Abid wrote:Do you not know how confession works?
I see that your characterization reveals your ignorance of the matter you discuss. I know how the Roman Catholic Church
says that one particular component among the manifold components of the Sacrament of Penance known as "
Confession" works with respect to the several other components constituting the Sacrament of Penance which must be satisfied for the penitant to gain absolution.
Quote:Does the priest not act as an intercessor between man and God?
No. Church teaching, difficult as it may be for you to understand, it is that not a priest as a man but rather Holy Mother Church through the consecrated office of ordained priest which serves as the vehicle by which a penitant, at the will and volition and by the actions, both intent and deed, of that penitent, may - not
WILL, but rather and most emphatically
MAY - attain absolution. It is required that all conditions prescribed in the Sacrament of Penance be met for absolution to obtain.
Quote:Does he not, tell you "your sins are forgiven" ?
Yes, he does, as but one of the manifold components of the Sacrament of Penance, further invariably and explicitly advising the penitent of the conditions required for absolution, making clear that forgiveness of sins is by God alone and predicate upon the fulfilment of the entirety of those conditions prescribed by Holy Mother Church in accordance with and by the authority of God the Father as declared in the works and words of Christ the Savior, Son of God. Sin is not absolved by the words of a priest, but rather is absolved through the fulfillment of the duties and obligations of the Sacrament of Penance.
Quote:Just because Christ died on the cross - Does that really mean he died for all our sins?
According to that derivant of the Abrahamic Mythopaeia styled Christianity it does ... foundationally. That is Christianity's key teaching.
Abid wrote:What has this got to do with Islam being the truth? The truth is development and science is done by men, not religions!!! So what are you trying to prove?
I'm "
trying to prove" nothing; the evidence is clear by the historic record.
As the article you quote makes abundantly clear, first, much of what we have today of the knowledge of the ancients, both Western and Oriental, we have because that knowledge was preserved, catalogued, transmitted, and, unarguably in some cases expanded upon, by scholars associated with Islam, not because they originated it. Secondly, the article makes abundantly clear as well that increasingly conservative secular thought and authority within Islam by the 15th Century effectively had extinguished the light previously shed by Islamic scholarship on humankind's quest for knowledge and understanding. Conversely, over the past half millenium, Western thought, discovery, and invention has brought humankind greater material and intellectual advance than humankind had achieved for itself since learning to walk upright.
Quote:Industry - are you telling me Arabian countries have no industry?
Of course not. I am asking you what industry have Arabic countries originated, and I am asking you what benefits of such Industry as exists in Islamic lands have been confered not upon the ruling oligarchies of those lands but upon the peoples of those lands?
Quote: - There leaders are foolish western puppets who are lulled by power and riches but that occurs in many places. Western dominance is nothing to be proud of here - IMF and world bank slowly sucking the life out of every country, making the rich richer and the poor their whipping boys. It is the nature of capitalism that runs this world.
Islamic law would order every person to give 2.5% of their wealth to poor. This formula would negate poverty. But no, companies would rather burn warehouses full of crops to ensure prices remain competitive.
I submit that is mere excuse-seeking through unsubstantiable claim of victimhood. All but institutionalized by Islam, greed and corruption rampant within the upper tiers of Islamic society enables Western economic dominance of Islamic lands. I note as well that nowhere on the planet but in Islamic lands is there any greater disparity of concentration of wealth and power between an elite few and a disadvantaged, disenfranchised, despairing general populace. By the evidence, Islam engenders poverty, ignorance, oppression, and oligarchy ... symbiotically.
Quote:Education is very important in Islam and so is knowledge, in the middle ease there are many centres for learning known as madrasah. The main aim of these schools is to teach the people about Islam. Many of these schools have schemes set up to ensure even at degree and masters level, people receive free education, including room and board and three meals a day.
What apart from that which serves to perpetuate and reinforce the isolation of Islamic Society from the World Community and the benefits of education, science, democracy, liberty, and prosperity is taught in madrassas? Through such institutions, Islam condemns itself and its followers to a worldview unimproved, undeveloped, unexpanded in over half a millenium. Effectively, Islam imposes upon its followers a worldview - and the predicate consequences of that worldview, which in the Western world was left behind at the close of the Medeival Period. By the evidence, Islamic claim to the contrary notwithstanding,
THAT is the demonstrated "
TRUTH" of Islam
as it is practiced, regardless what its apologists may
say of its values, principals, and practice. Whatever claim to being of benefit to humankind and the human condition Islam might once have had, it abandoned and repudiated many centuries ago.
Note: to clarify, I make clear - leaving apart any consideration of spirituality - I endorse no organized religion; in terms of "Divinely Revealed Truth" and claim to authority derived thereby and teachings proceeding therefrom, I hold all in essentially equal regard - which regard would be at the most charitable unconvincedly dismissive and, in large, approaching, in many instances achieving, absolute contempt and disgust.
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