Re: Jesus Never Worshipped God.
hephzibah wrote:Scott777ab wrote:I say Jesus never worshipped God.
If you think you can try to PROVE me wrong.
I say you can't.
But you're welcome to try.
Any takers who will provide eviedence?
Neo?
Frank?
Jason?
Anyone?
Jesus worshipped God through His lifestyle. No, I don't think there is actually a scripture where it says Jesus went and "worshipped" God in the manner that we consider worship now a days. However, I also don't believe that worship was ever intended to be what it is now a days either. Go to church sing some songs about God blessing me and then jump right back into a life of hypocrisy later that afternoon or the next day... That's not worship, not in the true sense of the word anyway.
To worship something is to honor or reverence as a divine being or supernatural power as well as to regard it with great or extravagant respect, honor, or devotion. People worship all kinds of things. Money, celebrity's, nature, their career, their beliefs... Not by bowing down and paying homage, so to speak, but by how much credence they give that thing in their life. How much devotion they are willing to give to that thing they esteem as being of utmost importance in their life. If you look at Jesus' life, how He lived the things He did, the things He taught, and so forth, all He did was for God. Not for Himself. That is an ultimate act of worship in and of itself.
John 4
31 In the meantime His disciples urged Him, saying, "Rabbi, eat." 32 But He said to them, "I have food to eat of which you do not know." 33 Therefore the disciples said to one another, "Has anyone brought Him anything to eat?" 34 Jesus said to them, "My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me, and to finish His work.
And later on in this same chapter Jesus went on to talk to the people about worship.
John 4:22-25
22 You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. 24 God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."
If you will notice there is no reference here to singing any songs, doing any dances, shouting any praises or hallelujahs. Rather this speaks to me of living a lifestyle where it is evident that you worship God, because believe me, what we truly worship is evident in how we chose to live our daily life.
That makes sense Heph. Thanks.
I dont know how the above post happened but all I wanted to say was that I saw the situation as a form of compromised bullying.
Dealing with this question is a bit like dealing with the question: Is the sum of 2 plus 2 actually 4.
Scott NEEDS Jesus not to have worshipped the god Jesus obviously worshipped for some reason.
This issue originally came up in another thread immediately after I had mentioned that the "god" that I was referring to was "the god Jesus worshipped."
We were having one of those discussions that included me mentioning that the god of the Bible was a jealous, vindictive, murderous, tyrannical, petty, barbaric piece of shyt...and that the "god of the Bible" was the god Jesus worshipped.
At that point, Scott began this "Jesus did not worship the god of the Bible...Jesus was Jehovah" nonsense.
He then began to demand that I provide proof "that Jesus worshipped the god"...to which I replied (nicely, of course) that he could shove the demand...well...
...he could put it where the sun was unlikely to bleach it.
Anyone actually attempting to provide "proof" that Jesus worshipped the god is doing the kind of thing someone attempting to provide proof that the sum of 2 plus 2 is four. (Ya hear me, Bear!)
This is jumping through hoops...and quite honestly, Scott's arguments are not worth anyone jumping through any hoops. Any sane person reading the Bible realizes that the character "Jesus" in this particular tale...loves, adores, fears, and worships the character "god"...and is advising everyone else to love, adore, fear, and worship the character. The character development in the tale is quite complete...and anyone questioning it is playing a game.
It is an interesting game, Scott...but it is just a game. If you do not see that the character Jesus worships the character god...you simply are willfully avoiding it. Any pretense that you are looking for aid in seeing it...is just that...a pretense.
I still think I'd enjoy having you join the New York/New Jersey contingent for a drink or coffee at the Pan...but you are all-wet on this issue.
See Frank this is where we will NEVER agree.
According to the bible JESUS IS THE FATHER.
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Jhn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Jhn 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
Jhn 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
Jhn 5:23 That all [men] should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
Jhn 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Jhn 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father?
Jhn 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Jhn 16:15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew [it] unto you.
Jhn 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Jhn 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, [art] in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Mat 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and [he] to whomsoever the Son will reveal [him].
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Tts 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jo 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, [even] in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
SIMPLY PUT JESUS IS GOD.
After reading all the load of crap that Scott produced, I still can't see how these delusional individuals mistake the son for the father...the passages are there...can't they even read?
The larger question is... can a Polar Bear join Frank at the Pan for coffee and a drink (ya think?) when he's in the neighborhood?
Frank really got under Scott's skin with that one . . . Scott has started an entire thread to try to disprove the reasonable contention with which Frank has been flogging him.
Setanta wrote:Frank really got under Scott's skin with that one . . . Scott has started an entire thread to try to disprove the reasonable contention with which Frank has been flogging him.
I resent not being counted as one of the floggers.
Scott777ab wrote:Hmmmm. I will re-read this post again when i am more awake. Have 12 hours of work tomorrow.
GOt to get to bed.
O and by the way my SIG are copies of how those people spelled those words when the called me those things.
Declared....
The First Heathen Evangelist: by Lash
A Mental Midget: by Doktor S
A Loony Fanatic: by Setanta
Bigotted: by Sentana
Rash and Impetuous: by Frank Apisa
I ran that through the spell check and only bigotted came out wrong.
But that is what Sentana called me and how he spelled it, I used copy paste on it.
You mean Setanta spelled his name wrong as well?
He can't even spell the name of a dog right...what a shame.
Frank Apisa wrote:Dealing with this question is a bit like dealing with the question: Is the sum of 2 plus 2 actually 4.
Scott NEEDS Jesus not to have worshipped the god Jesus obviously worshipped for some reason.
This issue originally came up in another thread immediately after I had mentioned that the "god" that I was referring to was "the god Jesus worshipped."
We were having one of those discussions that included me mentioning that the god of the Bible was a jealous, vindictive, murderous, tyrannical, petty, barbaric piece of shyt...and that the "god of the Bible" was the god Jesus worshipped.
Frank... I'm not trying to call you out here but honestly... in what conversations concerning "god" do you NOT call Him "jealous, vindictive, murderous, tyrannical, petty, barbaric piece of shyt..."? It's like your trademark... LOL
Quote:At that point, Scott began this "Jesus did not worship the god of the Bible...Jesus was Jehovah" nonsense.
He then began to demand that I provide proof "that Jesus worshipped the god"...to which I replied (nicely, of course) that he could shove the demand...well...
...he could put it where the sun was unlikely to bleach it.
Anyone actually attempting to provide "proof" that Jesus worshipped the god is doing the kind of thing someone attempting to provide proof that the sum of 2 plus 2 is four. (Ya hear me, Bear!)
It was pretty clear he was after a particular group considering he called you all out to see if you would take up the challenge. I thought it might be fun to try and answer though. Sometimes jumping through hoops can prove quite interesting, and well you summed it up quite nicely in the next paragraph actually...
Quote:This is jumping through hoops...and quite honestly, Scott's arguments are not worth anyone jumping through any hoops. Any sane person reading the Bible realizes that the character "Jesus" in this particular tale...loves, adores, fears, and worships the character "god"...and is advising everyone else to love, adore, fear, and worship the character. The character development in the tale is quite complete...and anyone questioning it is playing a game.
It is an interesting game, Scott...but it is just a game. If you do not see that the character Jesus worships the character god...you simply are willfully avoiding it. Any pretense that you are looking for aid in seeing it...is just that...a pretense.
I still think I'd enjoy having you join the New York/New Jersey contingent for a drink or coffee at the Pan...but you are all-wet on this issue.
Scott, you may as well hang up your hat on this one. First of all you have done nothing different than those trying to disprove the bible by posting a single verse of a scripture implying that one thing can mean only what YOU think it means.
Second of all, you can't convince anyone of anything. For you to try is foolish because it's not really your job to do so anyway. The harder you try the more ignorant you will show yourself to be. Why beat yourself over the head with a bat like that?
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:The larger question is... can a Polar Bear join Frank at the Pan for coffee and a drink (ya think?) when he's in the neighborhood?
I can tell you that Blatham, Joe Nation and I would be honored to get totally schnockered with the Bear any time he is in the neighborhood...and we can introduce him to the many police officers with whom we have made acquaintance during the last several years.
Come on up, Bear. We'll meet ya with bells and whistles.
Setanta wrote:Frank really got under Scott's skin with that one . . . Scott has started an entire thread to try to disprove the reasonable contention with which Frank has been flogging him.
Thanks, Set.
Seems our friend Scott here is one of those "declare victory at every opportunity" types.
It seems incredible that the guy is asserting that the Jesus of the Bible did not worship the god of the Bible...
...but he has nothing to lose by pursuing absurd contentions. His entire thesis is a wart.
I like him, though. He has spirit. Now...if he can just figure out which way is UP....
neologist wrote:Setanta wrote:Frank really got under Scott's skin with that one . . . Scott has started an entire thread to try to disprove the reasonable contention with which Frank has been flogging him.
I resent not being counted as one of the floggers.
You've been doing some good flogging, Neo.
Good that despite our considerable differences...we can view Scott's thesis from the same perspective.
hephzibah wrote:
Frank... I'm not trying to call you out here but honestly... in what conversations concerning "god" do you NOT call Him "jealous, vindictive, murderous, tyrannical, petty, barbaric piece of shyt..."? It's like your trademark... LOL
No problem, Heph....and I guess it is a trademark of sorts.
It's just that the theists have been sucking up to the god and calling it loving, kind, compassionate, and responsive to the human predicament (all bullshyt) for so long...I'm having a tough time trying to catch up. Gotta take a shot wherever an opening appears!
Quote:
Quote:At that point, Scott began this "Jesus did not worship the god of the Bible...Jesus was Jehovah" nonsense.
He then began to demand that I provide proof "that Jesus worshipped the god"...to which I replied (nicely, of course) that he could shove the demand...well...
...he could put it where the sun was unlikely to bleach it.
Anyone actually attempting to provide "proof" that Jesus worshipped the god is doing the kind of thing someone attempting to provide proof that the sum of 2 plus 2 is four. (Ya hear me, Bear!)
It was pretty clear he was after a particular group considering he called you all out to see if you would take up the challenge. I thought it might be fun to try and answer though. Sometimes jumping through hoops can prove quite interesting, and well you summed it up quite nicely in the next paragraph actually...
Yer right.
I've jumped through many a hoop in my day...and enjoyed it. And as you've mentioned, it often proved quite interesting. Of course, usually it involves some good looking lady and an ultimate landing in the sack...but...I have jumped through hoops.
FA wrote-
Quote:I'd sooner try to teach quantum mechanics to a weasel!
Looks like Frank has decided to give it a go.
Who actually is this Jesus you're on about?
Sorry, Neo . . . i know that when it comes to flogging moribund equines, you take a back seat to no one.
I wanted to know who this Sentana is, and shake his or her hand . . .
I think he's MOAN's brother.
