But They Can't Find Bin Laden

username wrote:

Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!
Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!
Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!
Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!
Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!
-Intrepid

Intrepid has produced possibly the finest sentence I have seen on this topic since our greasy administration took office.

Hey, no kidding. I didn't think about that sentence like that the first time around.

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Brandon9000 wrote:

The fact is that at the time of the invasion it was absolutely unclear whether Hussein had finally destroyed his WMD and development programs or had merely hidden them better.

Baloney.

The inspectors were actively engaged in finding out if there WMD's, and Bush stopped them in mid-task.

Keep dancing, Brandon. You are trying to say that Bush had no choice but to go on the evidence given him and invade, and you are full of it. He HAD additional evidence-the inspectors. And because their evidence was pointing in the direction of NOT invading, Bush put an end to their mission.

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cicerone imposter wrote:

Intrepid wrote:
Civilized people don't kill people on speculation!!!!!!

Especially when Saddam was controlled by our No Fly Zones, and the UN Inspectors were looking for those very WMDs without hinderance that eventually proved not to exist.

To kill thousands of people under those circumstances is a crime against humanity. I want to see Bush and his administration found guilty, and for them to spend the rest of their natural lives in Gitmo.

A lot of countries go to war merely because they think it's to their advantage, as opposed to this case in which the president invaded Iraq to resolve a potential lethal danger to America and the West.

The statement that civilized people don't use force to defend themselves against any danger, no matter how grave, that is less than 100% certain is quite mistaken. Saddam Hussein was an evil dictator, who had the weapons, and programs to perfect them, and had spent years trying to thwart the weapons inspectors. It would have been a terrible, terrible mistake to take the chance that he had finally decided to destroy his weapons and tell the truth, in the absence of strong evidence that it was so.

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Brandon continues to live in a fantasy world by his writing:
'...the president invaded Iraq to resolve a potential lethal danger to America and the West."

Saddam was never a threat to the US or anybody else; he didn't have the weapons or the means to deliver them. How many times must we repeat that the experts reported that Saddam did not have WMDs before and during the second war? "Potential lethal danger" does not justify attacking a country and killing thousands of their innocent citizens.

The real potental danger today rests in North Korea, Iran, and China - and the US. Wake up and smell the coffee. You might learn something valuable.

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Quote:

A lot of countries go to war merely because they think it's to their advantage, as opposed to this case in which the president invaded Iraq to resolve a potential lethal danger to America and the West.

This is the funniest thing that I've read in a long time Very Happy

Cycloptichorn

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Brandon9000 wrote:

Saddam Hussein was an evil dictator, who had the weapons,

He didn't have them. Even you admitted that he didn't have them. Now you're back to saying he did.

This is unbelievable.

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Yeah, the war in Iraq is a real advantage for the US. We just still don't know how many more lives it'll cost and the treasury it will cost the American taxpayers.

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If we can only get all our president to take these advantages, it'll make people like Brandon very happy.

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Do I have to emphasize the important words in Intrepid's post so Brandon can think about them and try to realize why his position is so immoral? All right, I will

CIVILIZED people don't KILL people on SPECULATION.

One of the points the chauvinists make about America is that we are civilized and of noble purpose. Civilized people make sure their actions are based on fact, not speculation. Bush speculated. The inspections were working. They were finding everything that was there--nothing. Bush, who from all the available published evidence intended to invade Iraq anyway, no matter what was there (and Paul Wolfowitz, in a speech to a sympathetic audience several months after the invasion, which I read about then but unfortunately didn't save, said that WMDs were pretty much just an excuse they figured they could sell to the public for going to war, and not their real objective--which was to remake the Middle East into something more to our liking). Bush ordered the inspectors out. He's never liked talking much. He's always gone for the big stick, for bulling his way through anybody that disagrees with him. Unfortunately those who disagree with him are almost always right, and he's almost always wrong. As subsequent events consistently prove.

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The experts that disagreed with Bush are all gone. The only ones that survive are "yes" men/women. Unfortunately, the generals that are still active have not been responsible to the foot soldiers by ensuring that they have enough troops and equipment.

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Brandon9000 wrote:

Saddam Hussein was an evil dictator, who had the weapons, and programs to perfect them, and had spent years trying to thwart the weapons inspectors. It would have been a terrible, terrible mistake to take the chance that he had finally decided to destroy his weapons and tell the truth, in the absence of strong evidence that it was so.

But Bush WAS getting the evidence that they were destroyed, and he purposely cut the process short!

For the first time, the inspectors had UNFETTERED access to any and all properties in Iraq. The US could never agree to such a thing on our own soil-it would be unconstitutional. But we got the Iraqis to agree to it. And the inspectors were in the process of finding out what happened to any WMD's which might have existed.

Saddam COULDN'T have deployed any weapons while the inspectors were interviewing virtually anyone with any degree of expertise in the subject, interviewing any public official within the field, checking every warehouse that any satellite photo showed any suspicious activity. Trained people were simply tearing the country apart looking for the weapons.

In fact, Hans Blix was openly asking the Bush Administration to supply him with a list of the sites they wanted checked. Bush Administration officials had said they knew where the sites were-Blix asked for the list. The whole damn country was open for our inspection.

Brandon, your theory that Bush had no choice but to invade is ridiculous. He had the whole damn country open to look for those weapons. And his advisors were telling him they knew where they were-well, why didn't they point them out to Blix so he could go over and look?

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It's Brandon's 10% rule.

"If there is a 10% chance of an evil madman having WMD then we have to take him out."

Of course when I pointed out the US has WMD and there is a 10% chance that Bush is an evil madman he failed to respond.

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kelticwizard wrote:

Brandon9000 wrote:
Saddam Hussein was an evil dictator, who had the weapons, and programs to perfect them, and had spent years trying to thwart the weapons inspectors. It would have been a terrible, terrible mistake to take the chance that he had finally decided to destroy his weapons and tell the truth, in the absence of strong evidence that it was so.

But Bush WAS getting the evidence that they were destroyed, and he purposely cut the process short!

For the first time, the inspectors had UNFETTERED access to any and all properties in Iraq. The US could never agree to such a thing on our own soil-it would be unconstitutional. But we got the Iraqis to agree to it. And the inspectors were in the process of finding out what happened to any WMD's which might have existed.

Saddam COULDN'T have deployed any weapons while the inspectors were interviewing virtually anyone with any degree of expertise in the subject, interviewing any public official within the field, checking every warehouse that any satellite photo showed any suspicious activity. Trained people were simply tearing the country apart looking for the weapons.

In fact, Hans Blix was openly asking the Bush Administration to supply him with a list of the sites they wanted checked. Bush Administration officials had said they knew where the sites were-Blix asked for the list. The whole damn country was open for our inspection.

Brandon, your theory that Bush had no choice but to invade is ridiculous. He had the whole damn country open to look for those weapons. And his advisors were telling him they knew where they were-well, why didn't they point them out to Blix so he could go over and look?

You have a short memory when it comes to the days leading up to the war. We didn't have "unfettered" access to Iraq for investigations. He did hinder the inspectors many times and in several different way. He would hold up inspectors at sites causing them to wait for chaperones. He said he couldn't vouch for the safety of U2 spy planes when we wanted to fly more then one plane at a time. He wouldn't even let them fly over his country without letting us know what time they would be flying and where they were going to be flying to. He wouldn't let his scientists be interviewed by themselves without one of his people there listening in on it. Hans Blix made the comment that Saddam had one of the best record keeping countries in the Middle East and for all it was worth we couldn't find evidence that he had destroyed the WMD's. Don't forget about the fighter jets that we found buried in the desert after the war, we didn't know they were there. How about the missiles that we found that he wasn't supposed to have because they broke the distance limit that was put on him by the UN. He didn't even admit to having the missiles at the time, the inspectors found them and then he almost refused to have them destroyed. It was only because of threat of attack that we got were we did. Why didn't he let in inspectors the 6 or 7 years before all this came about?

We know now that he doesn't have the weapons but we also don't know what he did with them. That is still a case in point. We haven't found any records on what was done with them. There is still a chance that they exist but we don't know where. I believe we were right in attacking and removing him from power but the job there is done now. It is starting to become a civil war and this is evident in the number of deaths that happen now. More and more civilians are dying at the hands of the terrorists and or rebels then before. Less and less US troops are being killed and it is time to pull out. This doesn't mean we can't continue to provide some sort of support to the current govt. There are still missions to be completed and some people to catch but for the most part we have done what we came there to do.

I have already said too many of my friends here in Afghanistan that if I am to be deployed again that I want to go to Iraq. I will even request it if I have to when the time comes. Until then we are containing our search here for bin Laden and I know this because I see helicopters leave the flight line everyday and I know all of the crews in the Chinooks that are taking troops to the mountains here in Kandahar. We still look and we will find him, it is just a matter of turning over the right rock.

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Brandon9000 wrote:

Amigo wrote:
What if? Overnight everything there was to be known about Bush, Bin laden, The war and 9/11 came out? the whole truth? Really think about that.

Would the whole world kind of just fall back into their chairs in shock. I wonder what the wildest senario could be?

Bush was surprised by 9/11 like everyone else. The CIA has standing orders to find bin Laden, but hasn't suceeded. No conspiracy.

The only thing that surprised Chicken george on 9-11 was the shock in hearing that pRes Dick and uncle Rummy had conducted an actual terrorist act instead of the fake one recommended in Operation Northwoods.

That's the reason that when it registered in that slow moving, shriveled brain what had actually taken place, ole Chicken George hopped on Air Force One and skipped out. That old boy was leaving the country! The only thing that stopped him was pRes Dick ordering AF One back to DC.

In order to do that they had to sedate the little Chicken...... who managed to come out of it enough to read a stupid statement that one of the goons had written that evening. Then he went on the mother of all drunks. That's the reason you didn't see that fool again for 3 days.

By the time the 14th rolled around, they had not only sobered that drunken slob up but had zapped him with a whole lotta brainwashing. The brainwashing is still working. pRes Dick set about maintaining the brainwashing by only allowing the sworn faithful to attend "bu$h" events. The Jesus freaks cheered & cheered every time their little dictator appeared to bestow upon them some of his famous smirks. That's the only thing they will ever get from chicken george. He's looking out for his base........the top 15% who keep lining his pockets with gold. The hell with those silly brainwashed Jerry Falwell christians!

So Chicken george was set upon an un-suspecting world confident that he was loved from sea to shining sea. No matter what vile thing pRes Dick and Uncle Rummy ordered him to do, the poor fool believed that he was loved like no other man on earth.

UNTIL Stephen Colbert faced him down a week or so ago with the unvarnished "Truthiness".

That was the second great shock of his ill-gotten pResidency.

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I hope you get your wish....

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Brandon9000 wrote:

cicerone imposter wrote:
There's nothing "probable" about WMDs in Iraq. Most of the experts have declared none existed untiil the UN inspectors were chased out by Bush to start his war. Your problem is very simple; you continue to believe the Bush/Cheney/Powell rhetoric that's been proven to be lies and innuendos.

It remains a true fact that at the time of invasion there was a non-neglibible probability that Iraq still had WMD and programs.

Bullschitt

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Baldimo wrote:

You have a short memory when it comes to the days leading up to the war. We didn't have "unfettered" access to Iraq for investigations.

We most certainly did. And everyone except last-gasp Bush supporters like Brandon and yourself admit it.

Baldimo wrote:

He [Saddam] did hinder the inspectors many times and in several different way.

Not in the final round, he didn't. What you say is simply untrue.

Baldimo wrote:

He would hold up inspectors at sites causing them to wait for chaperones.

There were NO chaperones in the final round of inspections.

Baldimo wrote:

He wouldn't let his scientists be interviewed by themselves without one of his people there listening in on it.

In the final round of inspections, not only were the scientists interviewed without any other Iraqs present, but they were removed from the country and interviewed on foreign soil, to prevent the Iraqis from finding out what they said.

Earlier in this thread, Brandon tried to answer to counter the fact that the inspectors were UNFETTERED in the final round, by quoting a report about problems the inspectors had-in 1997! Six years before the invasion, six years before the final round of inspections. Now Baldimo comes up with a list of things which happened in earlier rounds of inspections-but not in the final round.

Nobody is denying that Saddam tried to hold up the inspectors in earlier rounds. But with the troops building up in Kuwait, Saddam had no choice but to agree to completely unhindered inspections, where the inspectors simply decided to go where they wanted, WHEN they wanted, with no prior notice, and talk to anybody they wished alone,and even remove them from the country for the questioning period. This is fact, this is documented, there is no question on these issues.

But Brandon and Baldimo are going to supply us with reports of hindrances in previous rounds, trying to divert attention from the fact that in the final round, the inspections were unfettered-and they turned up nothing. Then Bush ordered the inspectors out so he can invade.

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But They Can't Find Bin Laden

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