HEZBOLLAH AND ISRAEL WIDEN THE CONFLICT

Re: BBB


Or they might be Iranian Revolutionary Guard members fighting with Hezbollah.

Whether or not Persians are fighting with Hezbollah does not alter the particularist nature of the timing of this Israeli action. For the almost 15 years since the Isrealis pulled out of Lebanon, Hezbollah has called for the release of prisoners in Israeli prisons (which has the precedent of past deals in which Israel has released Palestinian or Lebanese prisoners) and the withdrawl of Isreal from the Shebaa farms, a piece of real estate which lies between the Lebanon and Syria, and which Israel only retains because it gives them a foothold in the Lebanon and access to significant water resources (long a focus of Israeli military occupation policies) south of the Bekaa Valley and the Litani River. (O'Bill's suggestion that they kept a "buffer" is horseshit.) Throughout that nearly fifteen year period, Hezbollah has raided across the border into Israel to attempt to capture IDF hostages, and has occassionally succeeded. Throughout that nearly fifteen year period, Hezbollah has from time to time launched rockets into Israel. But it is only now that Israel has responded with such brutal military force, without regard for the citizens of the Lebanon.

The conclusion that Israel chose this particular time to respond as they have is inescapable. The contention that Israel hopes to drag the United States into conflict with Syria and Iran is very plausible. Shortly after the invasion of Iraq, an Israeli member here called for a United States invasion of Iran. This is a consumation long devoutly desired by many Israelis. To attempt to color this phase of Israeli conflict with Hezbollah as somehow different than their previous passages with that group is either naive or disingenuous. The question of "why now?" is inescapable, whether or not knee-jerk conservatives want to entertain it.

Setanta
Set, would you mind posting your above comments on my Isreal thread? It would be an important addition to the discussion.

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=80711&highlight=

Thanks,
BBB

"Why now?"

How about, "It's about time."

I see, McG--you believe that it is long past time for the United States to have attacked Syria and Iran, no?

Nope. It's long past time Israel attacked Hesbullah and decimated the military arm of that terrorist organization.

Were you making a strawman just now with your last post? Why, I do believe you were. Huh.

Not at all, although i'm not surprised that you haven't followed along well enough to understand. I pointed to the question of "why now?" because of the strong implication that Israel would like to involve the United States in a showdown with Syria and Iran. You responded with "It's about time." Therefore, it was completely reasonable for me to assume that you meant it is about time that the United States were involved in a showdown with Syria and Iran.

By the way, you still have not addressed the issue of "why now?" Far more hawkish governments did not in the past choose to launch a massive military operation against the entire nation of the Lebanon including air strikes on the capital, despite Hezabollah raids, kidnappings and missile attacks. Therefore, the question of why they have responded in this manner on this occasion becomes very much to the point. As for "decimating the military arm of that terrorist organization," Israel's deployment of a large brigade-sized force (roughly 7000 troops) has made no appreciable dent, and now they intend to deploy 40,000 more troops, the size of a full army corps. There is no good reason to assume that this will accomplish anything more than upping the butcher bill. How many of the thousands of Lebanese who have been killed and wounded do you think were actually Hezbollah fighters?

You claim McG hasn't followed along, yet it's clear you are the one failing to follow along. You posed the question, "why now," squarely in the context of Israel attacking Hezbollah. In response, McG said, "It's about time," speaking -- unambiguously -- about Israel's attack on Hezbollah. McG said nothing about it being "about time" that the US attacked Syria or Iran, which is only a hypothesis formed in the deep, dark recesses of your mind. It was certainly not reasonable for you to assume McG was referring to any such showdown with Syria and Iran.




As McG said, "about time."

Your question of "why now?" was directly asking why has Israel decided now to retalliate against Hezbullah when, in the past, they did not. You decided that the only reason they have done so would be to try to get the US invloved in a war with Syria and Iran. You consider that "very plausible".

I said "it's about time" that Israel has stopped negotiating with terrorist organizations and that they should have never negotiated with them to begin with as it has led Hezbullah to believe that they can get away with more kidnappings and more missile attacks.

Who cares what past governments have done in regards to terrorist attacks? This government has had enough and they have decided that Hezbullah can no longer be allowed to threaten the people in Israel. I applaud them for the action they have taken.

If the members of Hezbullah we not such cowards, the civilian deaths in lebanon could be entirely avoided, but they use women and children as shields and hide under their skirts. It's unfortunate that they care so little for the people of Lebanon.

Israel finds Hezbollah a formidable force, hints at long cam
Posted on Thu, Aug. 10, 2006
Israel finds Hezbollah a formidable force, hints at long campaign
By Carol Rosenberg and Dion Nissenbaum
McClatchy Newspapers

KIBBUTZ GOSHRIM, Israel - As Israel prepares to expand its war against Hezbollah deeper into southern Lebanon, its army is discovering that its opponent is no ragtag guerrilla force.

Hezbollah fighters are defending their strongholds from a system of well-stocked bunkers that allow them to battle on for days. They're using Russian-made anti-tank rockets in ways that have startled - and killed - their Israeli antagonists. They're proving to be as willing to attack as to defend and run.

Military officers along the northern border now refer to Hezbollah as a serious army and predict that the next phase of the war will be measured in weeks, if not months.

"In these types of wars, a new definition of victory is in place. Nothing like a white flag will arise from a battle of this sort," said Brig. Gen. Ido Nehushtan, the senior Israeli commander who briefed reporters on Thursday. "How do you know when it's over? When it's over."

That suggests a long and bloody campaign that is likely to significantly increase Israeli casualties.

Already, the prospect of an expanded ground war is fraying the support that many Israelis had shown for the war.

The Peace Now movement, which had been supportive of the offensive, called its first protest for Thursday night in Tel Aviv outside the Defense Ministry. The group was founded by left-leaning Israelis during the bitter 1982-85 invasion of Lebanon and was instrumental in organizing protests that turned public opinion against Israel's presence there. Israel withdrew from Lebanon in 2000 after 18 years of troubled occupation.

"Even if the military offensive will be positive and go smoothly, eventually we have to find a way out," said Peace Now Director Yariv Oppenheimer. "And I don't see how we can get out after we get inside."

Three of Israel's most acclaimed authors - Amos Oz, David Grossman and A.B. Yehoshua - called a news conference Thursday to declare their opposition to an expanded offensive.

Israeli troops in Lebanon are facing a tactical dilemma. They're trying to hamper Hezbollah's ability to attack them by constantly moving from village to village, engaging Hezbollah without holding static positions. But that means Hezbollah fighters have been able to return to towns and villages to resume the fight. Despite Israel's airstrikes on roads and bridges, Hezbollah also has been able to resupply, Israelis suspect, using civilian cars to carry missiles, ammunition and reinforcements who pose as civilians.

The strategic predicament became crystal clear Wednesday when Hezbollah fighters killed 15 reserve soldiers, 13 of them near two southern villages with anti-tank missiles. One missile was fired through a building where troops had apparently bivouacked; another pierced Israeli armor.

The first details of a sophisticated underground Hezbollah bunker system emerged Thursday in a Haaretz newspaper article by Israel's most respected military correspondent, Zeev Schiff.

He described well-camouflaged underground bunkers stocked with weeks' worth of food and ammunition. He reported that the bunkers have electricity and, in one instance, air conditioning.

Another dramatic illustration came at this once-idyllic frontier kibbutz, now surrounded by artillery emplacements firing deafening rounds into Lebanon night and day. Israeli officers here gave a video tour of what they said was a command-and-control center captured two days ago in a four-bedroom house in a village called Mis-a-Jebel.

The video showed a night-vision video camera linked to a computer that was capable of firing Russian-made Sagger anti-tank missiles by remote control. The video also showed that the house was stocked with missiles, assault rifles, grenades, rocket launchers and a wall-sized aerial photo of Kiryat Shemona, the Israeli city across the border that's been hit with more than 700 rocket strikes in the past month.

"This is a system we can find in every serious army in the world," said Lt. Col. Olivier Rafowicz.

Rafowicz wouldn't say what happened to the four brothers who lived in the home, but he estimated that it was the headquarters for a 200-fighter Hezbollah operation.

Brig. Gen. Yossi Kuperwasser, until recently chief of intelligence analysis, told McClatchy Newspapers that the network of well-supplied bunkers and tunnels capable of hiding up to 20 fighters has been key to Hezbollah's element of surprise in the two-week ground war.

"They stay in hideouts, and once the Israelis get a little bit farther away, they come out and attack," he said.

Israeli commanders also have been alarmed by the Shiite fighters' unorthodox use of anti-tank missiles. Not only have they fired them on the vaunted armored corps, destroying an undisclosed number of tanks, but they also used them to blast through at least two buildings that Israeli soldiers had taken positions in, with extraordinary lethality.

On Thursday, reporters in the Israeli town of Metulla watched as a Hezbollah rocket struck an Israeli Merkava tank in Lebanon, forcing its crew to abandon it for the safety of another tank. An Israeli recovery vehicle later towed the blackened hulk back to Metulla.

The sheer number of anti-tank rockets also has surprised Israel's military.

"If there is one more tactical surprise, at least to me, it is the number of sophisticated anti-tank missiles that Hezbollah had," said Maj. Gen. Giora Eiland, the former director of Israel's National Security Council. "Most of these new weapons are Russian weapons that have been supplied to Syria. You're talking about the most advanced anti-tank missiles, and the number of these missiles, at least I am a little bit surprised, and I think that the army is surprised as well."

Casualty figures from a month of war suggest lopsided losses. Eighty-two Israeli soldiers have died and Israel claims 550 Hezbollah dead - 150 in the last two days of fighting.

But that fighting, much of it in and around the Christian village of Marjayoun, led to the greatest one-day Israeli death toll of the war on Wednesday when 15 soldiers were killed.

The fighting continued into Thursday, with expectations that the Israeli death toll would rise.

Simon Diab Singer, a Marjayoun resident reached by telephone from Beirut, described heavy fighting that he said began when several hundred Israelis pushed in from the south long before dawn. Nearly 200 people in the village rushed into the church for shelter.

Backed by Merkava tanks and Apache helicopters, the troops went house to house looking for Hezbollah fighters, knocking down doors and firing countless shots, Singer said. Tanks bulldozed through town, rolling over parked vehicles and firing volleys that exploded near the church.

Just outside Marjayoun, the Israelis battled for hours with about 150 Hezbollah fighters, who were firing anti-tank rockets. At daybreak, the shelling quieted somewhat.

From in the church, Singer said it was difficult to judge the number of casualties, but it appeared to residents that Israeli soldiers had holed up in a hospital just outside Marjayoun to regroup and prepare to push farther north. Though not a staunch Hezbollah supporter, Singer said the guerrillas put up a tough fight.

"It was a hell night," he said 12 hours later, adding that much of the town was still burning. "We smell only fire."

Ironically, Marjayoun was the headquarters for the South Lebanon Army, which had been staunchly allied with Israel until it withdrew from Lebanon six years ago. Thousands of SLA members moved to Israel at that time, though many have returned to Lebanon since.
--------------------------------------

Rosenberg reported from Kibbutz Goshrim, Israel; Nissenbaum, from Jerusalem. McClatchy Newspapers correspondent Shashank Bengali in Beirut contributed to this report.

Egypt Says US Losing Credibility in Middle East
Egypt Says US Losing Credibility in Middle East
Reuters
Thursday 10 August 2006

Cairo - Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak said the United States and the West were losing credibility in the Middle East because they were dragging their feet on a ceasefire in Lebanon between Israel and Hizbollah guerrillas.

In an interview with the Egyptian magazine October, released on Thursday, Mubarak also said it would be impossible to implement quickly a UN resolution which requires Hizbollah to disarm - one of the steps Israel and the United States want to see in a political settlement of the month-old conflict.

He dismissed Washington's talk of "a new Middle East", saying it ignored what he called the real problem - the collapse of attempts at peace between Israelis and Palestinians.

"Foot-dragging on a ceasefire and the continuation of the Israeli aggression detract from the credibility of the United States and the West in the region," Mubarak said.

"The United States has not moved to a sufficient extent and with the necessary speed to contain the situation," he added.

Washington has said it takes time to negotiate lasting security arrangements for south Lebanon. Analysts and diplomats say the United States has been trying to give Israel more time to damage Hizbollah and claim military success.

Israel and the United States want the Lebanese army, backed by international forces, to move into south Lebanon and supervise the disarmament of Hizbollah - one of the steps envisaged in UN Security Council resolution 1559 of 2004.

Mubarak said: "Long months have passed without full implementation of resolution 1559. It is inconceivable that what was not achieved in past years and months could be achieved in the midst of the current crisis and within a few weeks."

"That will not happen by diktats contained in UN Security Council resolutions which lack balance, but by taking into account Lebanese realities and concerns," he added.

Regarding the "new Middle East" concept promoted by US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice early in the fighting, Mubarak said: "To talk about the 'new Middle East' or, before that, the 'Greater Middle East', ignores the real problem in the region, which is the suspension of the peace process."

"That leads to a rise in feelings of despair, frustration and extremism," he added.

The Egyptian state news agency MENA carried the complete text of the interview.

Bush, Cheney, Rice were involved in planning and supporting Israeli attack on Lebanon far in advance of the attack.

If Dick Cheney has his way, World War III is on the way. The man is insane.

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=80871&highlight=

BBB

Israeli and Lebanese Papers Respond to Ceasefire
Israeli and Lebanese Papers Respond to Ceasefire
By Suzanne Rosenberg
August 14, 2006

Two leading newspapers in the war-torn countries assess the current ceasefire -- and their futures. Clearly they disagree about "justice" in the conflict but share some dreams for the future as they report some residents returning, tentatively, to their homes.

A ceasefire for Israel and Lebanon is likely to be bittersweet even if it can hold. The surprisingly high numbers of dead, both civilian and military, are sure to arouse criticism within Israel about its military strategy and intelligence. For Lebanon, its very future and the role of Hezbollah within the country as well as the personal and public pain from the death and destruction of the war, and the anticipation of once again rebuilding, must appear overwhelming.

Both countries must be praying that their leaders and inhabitants can remain calm for the upcoming 24 to 48 hours and the ceasefire can come and stay.

How did two leading newspapers in the two countries cover the run-up to the ceasefire today, as judged by their popular Web sites?

--The Daily Star

The top headline in The Daily Star, Lebanon's only English language newspaper, as United Nations Resolution 1701 goes into effect is: "Exhausted Lebanon venture home as fighting ends." Another lead story reports that an 11th hour bid by Israel to crush Hezbollah killed four soldiers and 25 civilians just hours before the U.N. brokered ceasefire was due to take effect.

The paper also has a timeline of the July-August conflict and heart rending photos of hundreds of civilian casualties of the war as well as anti-Israeli and anti-war demonstrations.

A moving story about the last few desperate days of a family-owned bakery in Tyre which has weathered Israeli raids and the blockade to supply bread to the community -- but will run out of flour in the next day or two unless supplies can reach them either from Beirut or aid agencies -- illustrates just how difficult daily life has become south of Lebanon's Litani River.

Other articles report on Israeli damage to the Temple of Bacchus, mounting dissension within Israel over its conduct of the war, the production and price of Mideast oil, and the brief border opening between Egypt and Gaza to allow for travel and supplies. There's also an extremely laudatory story on the Lebanese civil defense and its performance during the Israeli offensive.

A full-sized banner announcing Free Speech in Lebanon is also floating in the center of the online Daily Star edition. This is a reminder that Lebanon is unusual in the region. The need to announce free speech, whether it is a defiant minority taking a stand, or just a statement of the paper's position on journalism, elicits both confusion and pride in the paper and for its owners and publishers.

In addition, an article in which the Lebanese middle class reveals that it is disillusioned with America, and another which suggests that Bush had no right to back Israel, both suggest that prior to the conflict the Lebanese had high hopes for their status as American allies.

Finally, a number of articles and editorials try to assess Lebanon's future appear. Among these is an editorial which contends that Lebanon can emerge stronger from the crucible of war, another which suggests that Lebanon must insist on separating itself from the rest of the Middle East and still another which speculates that if Ariel Sharon were dead, he'd be turning in his grave.

--Ha'aretz

On the Ha'aretz Web site this morning, the top headlines read, "IDF recommends quick pullout from south Lebanon" and "Five soldiers killed Sunday in clashes in Lebanon." Other headlines tell the story: "PM: We'll continue to hunt down Hezbollah leaders" and "Olmert vows probe into shortcomings of conflict" pretty much summarize the aftermath.

Haaretz has been strongly supportive of the war but has also showcased growing opposition. The paper's editorial today states that whatever the recriminations, in this war "justice is on our side."

But a guest column by Yuri Masgev concludes: "Over the past few days, the assumption has been raised - and not denied - that the operation for conquering the Litani River is meant to supply the people of Israel and their leaders with a 'victorious picture' before the battles end. When the son of the last dead soldier grows up and asks one day why his father died, it will be possible to reply that his father was the silver platter on which the Jewish state was given a photo-op."

One article announces the unspeakably sad news that the son of Israel's most famous novelist and peace activistm, David Grossman, died in the final push into Lebanon on Saturday night. His armored vehicle was hit by an anti tank weapon and Uri Grossman, 24, died instantly.

His father, along with Amos Oz and A.B. Yehoshua, just this Thursday had protested against the continued action of the Israeli Defense Forces as dangerous and counterproductive. In their joint news conference they stated, "Out of concern for the future of Israel and our place here, the fighting should be stopped now, to give a chance to negotiations." Grossman encouraged compromise with Lebanese Prime Minister Fouad Siniora saying, "This solution is the victory that Israel wanted." He was particularly concerned that any further offensive might trigger the further destabilization of the Lebanese government, and he said of this possibility, "It's still possible to prevent it," suggesting that "this is the last moment."

David Grossman is an Israeli and a child of a Holocaust refugee. I met him once and he is a lovely man. He has written numerous critically acclaimed novels about political and social issues as well as the 1987 novel, "The Yellow Wind," which was a sympathetic examination of Palestinians living under the Israeli occupation. He was an early advocate and spokesman for the Israeli peace movement.

Among the numerous online postings of condolences and notices to the Grossman family is an especially poignant note to David Grossman from a Georges in Beirut, Lebanon: "Sad, that so many good, peaceful people die in nonsense conflicts. My condolences to Mr. Grossman and all the victim's families on both sides. Hope one day, Lebanon, Israel and all the other Arab countries will be in Peace. That's my dream.
Peace, Shalom, Salam.

Both Israel and Lebanon appear to be holding their breath with the desperate hope that the cease fire will hold and that many of their dreams for the future might come true.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Suzanne Rosenberg ([email protected]) is a political scientist who teaches at Marymount College of Fordham University. One of her daughters was in Israel during part of the conflict.

Shebaa Farms occupies a pivotal spot in Mideast conflict
Shebaa Farms occupies a pivotal spot in Mideast conflict
By Matt Schofield
McClatchy Newspapers

Any lasting Israeli-Hezbollah cease fire will have to address the fraught question of who owns 14 abandoned orchards, pastures and mini-farms on the Syrian-Lebanese border with Israel known as Shebaa Farms.

Israel captured the 10 square-mile strip of sand and dust-tinted scrub brush from Syria during the Six Day War in 1967.

When Israel pulled its troops from southern Lebanon in 2000, it left some in Shebaa Farms on the theory that Hezbollah no longer had an excuse to attack them as occupying forces because Shebaa Farms belonged to Syria.

Israel proved wrong about Hezbollah, which has attacked the area more than 30 times since 2000 - and killed seven Israeli troops - 2000 on grounds that Shebaa Farms belongs to Lebanon.

And Syria agrees with Hezbollah.

While even Israelis say Shebaa Farms' strategic value is minimal, no one in the region is giving away any bargaining chips these days.

Seems Bushie et al will have to wait awhile longer for the Rapture Bush looks like a fool in denying the victory for Lebanon. The world knows better.

Israel pulls out of town; Hezbollah declares victory
By Warren P. Strobel and Shashank Bengali, Mcclatchy Newspapers | July 30, 2006

JERUSALEM -- Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah declared victory yesterday after Israel announced that it was withdrawing its forces from the southern Lebanese town of Bint Jbeil, where Israeli troops found unexpected difficulty in dislodging the guerrilla group from its strongholds. DUH.

| Breaking News Alerts Israel's Foreign Ministry spokesman, Mark Regev, defended the decision to pull troops from Bint Jbeil, saying Israel had accomplished its mission. But Nasrallah's declaration underscored the propaganda gains the Islamic militia is attempting to reap across the Muslim world as it battles Israeli forces.

``The Israelis are ready to halt the aggression because they are afraid of the unknown," Nasrallah said in a speech in which he also expressed measured support for the Lebanese government's efforts to reach a peace agreement.

On the 18th day of fighting, Hezbollah fired at least 39 rockets into Israel, wounding about a dozen people.

Israel continued its bombing campaign. An Israeli strike outside the market town of Nabatiyeh crushed a house, killing a woman and her five children, and a man in a nearby house, Lebanese security officials said. Elsewhere, six bodies were dug from the rubble of a house destroyed Friday in the town of Ain Arab, officials said.

An Israeli airstrike closed Lebanon's main crossing point to Syria yesterday for the first time since the conflict started, security officials said. Three airstrikes hit the road between Lebanese and Syrian immigration offices in the Masnaa area in the eastern Bekaa Valley, but on the Lebanese side of the border, they said. There were no casualties.

Israeli bombings also wounded two Indian peacekeepers at a United Nations observation post in southern Lebanon, days after an Israeli airstrike killed four UN observers.

Despite its intense bombardment of Lebanon -- and heavy ground fighting near the border -- Israel has been unable to stop the barrages of hundreds of Hezbollah rockets. Guerrillas fired at least 39 rockets into Israel yesterday, injuring five people.

Israel's pullback of its forces from Bint Jbeil ended the bloodiest siege in what has so far been only a limited ground incursion into southern Lebanon.

The weeklong battle underscored Israel's difficulty in pushing back guerrillas who have been preparing for years for this fight, building up arsenals and digging tunnels and shelters in caves.

The bombardment by Israeli forces and rocket fire from guerrillas was intense yesterday morning around the Hezbollah stronghold, Lebanese security officials said. But by the afternoon, Israel had withdrawn.

Major General Udi Adam, head of Israel's northern command, said Israel never intended to get ``stuck in one place." He said the real mission -- ``to destroy infrastructure and kill terrorists" -- had been a success.

Eighteen soldiers were killed in Bint Jbeil -- nine of them in Hezbollah ambushes Wednesday, the military's worst one-day loss in the campaign. Adam said dozens of guerrillas were killed in the week of fighting, but Hezbollah contends only 35 deaths since the conflict began.

Israeli troops still hold Maroun al-Ras, a nearby village, as well as the high ground above Bint Jbeil, Adam said.

At least 458 Lebanese have been killed in the fighting, according to a Health Ministry count Friday based on the number of bodies in hospitals, plus yesterday's deaths. Some estimates are as high as 600 dead, with many bodies buried in rubble.

Thirty-three Israeli troops have died, and Hezbollah rocket attacks on northern Israel have killed 19 civilians, the Israeli army said.

The conflict began when Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers and killed three others during a cross-border raid July 12. Israel launched an immediate response, bombing Beirut and southern Lebanon and vowing to destroy Hezbollah militarily before it would cease fire.

They really know how to play fair don't they? Hundreds of Lebanese killed and thousands more displaced, because three Israelis were killed. I fail to see how American 'so-called-Christian' BornAgains can support this atrocity. I completely agree that BushCo planned this one -but it backfired on them. Their credibility in the world is batting zero.

Material from the Associated Press and Reuters was included in this report.

© Copyright 2006 Globe Newspaper Company.

GOD'S CHOSEN PEOPLE

We could not acknowledge the South-African apartheid government, and neither did we acknowledge the Afghan Taliban government. Also, many of us did not acknowledge Saddam Hussein's Iraq, nor the ethnic cleansing of the Serbian government. Now we have to get used to that Israeli Government is history as well. We do not believe in the idea that anybody is 'God's chosen people'. We laugh of this idea and cry over their misdeeds. To behave as God's chosen people is not only stupid and arrogant, but a crime against humanity. We call that racism.

congress

In Israel, politicians begin review of war's conduct
Posted on Mon, Aug. 14, 2006
In Israel, politicians begin review of war's conduct
By Carol Rosenberg
McClatchy Newspapers

JERUSALEM - The guns had barely fallen silent Monday when a bitter Israeli postmortem began on the monthlong conflict with Hezbollah, with politicians on the right protesting that the military had stopped too soon and left-wingers complaining that the fighting had gone on too long.

Prime Minister Ehud Olmert declared a victory of sorts in a speech before the Knesset, Israel's parliament. He acknowledged shortcomings in how the conflict had been managed and assigned his defense minister to investigate. "We won't hide or sweep anything under the rug," he pledged, but said "we don't have the luxury" to engage in endless bickering.

Bicker they did, however. Left-wing opposition parliamentarian Zahava Gal-On was ejected from the chamber during the prime minister's speech for demanding Olmert's resignation. "What kind of victory are you talking about?" she shouted. "You are a failure."

On the right, parliamentarian Effie Eytam said that once the soldiers were home, both political and military decision-makers should be investigated.

Likely topics include how successive Israeli governments allowed Hezbollah to become so mighty on the northern border, whether Israeli forces were hobbled by logistical snafus in Lebanon and whether reservists were ill-prepared for the fight.

"The shooting war is over; now the political war begins," said Israeli historian Michael Oren, an army major who was called up for duty as military spokesman.

In terms of military management, he said, Israelis no doubt would clamor for an examination of whether the reserves were properly prepared. While Israel waged a mostly air battle against Hezbollah for two weeks, thousands of reserve soldiers underwent three to four days of refresher training before being dispatched to fight in Lebanon. For some it was the first training in more than two years.

Debate also is likely to focus on logistical failures, which were the subject of Israeli newspaper reports throughout the fighting.

One account described how reservists from the storied Alexandroni battalion - led by a young Ariel Sharon in the 1948 War of Independence- went without food and water for 36 hours. To survive, they chewed sugarcane and sucked the juice from watermelons they found in Lebanese fields.

"That is one of the scandals of this war - one of many," wrote Nahum Barnea, senior political analyst at the Yediot Ahronot newspaper, who traveled with the reserve unit in Lebanon.

Barnea also wrote that the military failed to transport the reservists to the front.

"When the soldiers arrived after their call-up orders there were no buses to pick them up," he wrote, so they drove their own cars north "to not miss the war."

When they reached their supply lockers, where their equipment was supposed to be prepositioned, the reservists found that their dust goggles had been sent to active-duty troops in Gaza, Barnea wrote.

Labor parliament member Dani Yatom, a former chief of Israel's Mossad intelligence service, said the problems would have to be investigated because, if true, they were unacceptable.

"I participated in every Israeli war since 1963 and never, not even in the Yom Kippur war, did we lack food, lack water," said Yatom, a retired general who served in Israel's special forces.

Yatom, whose Labor party is a partner in Olmert's government, also raised questions about the government's response to civilians, who were subjected to weeks of Hezbollah rocket fire.

"There were many mistakes done, concerning the handling of the war, and concerning the attitude toward the citizens of Israel who had to stay in shelters," he said.

The discussion was especially pointed in parliament, where many members are military veterans.

Gal-On, a member of the opposition party Meretz, which had supported the aerial war but opposed the ground offensive, was among three opposition parliamentarians who were ejected from the chamber for jeering at the prime minister during his speech.

Later, the 50-year-old former army sergeant complained that the fighting had gone on too long, didn't rescue the two reservists that Hezbollah captured in Israel on July 12 to trigger the conflict and, at latest count, cost the country 118 dead and 450 wounded soldiers.

"They promised to bring back the soldiers. They promised to break the Hezbollah, and they did neither," she said. "They should have left after the first week."

On the right, Eytam, who commanded a company during the Yom Kippur war in 1973 and led an elite commando unit in the 1976 Entebbe rescue mission in Uganda, said the military left before the mission was accomplished.

"Everybody in this country understands that this cease-fire will not hold for a long time," he said. Then, echoing Gal-On's complaints, he added, "Hezbollah hasn't been disarmed. The hostages didn't come back."

In the official response to Olmert's speech, opposition leader Benjamin Netanyahu said that successive governments had mismanaged the Hezbollah conflict by allowing the militant Islamic movement to amass thousands of rockets near the border. He said Olmert had mismanaged the home front by leaving Israelis inside ill-equipped shelters for a month.

For left-wing parliamentarian Ran Cohen, the issue was how the Olmert government had allowed itself to be dragged into a conflict on what he characterized as Hezbollah's timetable. Sharon, Olmert's predecessor who was disabled by a stroke in January, had avoided such provocations, Cohen said. He added that Sharon would have fought Hezbollah at a time of Israel's choosing.

Sharon's legacy looms large over the conflict. It was as defense minister in 1982 that he launched the 1982-85 invasion that gave birth to the Hezbollah movement and spawned a troubled 18-year Israeli occupation in the south.

As the parliamentary debate raged, the doctors treating Sharon, who's been in a coma since his stroke, announced that the 78-year-old former general's condition had worsened.
----------------------------------------------

Rosenberg reports for The Miami Herald.

Nice to see that the turnover to McClatchy hasn't resulted in a diminishment of this office's extraordinary reporting.

setanta

Really tough to parse precisely what is going on and who is manipulating or co-ordinating with whom. The neoconservative contingent in Washington and in the media have been explicitly pushing for a broadened military action on the part of the US and Israel to include Syria and Iran. Krauthammer and Kristol are portraying Olmert as a sissy Democrat or, perhaps, as a new instance of Harriet Myers. Pretty likely, Hersch has it right in placing Elliot Abrams and Addington in the same war-mongering camp.

Hersch makes good sense in his piece when he points to the military lessons that miht be gleaned from an air campaign against Lebanon. That would be the way the Pentagon would think. Like testing out new systems and equipment in south/central America using the "War on Drugs" as a convenient theatre. And, given the billions in military aid flowing from US tax dollars to Israel, not to mention military and intel linkages between the two states, I'd guess the chances that Israel would move militarily in such a manner as they did, without discussion/agreement with Washington to be precisely zero.

I think also we ought not to discount the possibility, or liklihood, that the timing of Israel's campaign is associated with the mid-term elections. What can the Republicans do outside of the predictable a)try to paint dems as weak/confused/feminine, b)get out the base, c)rig state voting regs so as to suppress dem voters, and d)try to rebuild the fear component? (and e), maybe, to rig some voting machines)

Because this administration has lost the trust of most Americans (not to mention the rest of the world) particularly as regards their voiced policy of military pre-emption, initiating another war now would be a PR/marketing task I don't think they could pull off without decimating their power in the coming elections. It would certainly make sense to have their client state do the dirty work. Setting to war without Congressional approval would make the present constitutional crisis much more acute. Likely, a lot of Republicans, particularly those in electoral jeopardy or with integrity, would push back hard. I think they still might try this...setting to war and bypassing Congress... because I think they are possibly that crazy and because so much would be perceived to be at risk with a loss of congressional control.

My suggestion throughout, Mr. Mountie, is that the timing is very suspicious. It is almost 15 years since Isreali withdrew its major forces from the Lebanon. It is six years since they withdrew "completely" (while hanging onto the Shebaa Farms, which is a territory originally dispued as between the Lebanon and Syria, and never previously occupied by Israel). In that period of time, Hezbollah has frequently raided across the border in the attempt to seize members of the IDF, and occasionally succeeded. In that period of time, Hezbollah has occasionally indulged in a desultory bombardment of Israel with the short-range missiles of which the media make so hysterically much. But Israel has never reacted in the past as it has this time. That is why i consider that Isreal has long had contingency planning, and that Olmert misjudged the public reaction to Gaza, and thought that now was the time to act, in the belief that the United States could be drawn into a regional conflict.

The timing is what is suspicious to me. The rightwingnut "defense of their people" argument falls flat in the face of the evidence that Isreal has long tolerated similar actions by Hezbollah--until now.

set

Yup, I'm right with you on this. I think, from what I've read, that Sharon exerted a pretty firm control over Israel's military actions and with him gone, it may be that Olmert's advisors or the more hawkish element in the IDF concluded that Bush's growing weakness meant a much smaller window to bring the US further in militarily and so pushed hard on Olmert to get what they wanted. Pity we can't believe any of these fukks to tell the truth.