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Suicide By a Friend

 
 
Mc Cobb
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:36 pm
My brothers dead,How am I 2 feel?
How are we to feel when someone we know dies from an apparent suicide? I was emotional as expected but quickly remembered his life, constantly pulling his reality into a dark realm. Do souls create their own challenges before birth to perpetuate them after death? Are they souls trapped in a reality they don't belong in? Can we be nothing more that life energy trapped inside matter moving it for fun, never really the person in our reflections? I have spent many years meditating daily on death. Not scared of it, just looking at it like a mountain I am going to climb someday. I want to pass through Death's doors with full intent. Sick or healthy, death will come. Is what you think going to change what is on the other side? I am calm when I think of death. How can I be scared of what so many souls before me have been through? Have I been through death before? Is sleeping a form of dieing?
Mc Cobb
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:38 pm
Hello and welcome Mc Cobb. Interesting avatar. My own perceptions are quite different from yours. Don't know how to answer you.
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:47 pm
McCobb--

Welcome to A2K.

Edgar--

Have you encountered this bit by Wordsworth?

Quote:
Our birth is but a sleep and a forgetting:
The Soul that rises with us, our life's Star,
Hath had elsewhere its setting,
And cometh from afar:
Not in entire forgetfulness,
And not in utter nakedness,
But trailing clouds of glory do we come
From God, who is our home:
Heaven lies about us in our infancy!
Shades of the prison-house begin to close
Upon the growing Boy,
But He beholds the light, and whence it flows,
He sees it in his joy;
The Youth, who daily farther from the east
Must travel, still is Nature's Priest,
And by the vision splendid
Is on his way attended;
At length the Man perceives it die away,
And fade into the light of common day.






I find "clouds of glory" a useful notion when dealing with a shrieking, screaming baby. Blinded by the light, and all that--it isn't the shrieking, screaming baby's fault.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:50 pm
WELCOME Mc Cobb. Im on record that the only thing I fear about death is dying stupidly. I dont want my windshield to be the last thing going through my head. Years ago, a very good HS friend died in an accident. He was an electrical contractor whose screwdriver slipped on a hot circuit and he was electrocuted. He is spoken about with jokes at HS reunions (Ive heard that for I never go to HS reunions).
I always play the obit headlines in my mind before I do some sort of extreme boatsmanship. "Man sinks boat while steering through tankers wake"
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:52 pm
It's been almost 40 years since I read much of Wordsworth. Always had a good opinion of his work.

I've been reflecting of late how close to death we all are, from infancy to the final encounter. Like death is an entity, almost a sentient being, always in the room. Guess it's my age.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:54 pm
I have never been afraid of death; I figure when my time comes, there's nothing I can do about it. In the mean time, I try to squeeze in as much fun as possible.
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 08:56 pm
Edgar--

An Eastern idea that I can't footnote properly:

From birth to 20-25 we are children.

From 25-50 (or so) we are movers and shakers in this world.

Beginning at 50 or 60 (or so) we begin to contemplate the meaning of life and the significance of the eternal.

Quote:
Like death is an entity, almost a sentient being, always in the room. Guess it's my age.


It's your age--age brings wisdom and the ability to accept the inevitable.
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:00 pm
I make him stay on the other end of the room.
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:01 pm
Excellent, thoughtful thread, edgar.
I'm reading along with great interest.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:16 pm
Quote:
age brings wisdom and the ability to accept the inevitable


Sometimes, to some. There are old cowardly fools and young people with older souls.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:26 pm
ossobuco wrote:
I think suicide is reasonable, or versions of it, y'know, letting go...

Well, letting go and not shimmies, let me guess.



Well, I said this, but then...

I really like what Farmer said just before me, something about failure of positive clinical outcome. Sheeet, I always listen to Farmer.
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:30 pm
Yep, the farmerman is right, as usual.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:34 pm
ok, ok, Margo, we'll deal with this together... calmo'!
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:36 pm
Margo, it might have to do with living wages. People seriously need tips here, or at least some do,
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:37 pm
Aack, I have mixed up threads. Pardon me.
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CalamityJane
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 09:58 pm
The only time I came close to a person who committed suicide,
was with Joanne Dorell here at a2k. And without knowing here, I felt somewhat guilty. I thought, maybe there was an indication, an outcry for help, a sign that we have not recognized. It's silly, but it had left a sour
note for a while.

And this is probably the worst feeling a family, and close friends can have
when a person commits suicide, the guilt they feel. There is no closure
to it and there never will be.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Jul, 2006 10:17 pm
And some of us knew her slightly well. She was a confused woman with a perplexing history, and some don't believe that she did suicide. But I do.


On Edgar's friend,

I'm a little more bemused than usual, me an admitedly bemused person... because of that part of a work by Carol Shields that I read this morning. The depression of the subject of the story was so entirely liveable to a reader, and it seems to tuck in with your friend, Edgar, the sheer physicality of the depression.

(Yes, I see Farmer's pov)
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jul, 2006 04:50 am
My friend would act her old self in our presence, charming, warm. We knew all about the bad things she had experienced, but honestly had no clue. I would not stand idly by if I knew a person intended to do this.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jul, 2006 05:11 am
I wasnt trying to draw up sides on this issue last night. I was just reflecting on a particular persons suicide from a standpoint of those he left behind, and for what? It was all because he didnt take his medications OR , as has recently been found, that some antidepression medicines often have suicidal tendencies as a side effect until ones body develops a titer of the medication.

Edgar, your original reflections were very well reasoned and appropriate. You grieved and that was that. Dont have second thoughts about whether you could have done anything. When I got into that mode, I wound up feeling guilty and depressed myself. (I actually went to get some counseling). The counselor told me that it was just one final way that the suicide victim had manipulated his family and his friends. My guilt gradually morphed into something else and Ive come out the other side with my own personal philosophy of suicide, and its not very noble nor understanding.
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squinney
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jul, 2006 05:38 am
I was speaking to a resident yesterday whose grandson committed suicide about a month ago. He was deaf, 24. He was bright, had gone to university and become an engineer - top notch, with many offers following graduation. After a short time on his job he was fired because of his deafness. He stepped off a building.

That's tragic. That's when suicide hits you like a ton of bricks.

For the older, terminally ill, I can't say I wouldn't do the same to relieve the pain and spare my family.

But, those with life difficulties like above, I have to agree with Farmerman. They need to know there is support and other choices.

Edgar, my thoughts are with you.
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