there isn't anyone that should be running.

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fishin wrote:

I think the press conference by the Edwards' the other day made the fact that her cancer isn't curable pretty clear. I don't know how it could have been made any more clear.

I don't like Edwards and it is highly unlikely I'd ever vote for him but his wife's cancer wouldn't make or break any decision for me. If people vote with the expectation that the President can't have any personal family issues then there isn't anyone that should be running.

Didn't see that press conference....just the information I mentioned.

There is a difference between a personal family issue, and a personal family issue that involves a death.

You can't compare a situation where death is involved, with most other things that would come up.

For instance, my spouse received surgery a few years ago that was botched. Turns out that the surgeon was going through a similar "family issue" His wife was dying, and he was unable to keep his mind, for that one moment, where it should have been, his patient. We learned that he had been an excellent surgeon, and highly regarded by his peers, until this came up.

I would venture dealing with the situation of your wife dying while trying to hold the office of president would be beyond most people....This is not your twins going bar hopping.

Do you feel you could carry out your duties to the American public if your child or wife where dying, and you had known this was a very good possibility before being elected?

I couldn't.

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Chai wrote:

fishin wrote:
I think the press conference by the Edwards' the other day made the fact that her cancer isn't curable pretty clear. I don't know how it could have been made any more clear.

I don't like Edwards and it is highly unlikely I'd ever vote for him but his wife's cancer wouldn't make or break any decision for me. If people vote with the expectation that the President can't have any personal family issues then there isn't anyone that should be running.

Didn't see that press conference....just the information I mentioned.

There is a difference between a personal family issue, and a personal family issue that involves a death.

You can't compare a situation where death is involved, with most other things that would come up.

For instance, my spouse received surgery a few years ago that was botched. Turns out that the surgeon was going through a similar "family issue" His wife was dying, and he was unable to keep his mind, for that one moment, where it should have been, his patient. We learned that he had been an excellent surgeon, and highly regarded by his peers, until this came up.

I would venture dealing with the situation of your wife dying while trying to hold the office of president would be beyond most people....This is not your twins going bar hopping.

Do you feel you could carry out your duties to the American public if your child or wife where dying, and you had known this was a very good possibility before being elected?

I couldn't.

What's the alternative? For the two of you to give up all your hopes and dreams, the things you've worked hard on for years?

EE said it well when she stated that she's in zero pain whatsoever. Basically they would be sitting at home with nothing to do, while she isn't feeling bad. Doesn't make sense to me.

Cycloptichorn

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Cycloptichorn wrote:

What's the alternative? For the two of you to give up all your hopes and dreams, the things you've worked hard on for years?

EE said it well when she stated that she's in zero pain whatsoever. Basically they would be sitting at home with nothing to do, while she isn't feeling bad. Doesn't make sense to me.

Cycloptichorn

Yes, I think stepping out of the race is the alternative I would take.
If Edwards truly cares about the course of this country, that should matter to him more than his personal quests over the years.

If Edwards cannot say with absolute certainty that in the case that 2, 3, 4 years from now, his is dying a painful death (or even God-willing, not painful death), that this would not effect his job performance as President of the U.S. he should do the noble thing and step down.

Yes, at this point in time Elizabeth is in no pain. What will next year, or the year after bring? Pain from bone cancer is very bad.

Being the president is the ultimate position of service to the people. If there is any doubt a person will not be able to give 100%, they need to pass on the opportunity to serve.

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Chai wrote:

Being the president is the ultimate position of service to the people. If there is any doubt a person will not be able to give 100%, they need to pass on the opportunity to serve.

given the way life is, you pretty much end up with zippo candidates, as no one can be sure that they'll always be giving 100%

People's parents are older - kids have accidents - people get sick.

~~~~~~

You don't get out of here alive.

~~~~~~

Dealing with it (life/death) in a strong, positive, way seems like a great indicator of someone who would be able to manage lesser issues on a national/global scale.

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Hmmm. It's impossible to know, of course, and if you don't want to vote for him, don't vote for him.

But to me, a surgeon and someone in Edwards' position are very different situations. Edwards has gone through the emotional wringer already. His young son died. He's been through political campaigns that absolutely require emotional equanimity (just ask Howard Dean). He's been in the public eye for a very long time, has had many trials by fire.

You didn't say how the surgeon's wife died... was it sudden? If Elizabeth dies while John Edwards is in the White House, he will have had at least two years to adjust to the idea. That doesn't mean it will be pleasant, but that kind of processing helps a lot with being able to deal and function.

There are presidents who have dealt with their own or their spouse's severe illness in the past. What was Franklin Roosevelt going through, himself, as he made major, history-shaking decisions?

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That's an excellent point, ehBeth, I hadn't thought of that. In some ways, he's even more of a known quantity when it comes to crisis situations than people who haven't had to deal with something of that scale before.

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ehBeth wrote:

given the way life is, you pretty much end up with zippo candidates, as no one can be sure that they'll always be giving 100%

People's parents are older - kids have accidents - people get sick.

~~~~~~

You don't get out of here alive.

~~~~~~

I knew that would come up.

Yes, we could all be visiting the Grime Reaper at any moment.
Unfortunatley, Elizabeth is more certain that she will be meeting him sooner than most.

I know it sounds cold, but once cancer goes to the bone, it really is only a matter of time.

If Edwards was in office, and Elizabeth takes a turn for the worse, what would the media be proclaiming then? I can see the headlines.

"Edwards unable to carry out duties of office due to emotional stress"

Some people, many actually, do not want to see a female president....Many of these people think that because they are worried she will get her period, or go through menapause, and will nuke the planet.

In my life, there as never been a president in office that at some time the entire country hasn't hated, and said he was doing an awful job.

What will the people say about the job of a man whose wife might be in the worst way during his term of office?

Is this about someones own personal quest or dreams, or about electing someone who can handle the rigors of office, without laying on a chance of extreme personal crisis.

Or, do you think a 3 day bereavement period off work will be enough to get his act back together?

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Re: Elizabeth Edwards - long term

Chai wrote:

I've been hearing over and over the past few days about concerns of Elizabeth Edwards and her health during the campaign. [..]

I'm not sure if the general public is simply unaware, or if the media is just doing its usual business of not providing full information (so they'll have a bigger story later on).

Huh? This story was all over the place after that press conference they gave. Frontpage headline news on all the US news websites I checked that day.

Hell, we even already had two or three threads on it on A2K.

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Re: Elizabeth Edwards - long term

nimh wrote:

Chai wrote:
I've been hearing over and over the past few days about concerns of Elizabeth Edwards and her health during the campaign. [..]

I'm not sure if the general public is simply unaware, or if the media is just doing its usual business of not providing full information (so they'll have a bigger story later on).

Huh? This story was all over the place after that press conference they gave. Frontpage headline news on all the US news websites I checked that day.

Hell, we even already had two or three threads on it on A2K.

As I mentioned above Nimh...

"Didn't see that press conference....just the information I mentioned. "

I have not turned on the television for about 3 or 4 days. This is off the radio.

Also, I did not know there were other threads about this very subject. However, I didn't (and still don't) feel it's a catastrophy another one was started.

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To wit:

Elizabeth Edwards, "I'm still here".

Edwards suspends campaign. (he didnt, of course, as became clear in the course of the thread).

Chai wrote:

If Edwards cannot say with absolute certainty that in the case that 2, 3, 4 years from now, his is dying a painful death (or even God-willing, not painful death), that this would not effect his job performance as President of the U.S. he should do the noble thing and step down. [..]

Being the president is the ultimate position of service to the people. If there is any doubt a person will not be able to give 100%, they need to pass on the opportunity to serve.

I would never phrase the issue as a question of egoism on his part, the way you seem to do ("If Edwards truly cares about the course of this country, that should matter to him more than his personal quests over the years"). He is obviously sincerely convinced - partly, probably, because he's gone through this before when their child died - that he can indeed give the job his 100% if he got elected, despite of this.

But yes, I am actually an Edwards supporter of sorts (I like him better than the other Dems), but I also do worry a bit about this question.

The allegations/insinuations that some raised about how it was egoist for Edwards to go on toward his wife, and that if love were truly more important to him than his career, he should bow out - those, I think, were pretty persuasively put to rest in two articles about what fellow cancer patients said that I posted on one of the other threads.

But yeah, this seems to me more of an issue - if we know that there is a large chance that he might have to go through the deepest possible life-crisis right when he would be President, is it still a good idea for him to become President in the first place? Obviously, he believes that he can give his 100% anyway, and she does too, and the fact that theyve lost a child together before and learnt to deal with that speaks for their argument, so I wouldnt ever discount his choice to keep on running. But the question is rather for the voters - do they share the same trust in his capacity to overcome, when crunch time comes? Or would they rather not risk it?

I think thats a legitimate enough question, and it will surely come back with full force if in the end run, Edwards actually looks like he has a good chance of winning.

I dunno. Of course, one can easily throw in a quip about GWB and the number of days, weeks, months he spent on holidays in Texas bicycling and clearing brush - or reference his apparent ignorance, on the eve of the Iraq war that he pushed, of the difference between Sunnis and Shiites - I mean, its not like he gave it 100%. But then, you want something better than GWB anyway, so thats no standard.

Yeah, I wasnt reassured about this myself either. But one thing that Sozobe said just now makes a lot of sense to me. It's just an afterthought she posted:

Quote:

What was Franklin Roosevelt going through, himself, as he made major, history-shaking decisions?

I mean, thats a really good point. Roosevelt was the best US President of the 20th century. But he was severely disabled.

If the pre-election litmus test had been phrased in your words, Chai, as, "If there is any doubt a person will not be able to give 100%, they need to pass on the opportunity to serve", then Roosevelt would have failed it, and never become President.

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Re: Elizabeth Edwards - long term

Chai wrote:

I have not turned on the television for about 3 or 4 days. This is off the radio.

I see. OK, I'd just say that if you havent actually watched the news (or read the papers, apparently), it's probably better to refrain from stuff about "the media just doing its usual business of not providing full information".

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Roosevelt, absolutely.

Kennedy and his debilitating back pain.

Were both of them unfit to be President of the U.S.?

~~~~~~~

Personally, I think they're two great examples of how strong people manage under duress.

I think more of Edwards than to think he wouldn't be able to deal with this. He and his wife have, I think, proven several times that they are strong and capable.

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What if Elizabeth Edwards lives 5 or 6 more years and sees another Democrat win the White House?

Her last memories will be that her sickness possibly cost her life partner the Presidency.

What wife does not want her husband, if he's in government, to be President?

What mother does not want her children to the children of a President?

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If Laura Bush were to unexpectedly announce that she has a stage 4, incurable cancer, would that mean that George Bush would not be fit to continue his presidency and should resign?

If Hillary Clinton manages to make it into the White House and Bill Clinton has another episode of heart failure, would she not be fit to continue her presidency and need to resign?

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kelticwizard wrote:

What if Elizabeth Edwards lives 5 or 6 more years and sees another Democrat win the White House?

Her last memories will be that her sickness possibly cost her life partner the Presidency.

What wife does not want her husband, if he's in government, to be President?

I would think there are many, just as there will be many husbands who don't want their wives to become president once the gender block is shattered.

Colin Powell, who had a realistic shot, is said to have turned down the chance because of the wishes of his wife.

What mother does not want her children to the children of a President?

I would hope there are many.

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Elizabeth Edwards - long term

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