The Trinity in 5 verses flat

Wolf_ODonnell wrote:

real life wrote:
Wolf_ODonnell wrote:
The New Testament books were chosen solely for their purpose in presenting the Trinitarian Doctrine.

I thought your position was that the Bible did not present Christ as God? So now you are saying it does, but you simply disagree?

Not quite. The Old Testament definitely does not present God as a Trinity. I am merely suggesting that the authority of the Trinity in this matter is not as absolute as you would think it.

Actually Wolf the O.T. definitely does present God as a US, and a OUR.
God is a more than just one being. This will be in my post when I get it done. but right now I am doing research plus I can not type for too long till my wrists start to hurt. Bad wrists. Sad

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xingu wrote:

Wolf wrote:
The Old Testament definitely does not present God as a Trinity.

It seems that Trinity, as with a lot of Christian beliefs, comes from paganism.

http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/Contents/doctrine/The%20Origin%20of%20the%20Trinity.htm

Quite right. Although I would spell christian with the lower case 'c'.

Scott777ab wrote:

Wolf_ODonnell wrote:
real life wrote:
Wolf_ODonnell wrote:
The New Testament books were chosen solely for their purpose in presenting the Trinitarian Doctrine.

I thought your position was that the Bible did not present Christ as God? So now you are saying it does, but you simply disagree?

Not quite. The Old Testament definitely does not present God as a Trinity. I am merely suggesting that the authority of the Trinity in this matter is not as absolute as you would think it.

Actually Wolf the O.T. definitely does present God as a US, and a OUR.
God is a more than just one being. This will be in my post when I get it done. but right now I am doing research plus I can not type for too long till my wrists start to hurt. Bad wrists.

Be careful not to be deceived by misusing the word elohim. And don't forget that the universe was well populated by the time humans were created, hence the expression "let us make man in our image". (Genesis 1:26)

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Neo,

What was the universe populated with? Shocked

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Angels demons, god, animals......he could mean anything here, there are just to many theories

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Momma Angel wrote:

Neo,

What was the universe populated with?

"Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth?
Tell [me], if you do know understanding.

5 Who set its measurements, in case you know,
Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line?

6 Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down,
Or who laid its cornerstone,
7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together,
And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?
(Job 38: 4-7)

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Uh, ok. Would you mind putting that into some words I can understand? I don't get where those verses are telling what the universe is populated with. I'd appreciate some clarification.

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Momma Angel wrote:

Uh, ok. Would you mind putting that into some words I can understand? I don't get where those verses are telling what the universe is populated with. I'd appreciate some clarification.

HMM, once again, with emphasis

"Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth?
Tell [me], if you do know understanding.

5 Who set its measurements, in case you know,
Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line?

6 Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down,
Or who laid its cornerstone,
7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together,
And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?" (Job 38: 4-7)

Correct me if the citation does not refer to angels.

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Neo,

When you said populated the universe I took that to mean the earth and all the planets. I, of course, know that there were angels in heaven.

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Truthfully, I believe the root of the word populated does have something to do with humans and not spirits. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

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No problem, Neo. I kind of figured it was just a misunderstanding on my part.

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Scott777ab wrote:

Actually Wolf the O.T. definitely does present God as a US, and a OUR.
God is a more than just one being. This will be in my post when I get it done. but right now I am doing research plus I can not type for too long till my wrists start to hurt. Bad wrists.

Oh dear. Sounds like carpal tunnel syndrome or bad wrists. I hope you get better.

Oh and I'd like to see the evidence to prove this.

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Gensis Chapter one

Gen 1:26 And God (@ELOHIM) said, Let <<<<us>>> make man in <<<our>>> image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

There is your US and your OUR

@ ELOHIM note: Can be translated as god or gods.
So the verse can actually read

Gen 1:26 And Gods said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

But also in the bible ELOHIM says he is the only one and there is no other.
So there is only one ELOHIM (god with god)
and the word was with God
and the word was God.
God with God.
Smile

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Scott777ab wrote:

Gensis Chapter one

Gen 1:26 And God (@ELOHIM) said, Let <<<<us>>> make man in <<<our>>> image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

There is your US and your OUR

@ ELOHIM note: Can be translated as god or gods.
So the verse can actually read

Gen 1:26 And Gods said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

But also in the bible ELOHIM says he is the only one and there is no other.
So there is only one ELOHIM (god with god)
and the word was with God
and the word was God.
God with God.

You apparently missed my explanation given to MA here. Also, you seem to have missed the fact that the word elohim is also applied to false gods or goddesses. Examples:
1Sa 5:7b (Dagon);
1Ki 11:5 (Ashtoreth);
Da 1:2b (Marduk).

You really need to do more research. Perhaps you should consult with real life, a fine fellow. He's wrong about Jesus' divinity, of course; but I'd invite him to the barbecue any day.

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Neo,

I guess I still don't understand when you say things like "wrong about Jesus' divinity." Are yu saying that Jesus is not divine at all? He is not deity? You do not believe that Jesus is God? Will check back tomorrow!

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Momma Angel wrote:

Neo,

I guess I still don't understand when you say things like "wrong about Jesus' divinity." Are yu saying that Jesus is not divine at all? He is not deity? You do not believe that Jesus is God? Will check back tomorrow!

Judging from his last post, I think he thinks the latter. He rejects the Trinitarian Doctrine.

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Thanks, Wolfie. The fact that Jesus has a divine nature does not make him equal to God.

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neologist wrote:

This from someone claiming that firstborn doesn't mean first born and only begotten, doesn't mean begotten.

Well, Neo, it is undeniable that the scripture refers to several folks as 'firstborn' who weren't born first in their family. Why do you think that is?

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Name a few and we'll discuss. . .

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Neo,

I guess I am still not understanding you completely. Do you believe that Jesus is God or don't you? I understand you don't believe in the trinity, i.e., God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. I believe you believe that Jesus is the Son of God? Is that correct? Sorry for my confusion.

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Jesus was the first born of all creation. He is the image of God. He was given the power to create and, in fact, all things were created through him. He was willing to come to earth and die as a perfect man in order to redeem mankind from the sin of Adam. He was not forced to do so.

All he really needed to do on our behalf was to live a perfect human life and die. The suffering and humiliation heaped on him by Satan was in an attempt by Satan to prove that he could break the integrity of any of God's creatures. Jesus, being the highest, was the one most appropriate to meet this challenge. It could not have been done if Jesus were God, as it would be axiomatic for God to have integrity toward himself.

This is also the reason the Magdalene story cannot be true. There were two ways Jesus could produce a perfect human race. One would be to father offspring, for a perfect human could not father imperfect children. The other was to give his perfect life in exchange for Adam. The first choice would mean SOL for us. The second is the reason we have intense love for Jesus and all the more reason to worship Jehovah.

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The Trinity in 5 verses flat

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