65
   

Don't tell me there's no proof for evolution

 
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 08:19 am
spendius wrote:
Setanta wrote-

Quote:
If you have a basis for asserting a more complex definition of "fit," then present your evidence.


I think your ideas on "fit" are confused. You switch from individuals to species just as it suits you. It is already well recognised that advances in medical science risk endangering the species as a whole. How can someone with a weak immune system be deemed "fit" simply because they contribute to a birth?
There you have it spendi.. You failed to answer Set's question. You rambled on about "fit" using your definition as if nothing here had previously been said. Where is it "well recognized" that advances in medical science risk the species as a whole? It changes our environment but to claim it risks the species ignores the fact that when more of a species exists it is more likely to survive a catastrophic event.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 09:05 am
Well- risk is a strange word.

It has been said, though I claim poetic licence in describing it, that if porrige is analysed and a certain compound in it isolated and prepared in quantity and then fed neat to rats, if it gives them cancer then there's a "risk" of getting cancer from eating porrige. That trick is used quite a lot these days only possibly not quite so ridiculously as I just did for educational purposes.

When the first astronauts returned from the moon a great deal of money (time and effort really) was given to making sure they hadn't brought back with them some lergie which would wipe everybody on earth out. A "risk" was thought to be present.

The bird-flu propaganda moves along the same tracks.

I used the word "risk" not in any absolute sense. I thought it was fairly well known that immune systems are weakened by medical science which is great news for medical science. I think Ivan Illich has a book about it called Medical Nemesis.

I don't make stuff up. I might stretch it a bit for fun.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 09:09 am
BTW- I chose porrige because it is one of the healthiest foods known to mankind and readers of my above post should not get the impressioin that it is otherwise.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 10:31 am
spendi[/B]
Quote:
He self-evidently has no answers to any of the points raised in my post to which he has tangentially touched at an infinitessimal point on the curve.
.
You flatter yourself by thinking that anyone would wish to jump in an sort out your fevered ramblings.
BTW "tangientally touching at an infinitessimal point on the curve " is a sloppy phrase . Try being precise and concise. Maybe your "wit" would poke through the offal.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 10:38 am
PS, I call him "Set" cause he hates it when people do that.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 11:40 am
It was a "curved ball" jest which I couldn't quite find the right words for in the time I had.

Had my post been a "googly" you would have played down the wrong line and been bowled round the back of your legs.

I find it almost incredible that anyone could invent baseball because they jolly well weren't going to play that boring silly game they have just run away from.

That has all the spite of the wronged woman in it.
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rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 12:46 pm
farmerman wrote:
Very Happy SET, dont you ever dare lecture me again for attempting to carry on a conversation to pry sense out of suspendius. Hes friggin hopeless. He nicely demonstrates his utter ignorance of biological fitness( amongsts a plethora of other concepts) , then he attempts to susbtitute items from his own dimension in theirplace. Hes a dim bulb parading as a budgie that has had a few blank phrases in his training program.

AWKKKK Thorsten Veblen, Graaaawk George Le Meitre, AAAWK.

Dont you dare. Very Happy

Awwwkkkk, that was a riot, Graaawwwwkk Smile

Can I still lecture you both for wasting your own time by even reading a spendi spew?
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 12:48 pm
Now, where were we before spendi succeeded in turning the discussion to himself (as usual)?
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 03:20 pm
Very Happy . What....me worry?
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 03:24 pm
Yes, FM, i succumbed . . . i lowered myself into the swill and conversed with Spurious . . . but i promise you, it will never happen again. After all, he demonstrated conclusively that he doesn't understand any part of the concept under discussion, so there's nothing further in need from the gobshite.

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa . . .
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 03:26 pm
3HM's and a PAofC. Go and sin nomo
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 04:26 pm
I bet that's the first time Settin' Aah-aah has apologised, except phony ones I mean, since he left school.

It isn't as if he had run into the back of my car or anything. What he apologised for he sat there, coldly and calculatingly, at his keyboard and banged out.

And within just a few hours he's sorry. Aaaaah!

He must not know which way up he is.

We were talking about risk I think before fm started with the personal attacks in order to try to cover up his inability to discuss it. And it is a key factor in science. Splitting hairs.

I ask fair minded Americans to witness this debacle and try to imagine what would happen if we put that wing in charge. ros as janitor of course. fm at the big desk and Settin' lowering in an office down the hall complete with vanity mirror. wande surfing the web to find out what people are saying about them in media they don't control.

It's a good job I have to be at the pub shortly to find out what the masses are thinking. I could run away with it.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 04:43 pm
I didn't apologize to you, you nattering gobshite, i apologized to FM. You can't even follow a simple sentence, can you?
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 05:03 pm
Joe from Chicago had the best "Nome de spume" he simply effered to you-know-who, as that annoying buzz in the background.. Drove you-know-who nutz.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 06:13 pm
fm wrote-

Quote:
Joe from Chicago had the best "Nome de spume" he simply effered to you-know-who, as that annoying buzz in the background..


Yeah-- 20 years after I had been described in a newspaper in exactly the same way.

Joe's a bit behind the times you know. He does old and gone cold cliches.

Have you not noticed?
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Nov, 2007 06:17 pm
Settin' Aah-aah wrote-

Quote:
I didn't apologize to you, you nattering gobshite, i apologized to FM. You can't even follow a simple sentence, can you?


I think some of our viewers can. I can at least.

Hey fm- he's addressing me again. Isn't that what he had just apologised for doing.

Listen Settin'. Buy a helium balloon and let it go. That's up.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 04:25 pm
A new hypothesis on the primordial soup....I understand the the origins of life is not really on topic in an evolution thread, but here you go.



http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=110802&org=NSF&from=news


December 4, 2007
Earth's first life may have developed between the layers of a chunk of layered mica sitting like a multilayered sandwich in the primordial soup, according to a new hypothesis. The so called "soup and sandwich" mica hypothesis, which was developed by Helen Hansma of the National Science Foundation (NSF), proposes that that the compartments between layers of mica -- a common mineral that cleaves into smooth sheets -- could have provided the shelter and protection needed for molecules to reorganize into cells.

Hansma will present her "soup and sandwich" mica hypothesis at the annual meeting of the American Society for Cell Biology in Washington D.C,. on December 4, 2007.

Hansma says that her "soup and sandwich" mica hypothesis is supported by several lines of evidence, including the many chemical and physical similarities between a cell interior and the space between mica sheets. For example, both environments are potassium-rich and negatively-charged. Such similarities suggest that mica "would have provided a very hospitable environment to the earliest biomolecules," says Hansma.

In addition, the confined spaces formed by mica layers would have provided the isolation needed for Darwinian evolution. What's more, the expansion, contraction and movements of the mica sheets caused by temperature changes and ocean currents would have helped rearrange molecules and trigger the formation of bonds between them, as required for life to originate.

Providing further support to the Hansma mica hypothesis is the close proximity between a huge mica formation in Greenland to rock formations where ancient life is believed to have existed.

Other hypotheses about the origins of life include the idea that life originated in a prebiotic "soup" in ancient oceans. However, the so-called "soup" hypothesis can't explain how the earliest biomolecules -- sloshing around, unprotected in liquid -- would have joined, stayed together and organized into the complex structures of life. Another hypothesis known as the "pizza" hypothesis says that the earliest cells developed on mineral surfaces on land. But this hypothesis can't explain how those cells would have obtained the right amount of water to survive.

Hansma's passion for mica dates back to the 1980s, when she began her NSF-funded work developing pioneering techniques in biological atomic force microscopy (AFM), an imaging technique.

"We put our samples on mica, because it is so atomically flat, so flat that we can see even bare DNA molecules as little ridges on the mica surface," said Hansma. "The layered mineral is made of sheets so thin (one nanometer) that there are a million of them in a millimeter-thick sheet of mica."

Hansma came upon her "soup and sandwich" mica hypothesis one day last spring when -- still a mica devotee -- she was splitting some mica under her dissecting microscope. She had collected the specimens in a mica mine in Connecticut. The mica was covered with organic material. "As I was looking at the organic crud on the mica, it occurred to me that this would be a good place for life to originate -- between these sheets that can move up and down in response to water currents which would have provided the mechanical energy for making and breaking bonds," said Hansma.

Hansma summed up her hypothesis of the origin of life by saying, "I picture all the molecules of early life evolving and rearranging among mica sheets in a communal fashion for eons before budding off with cell membranes and spreading out to populate the world."

-NSF-
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 06:20 pm
I'm sorry mappie, but when I got to "may" I just gave up.

Are there any more in the rest of it?
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 07:25 pm
spendius wrote:
I'm sorry mappie, but when I got to "may" I just gave up.

Are there any more in the rest of it?


If you don't want to read a well written arguement agaist what you believe, your probably not qualified to participate in this dialogue. You stoped reading after 4 lines of it, so I then assume you'd understand if others did the same to you.

I'll advice you to make your posts more concise and begin making them more potent.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 12:30 am
spendius wrote:
I'm sorry mappie, but when I got to "may" I just gave up.

Are there any more in the rest of it?



I'm glad the great thinkers of history didn't stop at "may" like you did spendi. But then again, you're not a great thinker are you?
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