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UNBELIEVABLE! Ashcroft Wants Broader Anti-Terror Powers

 
 
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 01:05 pm
Ashcroft Wants Broader Anti-Terror Powers
By JESSE J. HOLLAND
The Associated Press - Thursday, June 5, 2003; 2:28 PM

WASHINGTON - Attorney General John Ashcroft asked Congress Thursday for expanded powers to hold suspected terrorists indefinitely before trials and to let him seek the death penalty or life imprisonment for any terrorist act.

Ashcroft told the House Judiciary Committee that the 2001 Patriot Act signed into law after the Sept. 11 attacks should also be expanded to let prosecutors bring charges against anyone who supports or works with suspected terrorist groups as "material supporters."

"The law has several weaknesses which terrorists could exploit, undermining our defenses," Ashcroft said.

Ashcroft, who held up copies of al-Qaida's declarations of war against America and read aloud some of the names of those killed in the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, said new penalties in the USA Patriot Act have helped the Justice Department prevent more terrorist attacks in America.

Ashcroft also said the department did not break any laws despite an internal Justice Department report that criticized the government's treatment of illegal aliens held after the attacks.

The department's inspector general found "significant problems" in the Bush administration's actions toward 762 foreigners held on immigration violations after the attacks. Only one, Zacarias Moussaoui, has been charged in the United States with a terrorism-related crime; 505 have been deported.

Some of the Sept. 11 detainees were held for up to eight months, although most were deported before a 90-day deadline for releasing them.

Ashcroft said department policy, "for which we do not apologize," is to detain people who are in the country illegally for as long as it takes to clear them before they are deported.

He also said the Justice Department would investigate allegations of abuse of the detainees, although 14 of 18 cases referred so far already have been cleared without any charges being filed. "We do not stand for abuse," Ashcroft said.

The USA Patriot Act granted the government broad new powers to use wiretaps, electronic and computer eavesdropping and searches, and the authority to access a wide range of financial and other information in its investigations.

Under the threat of the increased USA Patriot Act penalties, several detainees are cooperating with the Justice Department to reduce their sentences, Ashcroft said.

"Since September 11, we have obtained criminal plea agreements, many under seal, from more than 15 individuals who, according to the agreement and in order to have the agreement carried out, will continue and must continue to cooperate with the government in its investigation of terrorists," he said.

One person gave federal officials intelligence on terrorist weapons stored in the United States, while another has identified places being scouted or cased for potential attacks by al-Qaida, he said.

"With the Patriot Act and our prevention strategy, we can point to steady progress in America's war on terrorism," he said.

Several Democrats complained about the department's use of the new anti-terrorism powers. "We are concerned about the way you have used your powers, the way you have detained immigrants," said Rep. Maxine Waters, D-Calif.

Added Rep. Howard Berman, D-Calif.: "Some of us find that the collateral damage is greater than it needs to be in the conduct of this war."

House Judiciary Committee Chairman James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., says he is sensitive to civil liberties complaints. "To my mind, the purpose of the Patriot Act is to secure our liberties and not undermine them," he said.

Sensenbrenner complained earlier this year that the department wasn't sharing enough information with lawmakers for them to judge how the act is working. That lack of information has made it unlikely that he will support expanding the department's powers, or renewing its current authority when the act expires in October 2005, Sensenbrenner said in April.

"My support for this legislation is neither perpetual or unconditional," he said Thursday.

Since then, the Justice Department has answered dozens of written questions from the House Judiciary Committee and has sent several Justice Department officials to testify before it.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 2,153 • Replies: 39
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 02:21 pm
BBB

Incredible as this may seem, at the moment I am more interested in being protected from John Ashcroft than from any terrorists.

Don't get me wrong -- the terrorists scare the hell out of me and I hope there is plenty in place to protect me from them.

But thoughts of Ashcroft can wake me from a deep sleep. This guy I truly fear.

Give him more powers!!!

I'd sooner give a live handgrenade to a pre-schooler.
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 02:27 pm
BBB - In balancing the security of US citizens and the rights of illegal immigrants who may or may not wish us harm, I'm willing to come down a little more on the security side right now.

That written, elements of the Patriot Act do concern me, and I think we need to keep a watchful eye--as watchful as is possible--on the actions our government takes in the name of that security.
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au1929
 
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Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 03:11 pm
The head of the Gestapo does not need any more power. What he needs to do is to shorten the time between arrest and deportation and or release. In addition the facilities and conditions of internment needs by all reports much improvement.
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 03:13 pm
Au,

When you use a word like gestapo in reference to American institutions I take notice!

I have not been too concerned about the civil liberties fears but maybe it warrants a second look.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 03:24 pm
Craven
Maybe Gestapo is too strong a word to use. However, his moves sure do point in that direction. In Nazi Germany I understand at times people were arrested and the next time they were heard from was the delivery of a box of ashes to their families.
We are not to that stage however, we are arresting or detaining people and holding them incommunicado. That does not sound like American justice to me.
0 Replies
 
Scipio
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 03:59 pm
No, when people were arrested their families never heard from them again. Now, terrorists in Guantamo Bay, for example, are treated in the most humane way possible. They are given "rooms with a view" if you will, decent food, congregating time, and there's even a sign pointing which way Mecca is. America is far, very far, from the Gestapo.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 04:03 pm
Ashcroft claims they have broken no laws in holding illegal immigrants without charge. He says they need more laws to protect the American people. He uses the reasoning that they have contained terrorist activities in the US since 9-11. c.i.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 04:05 pm
Scipio wrote:
... and there's even a sign pointing which way Mecca is. America is far, very far, from the Gestapo.


Ever heard of the German sign at the Concnetration Camp entrances "Arbeit macht frei" (~ Work brings Freedom)?
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 04:36 pm
here's your soap, the showers are that way.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 04:44 pm
Wow!!!

And I thought my feelings about John Ashcroft were extreme.

The guy sure has a fan club here.
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ebrown p
 
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Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 06:14 pm
Scipio wrote:
No, when people were arrested their families never heard from them again. Now, terrorists in Guantamo Bay, for example, are treated in the most humane way possible. ... America is far, very far, from the Gestapo.


Scipio, there is no proof that there are *any* terrorists in Guantanamo Bay.

If there were proof, I assume they would be tried and punished according to international law. These people some of which *might* be terrorists -- according to the government who has given no proof and has lied about other things -- are not given the chance to talk with their families and have been imprisoned for 18 months of there lives.

I will tell you, if I was imprisoned for 18 months of my life without being charged with a crime (much less being given a chance to prove my innocence) ... I would be upset.

I agree with you that America is very far from the Gestapo. My concern is how much closer we have moved.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 06:20 pm
Frank

My grandmother (who I loved dearly) had rather strongly held views based on a radical view of the book of Revelations. She was convinced that the Antichrist would topple democracy to create a "One World" government. He would start by whittling down the rights of unsuspecting Americans.

At the time I tolerated what I considered her extreme views and usually turned the conversation to other more mundane topics.

Now I am beginning to think that perhaps she was right... only she was convinced the Antichrist would be a Democrat.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 06:31 pm
Scipio wrote:
They are given "rooms with a view" ...


LOL, in the beginning many thought the cages were inhumane (I personally didn't care much), that the "open air cells" were wrong.

But now I see that we were gracious to put them in "rooms with a view". We didn't need to improve their living conditions.

:-)
0 Replies
 
CodeBorg
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 07:28 pm
Has the government ever campaigned to curtail it's powers?

Seems pretty one-sided to be constantly growing like that.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 07:38 pm
entropy
0 Replies
 
Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:16 pm
No, no - remember:

Attack = Deterrence
War = Peace

Now:

Repression = Security


Some Englishman, name like 'Gorwill'/'Orbell', wrote something about that sort of relabelling. Couldn't happen, could it now?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jun, 2003 05:59 pm
Fear = Our government
Our government = Fear
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jun, 2003 06:19 pm
The worst act of terrorism is a government against its own citizens in the name of freedom.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jun, 2003 06:43 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Ashcroft claims they have broken no laws in holding illegal immigrants without charge. He says they need more laws to protect the American people. He uses the reasoning that they have contained terrorist activities in the US since 9-11. c.i.


That last part kinda reminds of the elephant repellant CdK uses . . .

. . . well, you don't see any elephants around here, do you?
0 Replies
 
 

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